| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
 Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
Since this thread is a throwback, here's an old school player stats comparison for DLo: BB-Ref
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
KeepItRealOrElse
Retired Number
Joined: 11 Oct 2012
Posts: 32767
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Username wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | The big issue with DLo joining the Lakers is whether he still has that OSU off-ball game in him after being so ball dominant with the Nets. He ran pretty much the most PnRs in the NBA last season and he was assisted on only 28% of his shots.
You have to have faith that he can rebalance his game playing off of Lebron, which should cause his TS% to go up nicely.
If you think he's only hardwired to be a 30%+ usage guy who runs PnR every time down the floor, then I definitely see the concern with committing so much cap to a questionable fit. |
LeBron ain't playing 40 minutes a night. We need a capable ball handler to take the pressure off him like Kyrie did. |
True, but when closing games Lebron is going to dominate the ball more so DLo will need to play off-ball like Kyrie did during Cleveland's Finals runs.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
adkindo
Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Since this thread is a throwback, here's an old school player stats comparison for DLo: BB-Ref |
dang, that is the real Isiah Thomas too |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
anth2000
Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Apr 2001
Posts: 12193
Location: Pasadena, CA
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | anth2000 wrote: | | where24happens wrote: | | Hard pass on D-Lo. Rather use his money on 2-3 good role players |
I do agree. He's not elite and will take up much of the money that the team has.
But his fan club is strong...especially in LG. |
As opposed to his anti-fan club. |
exactly, my friend. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Juggernaut
Star Player
Joined: 24 Aug 2017
Posts: 4572
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
| KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | | The Juggernaut wrote: | | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | | The Juggernaut wrote: | | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | | The Juggernaut wrote: | | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | | The Juggernaut wrote: | | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | | seeing a guy give poor effort and miss rotations pops off the screen. If you focus on that player (a lot of people focus on stars) you will usually have an accurate assessment of that player's defense |
Eh, I take fans' analysis on defense with a grain of salt after reading LG posts for years and the nba subreddits. So many people see many different things. Nothing beats a film breakdown and analytics to support that film breakdown for defense imo. |
do Laker fans largely look at defensive analytics to see that Kuzma is a poor defender, or is that accurately assessed by their eyes? All types of fans from XO guys to the casual fan, over the past few years - have seen with their eyes and deduced that Lebron's defense has lacked effort and is mediocre at best..even numbers guys look at Lebron's effort, poor closeouts, missed rotations, etc and easily SEE that he's a mediocre defender at best (very often poor) although I think the numbers say mediocre........
bad defense from notable players pops. |
You're using obvious extreme examples with Lebron and Kuzma. Butler's defensive effort could have been less than in year's past with the Sixers but going off of a few Sixer's fans posts about it isnt conclusive enough for me especially when their conclusion is "average" |
it's really not a few of them, and they categorize it as "underwhelming".
it's really not hard to see poor effort. which is what they see as his problem. |
Raptors fans were also "underwhelmed" with Kawhi's defensive effort for most of the season. |
uh yes he wasn't his usual self defensively+athletically. Even Kawhi and Nick Nurse said his defense needed/would take a step up in the playoffs |
Yeah, which is why the fans expectations are off to begin with. No star past the age of 27 is able to be a 20+ PPG scorer and bring full defensive effort every night. |
the issue with Jimmy is he wasn't a 1st or really 2nd option offensively with Philly. he got 2nd option ppg but the ball was in Simmons and Embiid's hands a lot, taking a lot of Jimmy's load off, ideally for him to give effort on defense |
He was the 2nd option to score and secondary playmaker when Simmons was out. Not many top 2 scoring options are bringing defensive effort every night, especially in march/april games and at the age of 29. Shouldn't even expect that as a fan base. On top of that Brett Brown had no idea how to meld together all his pieces with Harris, Butler, Embiid, and Simmons. I don't think Butler's Philly tenure should be indicative of how he will perform elsewhere next season. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
adkindo
Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
where have you been....I have taken many mob beatings on LG by pointing out how flawed DRPM has been since created. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Juggernaut
Star Player
Joined: 24 Aug 2017
Posts: 4572
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Since this thread is a throwback, here's an old school player stats comparison for DLo: BB-Ref |
That Trae Young is quite the prospect |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
If only tox weren't so young and successful, he could hang out here and teach us old farts about the analytics.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
| anth2000 wrote: | | where24happens wrote: | | Hard pass on D-Lo. Rather use his money on 2-3 good role players |
I do agree. He's not elite and will take up much of the money that the team has.
