empire actor allegedly attacked in hate crime (all charges dropped against smollett)
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:39 pm    Post subject:

Aussiesuede wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
Aussiesuede wrote:
splashmtn wrote:


He allowed the two black fellas to be arrested and never told the truth. They are now victims of him not telling the truth. he knew he set it all up, and he knew he paid them to do those things. he should've come clean. he put those guys in danger since we all know black men and run ins with the cops can be a shaky situation. so this is putting someone in danger. along with falsely allowing them to be accused when you set it all up.


The moment those 2 guys accepted money to commit a crime, they became criminals and criminals are always subject to arrest for their crimes. In Illinois, they could have been charged with a conspiracy to commit, but I reckon Law Enforcement agreed not to file charges, and called it even Steven, when they dropped the dime on Schmuckkets.

Also, Jesse could have been charged with Solicitation. The fact that he wasn't givess a likely clue to how all this will go down. A stern rebuke from the Judge, and some community service and probation. Schmuckkets is ultimately guilty of being Felony Stupid.


If Smollett didn’t tell them he was planning on filing a false police report, what crime did they commit?


Based on the information released, the "Assault" was to occur in front of a "Public" video camera so there was evidence of the battery. There is also footage of the 2 brothers purchasing the items to be used in the attempted scam. Together, that's clear knowledge of an intended intent to defraud, even if the party to be defrauded wasn't fully detailed. The proof of pre-planning also provides evidence of a conspiracy - which in Illinois has a fairly low threshold. (They've still not fully erased the laws they enacted to try to contain mobsters of the '20's & '30's)


None of that are crimes.
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:40 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


How she even has a job is embarrassing.
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adkindo
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 1:16 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


I have faith that one day you will understand and comprehend the post in which I responded with "straw man". The tweet posted was the definition of a partisan straw man argument.

I am not sure what Coulter is suggesting.....that "hate crimes" as defined by the law never happen or she simply is pointing out that she believes distinguishing a criminal act as a "hate crime" is flawed logic. That said, while they definitely are not all hoaxes....hate crime hoaxes are far more common than the common narrative suggests....and have been even more common in recent years....and many since 2016 have been an attempt to make the current White House and/or its supporters look bad. To name a few that gained national and international coverage in recent years....

Michael Ron David Kadar - 2015-2016
Georgia Nathaniel Stang - 11/2016
Yasmin Seweid - 12/2016
Jalen Mitchell - 02/2017
Azhar Hussain - 04/2017
Dauntarius Williams - 10/17
Adwoa Lewis - 09/2018
Kissie Ram - 01/2019

Hate crime hoaxes are more common than you think - USA Today 02/22/2019

Hate crime hoaxes not rare - The Oklahoman 02/22/2019

Again, I am not suggesting crimes against people because of their race, sexual preference, etc. do not happen in America....they do and always have. I am suggesting to you that these "hoaxes" with racial and sexual overtones have been a part of the picture for decades...Tawana Brawley, the 1993 Oberlin Arch defacing, the Duke lacrosse team....and have only got more common in recent years.
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 1:32 pm    Post subject:

^ Of course they have. Is someone suggesting they don’t happen? We also don’t know how many crimes currently cateogrized as hate crimes are actually hoaxes or perhaps not a crime of hate at all.

There is so much incentive to fake being a victim of many things. Workers comp, other insurance claims, fame and celebrity. It doesn’t happen often, but it does happen more than people realize.

(EDIT: Pretty sure Coulter, whom I am not a fan at all of, was just doing the same thing leftists do but in reverse. Not condoning it, don't condone it when the leftists do it, so it's pretty awful all around. We spent a long time trying not to paint with a broad brush and the extremists are doing it more and more. Sad.)
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Omar Little
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:31 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


How she even has a job is embarrassing.


Maybe because she says straight out what so many believe and they love her for it?
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:35 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


I have faith that one day you will understand and comprehend the post in which I responded with "straw man". The tweet posted was the definition of a partisan straw man argument.

I am not sure what Coulter is suggesting.....that "hate crimes" as defined by the law never happen or she simply is pointing out that she believes distinguishing a criminal act as a "hate crime" is flawed logic. That said, while they definitely are not all hoaxes....hate crime hoaxes are far more common than the common narrative suggests....and have been even more common in recent years....and many since 2016 have been an attempt to make the current White House and/or its supporters look bad. To name a few that gained national and international coverage in recent years....

