| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
emplay
Site Staff
Joined: 15 Apr 2001
Posts: 25535
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Inspector Gadget
Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 44999
|
 Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 10:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I would be very shocked if the Lakers didn’t listen to LeBron offers if the team doesn’t get there act together, especially because he’s looked a step slow this year |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lakersfan1211
Star Player
Joined: 28 Mar 2021
Posts: 4037
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 10:45 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | I would be very shocked if the Lakers didn’t listen to LeBron offers if the team doesn’t get there act together, especially because he’s looked a step slow this year |
Be very shocked then, Lakers aren't trading LeBron. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JUST-MING
Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 43212
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 10:45 am Post subject: |
|
|
Four straight seasons as a play-in team  .
They need an all-nba first/second team caliber player, not another all-star caliber player. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JUST-MING
Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 43212
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 10:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Lakersfan1211 wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | I would be very shocked if the Lakers didn’t listen to LeBron offers if the team doesn’t get there act together, especially because he’s looked a step slow this year |
Be very shocked then, Lakers aren't trading LeBron. |
The offer Phoenix made for Lebron a couple of years ago was Cam Johnson and a first round pick. That doesn't make us better. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakerSD
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016
Posts: 23540
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 10:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
The Lakers issue is they are relying on 39 year old to be their #1 because the guy who is supposed to be #1 is not available enough to be a #1 and even if 39 year old Lebron is #2 that’s not going to be a top west team.
The feeling this season was Reaves and AD could carry the squad as the primary guys and Reaves hasn’t performed like he did last season and AD is same old day to Davis.
You will not win in the NBA depending on a 39 year old to carry the team. Doesn’t matter if who it is…until we move away from this who are our 2 star construct, we will always struggle to be a top tier team. We need a young player (via trade or a leap) to be a star and be a 1/2.
Lebron/AD as 1/2 = chip window closed. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JUST-MING
Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 43212
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 10:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| There have been a few teams to win without a top 10 player. 2004 Pistons. 2014 Spurs. It's rare, but it happens. That's where we are at. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Inspector Gadget
Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 44999
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 10:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
| LakerSD wrote: | The Lakers issue is they are relying on 39 year old to be their #1 because the guy who is supposed to be #1 is not available enough to be a #1 and even if 39 year old Lebron is #2 that’s not going to be a top west team.
The feeling this season was Reaves and AD could carry the squad as the primary guys and Reaves hasn’t performed like he did last season and AD is same old day to Davis.
You will not win in the NBA depending on a 39 year old to carry the team. Doesn’t matter if who it is…until we move away from this who are our 2 star construct, we will always struggle to be a top tier team. We need a young player (via trade or a leap) to be a star and be a 1/2.
Lebron/AD as 1/2 = chip window closed. |
Good post |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4003
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
| LakerSD wrote: | The Lakers issue is they are relying on 39 year old to be their #1 because the guy who is supposed to be #1 is not available enough to be a #1 and even if 39 year old Lebron is #2 that’s not going to be a top west team.
The feeling this season was Reaves and AD could carry the squad as the primary guys and Reaves hasn’t performed like he did last season and AD is same old day to Davis.
You will not win in the NBA depending on a 39 year old to carry the team. Doesn’t matter if who it is…until we move away from this who are our 2 star construct, we will always struggle to be a top tier team. We need a young player (via trade or a leap) to be a star and be a 1/2.
Lebron/AD as 1/2 = chip window closed. |
The team you’re assessing had a top defense and record after the trades then won two playoff series. Sure the schedule was easier at the end of the season but the playoffs were more difficult. And while the WCF falls short of the goal, it does show what the team led by LBJ/AD is capable of so it’s not them. Shro for the MLE, LW4 for vet min, and Oubre for the BAE, instead of Vinc/MaxL/TaP and the Lakers look like they would have been on track for a ship run.
It’s not LBJ/AD that’s the problem. To win a ship, Every star needs an appropriate supporting cast with a good coach and the Lakers stars don’t have that. Once you factor in the coaching issues, poor game starting schemes, unable to motivate the team, lack of ability to devise an effective game closing focus, you then realize the real prob, which is the front office and the coach. AD/LBJ aren’t good enough to overcome those difficulties I agree, but with Shro/LW4/Oubre instead of Vin/MaxL/TaP I don’t think it would have been an issue.
_________________
“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
laker50
Star Player
Joined: 07 Mar 2014
Posts: 2136
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
No, Lakers are dealing with a LOT of injuries.
And some new players.
Give them time to adjust. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gumby
Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 2485
Location: Inland Empire
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 12:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| laker50 wrote: | No, Lakers are dealing with a LOT of injuries.
And some new players.
Give them time to adjust. |
I'd feel a lot more worrisome if that wasn't the case.
I think if this team is still playing like this once everyone is healed, then that's a bigger issue.
Bye.
_________________
"This trophy removes the most odious sentence in the English Language. It can never be said again that 'the Lakers have never beaten the Celtics.'" -Dr. Jerry Buss (1985) R.I.P., 33 x M.V.O. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Startrout
Star Player
Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 2136
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| I think more likely we trade Reeves. Also, it’s early still, but we’re definitely missing Schroeder. Hopefully, Gabe has more to show us when he returns. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Valdarno
Starting Rotation
Joined: 17 Nov 2022
Posts: 128
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
a 3rd star?
nothing will matter as long as Ham is the coach. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kfkilla
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2002
Posts: 4005
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 3:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| LakerSD wrote: | The Lakers issue is they are relying on 39 year old to be their #1 because the guy who is supposed to be #1 is not available enough to be a #1 and even if 39 year old Lebron is #2 that’s not going to be a top west team.