But his fan club is strong...especially in LG. |
It depends on who those role players are.
Its weird to say you’d pass on something over a different option that is undefined.
Those “good” role players could be Lance/Rondo/KCP. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
adkindo
Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| The Juggernaut wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Since this thread is a throwback, here's an old school player stats comparison for DLo: BB-Ref |
That Trae Young is quite the prospect |
he is ROY in probably 8 out of 10 years....just happened to be a rookie the wrong year |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| The Juggernaut wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Since this thread is a throwback, here's an old school player stats comparison for DLo: BB-Ref |
That Trae Young is quite the prospect |
That he is. Steve Nash for the Warriors age.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
anth2000
Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Apr 2001
Posts: 12193
Location: Pasadena, CA
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ringfinger wrote: | | anth2000 wrote: | | where24happens wrote: | | Hard pass on D-Lo. Rather use his money on 2-3 good role players |
I do agree. He's not elite and will take up much of the money that the team has.
But his fan club is strong...especially in LG. |
It depends on who those role players are.
Its weird to say you’d pass on something over a different option that is undefined.
Those “good” role players could be Lance/Rondo/KCP. |
True but if you spend say $22-24mil on DLO, what do you have left? You can't likely get Beverly, Redick or Lopez? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MIMLaker
Franchise Player
Joined: 18 Jul 2001
Posts: 10015
Location: Los Angeles/ Alhambra, CA
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:37 am Post subject: |
|
|
| No more than $18M or so to DLo to start. IF he's sincere about coming for a discount for 2-3 years so we can five him up a bigger offer later with Bird Rights, fine, but I'd rather spend that money on Elfrid Payton ($7M-$9M) and more depth. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mad55557777
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 23265
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
kawhi covers the opposing teams best players while Lebron was coasting. big difference. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CRoost
Star Player
Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 4798
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | The big issue with DLo joining the Lakers is whether he still has that OSU off-ball game in him after being so ball dominant with the Nets. He ran pretty much the most PnRs in the NBA last season and he was assisted on only 28% of his shots.
You have to have faith that he can rebalance his game playing off of Lebron, which should cause his TS% to go up nicely.
If you think he's only hardwired to be a 30%+ usage guy who runs PnR every time down the floor, then I definitely see the concern with committing so much cap to a questionable fit. |
This is valid concern because with the Lakers, you know it’s Lebron ball and it’s gonna be like that for at least 32 minutes and more in the playoff. We saw that with BI, he will demand the ball and he will run that PnR all day with AD. Only an injury can change that. He may sit up 5-10 games during the regular season and that’s when you get the most value out of DLo. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
| MIMLaker wrote: | | No more than $18M or so to DLo to start. IF he's sincere about coming for a discount for 2-3 years so we can five him up a bigger offer later with Bird Rights, fine, but I'd rather spend that money on Elfrid Payton ($7M-$9M) and more depth. |
Well, if we're going that route, why not Mudiay for $2M instead of Payton for $7-9M?
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
| anth2000 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | anth2000 wrote: | | where24happens wrote: | | Hard pass on D-Lo. Rather use his money on 2-3 good role players |
I do agree. He's not elite and will take up much of the money that the team has.
But his fan club is strong...especially in LG. |
It depends on who those role players are.
Its weird to say you’d pass on something over a different option that is undefined.
Those “good” role players could be Lance/Rondo/KCP. |
True but if you spend say $22-24mil on DLO, what do you have left? You can't likely get Beverly, Redick or Lopez? |
Well I think the choice has to be DLo vs specific players at reasonable market rates.
Not DLo vs vague non-descript players.
DLo plus vet mins > Lance/Rondo/KCP
DLo plus vet mins < Beverly/Redick/Lopez
How can you pass on DLo over Lance/Rondo/KCP? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
where24happens
Star Player
Joined: 08 May 2009
Posts: 3410
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ringfinger wrote: | | anth2000 wrote: | | where24happens wrote: | | Hard pass on D-Lo. Rather use his money on 2-3 good role players |
I do agree. He's not elite and will take up much of the money that the team has.