Michael Ron David Kadar - 2015-2016
Georgia Nathaniel Stang - 11/2016
Yasmin Seweid - 12/2016
Jalen Mitchell - 02/2017
Azhar Hussain - 04/2017
Dauntarius Williams - 10/17
Adwoa Lewis - 09/2018
Kissie Ram - 01/2019

Hate crime hoaxes are more common than you think - USA Today 02/22/2019

Hate crime hoaxes not rare - The Oklahoman 02/22/2019

Again, I am not suggesting crimes against people because of their race, sexual preference, etc. do not happen in America....they do and always have. I am suggesting to you that these "hoaxes" with racial and sexual overtones have been a part of the picture for decades...Tawana Brawley, the 1993 Oberlin Arch defacing, the Duke lacrosse team....and have only got more common in recent years.


She's not suggesting anything. She's straight up saying all claims of hate crimes are hoaxes.
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:38 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


How she even has a job is embarrassing.


Maybe because she says straight out what so many believe and they love her for it?


I don't think they love her for it. I don't even think that many people like her.

The never trumpers obviously don't.

And the always trumper don't either since she speaks out against him.

That's mostly why I'm surprised she even gets gigs at all.
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adkindo
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:40 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


How she even has a job is embarrassing.


Maybe because she says straight out what so many believe and they love her for it?


does she have a "job"? Maybe she is a columnist for a media outlet I am unaware of...but I thought she just wrote books and made random media appearances with her buddy Bill Maher.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:42 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


How she even has a job is embarrassing.


Maybe because she says straight out what so many believe and they love her for it?


does she have a "job"? Maybe she is a columnist for a media outlet I am unaware of...but I thought she just wrote books and made random media appearances with her buddy Bill Maher.


Her job technically is public appearances and media appearances and books. But her real job is political whip of the base.
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:51 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


How she even has a job is embarrassing.


Maybe because she says straight out what so many believe and they love her for it?


does she have a "job"? Maybe she is a columnist for a media outlet I am unaware of...but I thought she just wrote books and made random media appearances with her buddy Bill Maher.


Her job technically is public appearances and media appearances and books. But her real job is political whip of the base.


Which base? She’s been bagging on Trump for a while now no?
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:57 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
Which base? She’s been bagging on Trump for a while now no?


she definitely is not popular with traditional establishment Republicans, nor does she try to be.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:59 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Which base? She’s been bagging on Trump for a while now no?


she definitely is not popular with traditional establishment Republicans, nor does she try to be.


Yeah. I now consider myself center/right, (used to be center:left) so ovviously I know a lot of conservatives across the spectrum. I don’t know a single one who has good things to say about Ann Coulter.

Maybe that’s why she doesn’t have a regular job. Lol
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:01 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


How she even has a job is embarrassing.


Maybe because she says straight out what so many believe and they love her for it?


does she have a "job"? Maybe she is a columnist for a media outlet I am unaware of...but I thought she just wrote books and made random media appearances with her buddy Bill Maher.


Her job technically is public appearances and media appearances and books. But her real job is political whip of the base.


Which base? She’s been bagging on Trump for a while now no?


Yes and no. She repeatedly comes home, then goes off, then comes back. In many ways shes a public advisor to the president from his base.
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:05 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Ann Coulter

@AnnCoulter
Alright, this particular hate crime turned out to be a hoax, but let's remember, ALL OF THEM are hoaxes. #Smollett


Another strike against adkindo's "straw man" claim.


How she even has a job is embarrassing.


Maybe because she says straight out what so many believe and they love her for it?


does she have a "job"? Maybe she is a columnist for a media outlet I am unaware of...but I thought she just wrote books and made random media appearances with her buddy Bill Maher.


Her job technically is public appearances and media appearances and books. But her real job is political whip of the base.


Which base? She’s been bagging on Trump for a while now no?


Yes and no. She repeatedly comes home, then goes off, then comes back. In many ways shes a public advisor to the president from his base.


I don’t know about that. She just called the only national emergency that our president is an idiot. Lol.

If she were an advisor, she’d been fired long ago based on Trumps history.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:05 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
adkindo wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Which base? She’s been bagging on Trump for a while now no?


she definitely is not popular with traditional establishment Republicans, nor does she try to be.


Yeah. I now consider myself center/right, (used to be center:left) so ovviously I know a lot of conservatives across the spectrum. I don’t know a single one who has good things to say about Ann Coulter.

Maybe that’s why she doesn’t have a regular job. Lol


Her lack of a regular job is paying her a fortune. She's also got the guts to just say it instead of playing semantic passive aggressive games around it.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:14 pm    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
ContagiousInspiration wrote:
One of the brothers was Jussies drug dealer even


Dug dealer in the 4 page writing.

Jussie Smollett bond proffer.

LINK


Little chance for the defense to prove it was two other guys. I thought Smollett might have been able to thrown the two brothers under bus but with all that video evidence and records of calls and texts prior to and after the attack it doesn't look good. He was supposedly on the phone with his manager at the time and the manager waited more than 20 minutes to call the police. The manager was likely involved too. CPD should pull him in for questioning and see if he gives up Jussie too.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:36 pm    Post subject:

No Prison For Texas Teen Who Lied About Being Raped By 3 Black Men

A North Texas teenager who falsely claimed she was kidnapped and raped by three black men last March will likely serve no prison time.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:28 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
No Prison For Texas Teen Who Lied About Being Raped By 3 Black Men

A North Texas teenager who falsely claimed she was kidnapped and raped by three black men last March will likely serve no prison time.



Good find. However, this was a plea deal. Plea deals are pretty much subjective to the DA making the deal.

The question is, if there’s no plea deal, if Smollett was found guilty, would he get prison time.

There’s no denying that Smollett could make a plea deal where he confesses and shows remorse for a reduced sentence with no prison time.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:31 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
No Prison For Texas Teen Who Lied About Being Raped By 3 Black Men

A North Texas teenager who falsely claimed she was kidnapped and raped by three black men last March will likely serve no prison time.



Good find. However, this was a plea deal. Plea deals are pretty much subjective to the DA making the deal.

The question is, if there’s no plea deal, if Smollett was found guilty, would he get prison time.

There’s no denying that Smollett could make a plea deal where he confesses and shows remorse for a reduced sentence with no prison time.


Given the vitriol shown by the Chicago authorities - Police, Judge and Mayor - It wouldn't surprise me at all if Smollet gets time if he doesn't plea out.

And that's my problem with this idea that is being thrown around that Smollet should get prison time for not confessing. Prison shouldn't be used as a tool for extorting citizens into forgoing the full due process they are rightly afforded. In others words, if Smollet is due prison time even if he pleas put, that's one thing. Sure, instead of giving him 6 months for pleading guilty, give him 18 months for not pleading. But if the crime itself isn't worthy of prison time (and I don't think this one is for reasons I have explained), then threatening someone with prison time simply for exercising their right to a full trial and be proven guilty by a jury on the merits of the case is a blatant misuse of our Justice system.

Bottomline, I don't think Smollet should go to prison. But if he were to go to prison, it should be on the merits of the case and the severity of the crime . . . NOT because people are mad he didn't take a plea. That's not how we should want our system of justice to work.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:43 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
No Prison For Texas Teen Who Lied About Being Raped By 3 Black Men

A North Texas teenager who falsely claimed she was kidnapped and raped by three black men last March will likely serve no prison time.



Good find. However, this was a plea deal. Plea deals are pretty much subjective to the DA making the deal.

The question is, if there’s no plea deal, if Smollett was found guilty, would he get prison time.

There’s no denying that Smollett could make a plea deal where he confesses and shows remorse for a reduced sentence with no prison time.


if he is guilty, there is no way this goes to trial if his defense team can prevent it. While the police chief went in front of the camera's and talked tough, I would guess this is a case the DA's office would prefer to get resolved and move on......unless the DA is facing some type of tough election or desire for a new elected office soon. That can always change the equation.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:51 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
No Prison For Texas Teen Who Lied About Being Raped By 3 Black Men

A North Texas teenager who falsely claimed she was kidnapped and raped by three black men last March will likely serve no prison time.