But his fan club is strong...especially in LG. |
It depends on who those role players are.
Its weird to say you’d pass on something over a different option that is undefined.
Those “good” role players could be Lance/Rondo/KCP. |
How about combo A- Lopez and Beverly or Combo B - Collison + Danny Green + Seth Curry.
Any combo of that players I would consider to be a better rounded roster than putting all the cap space into D-Lo. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CRoost wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | The big issue with DLo joining the Lakers is whether he still has that OSU off-ball game in him after being so ball dominant with the Nets. He ran pretty much the most PnRs in the NBA last season and he was assisted on only 28% of his shots.
You have to have faith that he can rebalance his game playing off of Lebron, which should cause his TS% to go up nicely.
If you think he's only hardwired to be a 30%+ usage guy who runs PnR every time down the floor, then I definitely see the concern with committing so much cap to a questionable fit. |
This is valid concern because with the Lakers, you know it’s Lebron ball and it’s gonna be like that for at least 32 minutes and more in the playoff. We saw that with BI, he will demand the ball and he will run that PnR all day with AD. Only an injury can change that. He may sit up 5-10 games during the regular season and that’s when you get the most value out of DLo. |
There's also real value in having DLo attack closeouts whereas teams wouldn't really close hard on BI and Lonzo didn't have a midrange game when he did get a hard closeout.
It's going to be on DLo to really move without the ball, though, rather than just relocate. The great thing is that every defender will be eyeballing Lebron and AD, so DLo should have a lot easier time cutting backdoor or setting up his defender for a back pick.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LandsbergerRules
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 11197
Location: The Other Perspective
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CRoost wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | The big issue with DLo joining the Lakers is whether he still has that OSU off-ball game in him after being so ball dominant with the Nets. He ran pretty much the most PnRs in the NBA last season and he was assisted on only 28% of his shots.
You have to have faith that he can rebalance his game playing off of Lebron, which should cause his TS% to go up nicely.
If you think he's only hardwired to be a 30%+ usage guy who runs PnR every time down the floor, then I definitely see the concern with committing so much cap to a questionable fit. |
This is valid concern because with the Lakers, you know it’s Lebron ball and it’s gonna be like that for at least 32 minutes and more in the playoff. We saw that with BI, he will demand the ball and he will run that PnR all day with AD. Only an injury can change that. He may sit up 5-10 games during the regular season and that’s when you get the most value out of DLo. |
Didn't DLo and poor man's Lebron aka Ben Simmons work well together in high school? I think he'll be fine with a point forward taking a lot of the load off.
_________________
"Chick lived and breathed Lakers basketball…but he was also fair and objective and called every game the way it was played."
-from Chick: His Unpublished Memoirs and the Memories of Those Who Knew Him |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lakerican
Star Player
Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 3793
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CRoost wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | The big issue with DLo joining the Lakers is whether he still has that OSU off-ball game in him after being so ball dominant with the Nets. He ran pretty much the most PnRs in the NBA last season and he was assisted on only 28% of his shots.
You have to have faith that he can rebalance his game playing off of Lebron, which should cause his TS% to go up nicely.
If you think he's only hardwired to be a 30%+ usage guy who runs PnR every time down the floor, then I definitely see the concern with committing so much cap to a questionable fit. |
This is valid concern because with the Lakers, you know it’s Lebron ball and it’s gonna be like that for at least 32 minutes and more in the playoff. We saw that with BI, he will demand the ball and he will run that PnR all day with AD. Only an injury can change that. He may sit up 5-10 games during the regular season and that’s when you get the most value out of DLo. |
Have you people check Dload 3pt % from the corners? 
Last edited by lakerican on Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:47 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
AFireInside619
Franchise Player
Joined: 11 Dec 2015
Posts: 11447
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | If only tox weren't so young and successful, he could hang out here and teach us old farts about the analytics. |
Who’s tox in real life?
_________________
“You have to dance beautifully in the box that you are comfortable dancing in.” - Kobe Bryant |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
818fan
Star Player
Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 4702
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
KeepItRealOrElse
Retired Number
Joined: 11 Oct 2012
Posts: 32767
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
| adkindo wrote: |
where have you been....I have taken many mob beatings on LG by pointing out how flawed DRPM has been since created. |
glad I've been avoiding them |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