I do not have anything legitimate in front of me, but I have read or heard stats previously about how harsh penalties are not common for filing a false police report. I guess that was in general, and not ones that become a national story....but I go back to basic logic (from my perspective)....if he is guilty, and can be properly punished (limit his freedom), perform community service, and pay restitution.....who benefits by sending him to jail? The public does not benefit because they will have to pay to shelter and feed him, and due to his celebrity status will be far more expensive than a regular Joe....and nobody's safety is in danger with him on the street walking to perform community service. I am just tired of the solution always being put them in jail for non-violent crimes.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 9:28 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
No Prison For Texas Teen Who Lied About Being Raped By 3 Black Men

A North Texas teenager who falsely claimed she was kidnapped and raped by three black men last March will likely serve no prison time.



I do not have anything legitimate in front of me, but I have read or heard stats previously about how harsh penalties are not common for filing a false police report. I guess that was in general, and not ones that become a national story....but I go back to basic logic (from my perspective)....if he is guilty, and can be properly punished (limit his freedom), perform community service, and pay restitution.....who benefits by sending him to jail? The public does not benefit because they will have to pay to shelter and feed him, and due to his celebrity status will be far more expensive than a regular Joe....and nobody's safety is in danger with him on the street walking to perform community service. I am just tired of the solution always being put them in jail for non-violent crimes.


Bravo
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 10:04 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
No Prison For Texas Teen Who Lied About Being Raped By 3 Black Men

A North Texas teenager who falsely claimed she was kidnapped and raped by three black men last March will likely serve no prison time.



I do not have anything legitimate in front of me, but I have read or heard stats previously about how harsh penalties are not common for filing a false police report. I guess that was in general, and not ones that become a national story....but I go back to basic logic (from my perspective)....if he is guilty, and can be properly punished (limit his freedom), perform community service, and pay restitution.....who benefits by sending him to jail? The public does not benefit because they will have to pay to shelter and feed him, and due to his celebrity status will be far more expensive than a regular Joe....and nobody's safety is in danger with him on the street walking to perform community service. I am just tired of the solution always being put them in jail for non-violent crimes.


My issue would be - why even put it in the code to begin with? If filing a false police report is a non-violent crime that doesn’t warrant prison time, why make it a maximum 3 yr sentence?

What type of case would warrant prison time? Is the code all bark and no bite?

I think if they aren’t going to enforce prison time, might as well go ahead and change the code. Take out prison time and just put in restitution.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 10:08 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
No Prison For Texas Teen Who Lied About Being Raped By 3 Black Men

A North Texas teenager who falsely claimed she was kidnapped and raped by three black men last March will likely serve no prison time.



I do not have anything legitimate in front of me, but I have read or heard stats previously about how harsh penalties are not common for filing a false police report. I guess that was in general, and not ones that become a national story....but I go back to basic logic (from my perspective)....if he is guilty, and can be properly punished (limit his freedom), perform community service, and pay restitution.....who benefits by sending him to jail? The public does not benefit because they will have to pay to shelter and feed him, and due to his celebrity status will be far more expensive than a regular Joe....and nobody's safety is in danger with him on the street walking to perform community service. I am just tired of the solution always being put them in jail for non-violent crimes.


Wait . . . who hijacked your account? You're actually making sense!
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 10:26 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:

My issue would be - why even put it in the code to begin with? If filing a false police report is a non-violent crime that doesn’t warrant prison time, why make it a maximum 3 yr sentence?

What type of case would warrant prison time? Is the code all bark and no bite?

I think if they aren’t going to enforce prison time, might as well go ahead and change the code. Take out prison time and just put in restitution.


The logical answer would be to keep sentencing options open for worst case scenarios. Having a maximum prison sentence of 3 years doesn't mean that prison should be the norm for the crime. It's just an option when warranted.

There's a big difference between filling a false report where no one was actually harmed versus filing one that leads to an individual being actually arrested or charged with a crime that was never committed. I would hope that we all agree that a false report where the intent was to benefit oneself without actually impacting an uninvolved third party - like Smollet or the Texas woman who filed a false rape report to cover her own embarrassment - is very different than filing a false report that puts an actual individual in danger of being wrongly accused or prosecuted. For example, there was a case several years ago where a woman accused members of the Duke (?) LaCrosse team of sexual assault. It was a false accusation that put several young men in legal peril. That's a far worse act than faking your own beating where you don't name an actual suspect.

Here's the deal, just because prison is a sentencing option for a crime doesn't mean it's necessarily the only option for a crime.
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You thought God was an architect, now you know
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Jason Isbell

Man, do those lyrics resonate right now
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