The feeling this season was Reaves and AD could carry the squad as the primary guys and Reaves hasn’t performed like he did last season and AD is same old day to Davis.
You will not win in the NBA depending on a 39 year old to carry the team. Doesn’t matter if who it is…until we move away from this who are our 2 star construct, we will always struggle to be a top tier team. We need a young player (via trade or a leap) to be a star and be a 1/2.
Lebron/AD as 1/2 = chip window closed. |
It really is this simple. Great articulate post. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
slavavov
Star Player
Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 7970
Location: Santa Monica
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
LeBron has looked good to start the season. Seems like he's pacing himself, and he doesn't start seasons fast anyway to begin with.
We have to see how long this hip/adductor injury lingers for AD. Besides that, he's been playing the way we need him to.
It's the others who haven't been pulling their weight, especially Reaves and DLO, especially when it comes to 3-point shooting.
We won't truly know until the end of December how good this team really is and what, if anything, it needs to be a true championship contender.
_________________
Lakers 49ers Chargers Dodgers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 6027
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 10, 2023 8:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
Let’s hope that Rob has learned and embraced the path to not emotional knee-jerk trades
If Rob is willing to change his plans this early in the season and with the injuries, then there was no plan in the beginning. Vanderbilt provides defense and energy. Vincent provides defense, intensity and focus, Hayes brings energy, defense, length and youth.
None of the players mentioned have been known or expected to provide energy and defense
Uber-talented AD has continued to show that he is not ready to be Da Man, though he is a great Robin
LBJ has continued to show that there is no history of a 38-39 years old player playing at the high standards that he is consistently achieving, the ability to still being Da Man and making a clear difference when he is on the court
Ham might want to tweak the rotations by subbing earlier for players that are not bringing force and intention to their lackadaisel efforts |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakerSD
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016
Posts: 23540
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 10, 2023 12:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Hanging from Rafters wrote: | | LakerSD wrote: | The Lakers issue is they are relying on 39 year old to be their #1 because the guy who is supposed to be #1 is not available enough to be a #1 and even if 39 year old Lebron is #2 that’s not going to be a top west team.
The feeling this season was Reaves and AD could carry the squad as the primary guys and Reaves hasn’t performed like he did last season and AD is same old day to Davis.
You will not win in the NBA depending on a 39 year old to carry the team. Doesn’t matter if who it is…until we move away from this who are our 2 star construct, we will always struggle to be a top tier team. We need a young player (via trade or a leap) to be a star and be a 1/2.
Lebron/AD as 1/2 = chip window closed. |
The team you’re assessing had a top defense and record after the trades then won two playoff series. Sure the schedule was easier at the end of the season but the playoffs were more difficult. And while the WCF falls short of the goal, it does show what the team led by LBJ/AD is capable of so it’s not them. Shro for the MLE, LW4 for vet min, and Oubre for the BAE, instead of Vinc/MaxL/TaP and the Lakers look like they would have been on track for a ship run.
It’s not LBJ/AD that’s the problem. To win a ship, Every star needs an appropriate supporting cast with a good coach and the Lakers stars don’t have that. Once you factor in the coaching issues, poor game starting schemes, unable to motivate the team, lack of ability to devise an effective game closing focus, you then realize the real prob, which is the front office and the coach. AD/LBJ aren’t good enough to overcome those difficulties I agree, but with Shro/LW4/Oubre instead of Vin/MaxL/TaP I don’t think it would have been an issue. |
See I don’t see much difference in role players tbh. That’s why the NBA is dictated by stars.
Do we look bad because we don’t have our best role defending specialist in Vando? Of course, because without him you shouldn’t be playing Reaves and DLO together tbh and for sure not when AD is out.
I don’t see much difference in Schroder, Vincent, Walker IV, Prince, etc. All role players have strengths and weaknesses but they basically cancel each other out.
The issue I see is we have a 39 year old we are expecting to carry us and a 30 year old who isn’t available consistently and even doesn’t play like a star sometimes. That’s tough to overcome in a league that gets younger and younger with more guys coming in who are supremely confident in their abilities.
Why we were able to get to the WCF last season is because Reaves played like the 3rd star. That’s why national media and Laker haters were mad that he took the Lakers “bargain” deal.
With Reaves not performing like he did last season, we are back to what it looked like with Russ still on the team. Relying on LeGrandpa and AD to be 1/2 and they just simply can’t be that anymore for a sustained period. If Reaves gets back to what he looked like last postseason, everything will get back into place but they probably need Vando and Rui to be those big body defenders in the lineup because LeGrandpa and DLO are going to keep getting attacked/spammed by the opponent. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4003
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 10, 2023 1:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| LakerSD wrote: | | Hanging from Rafters wrote: | | LakerSD wrote: | The Lakers issue is they are relying on 39 year old to be their #1 because the guy who is supposed to be #1 is not available enough to be a #1 and even if 39 year old Lebron is #2 that’s not going to be a top west team.
The feeling this season was Reaves and AD could carry the squad as the primary guys and Reaves hasn’t performed like he did last season and AD is same old day to Davis.
You will not win in the NBA depending on a 39 year old to carry the team. Doesn’t matter if who it is…until we move away from this who are our 2 star construct, we will always struggle to be a top tier team. We need a young player (via trade or a leap) to be a star and be a 1/2.
Lebron/AD as 1/2 = chip window closed. |
The team you’re assessing had a top defense and record after the trades then won two playoff series. Sure the schedule was easier at the end of the season but the playoffs were more difficult. And while the WCF falls short of the goal, it does show what the team led by LBJ/AD is capable of so it’s not them. Shro for the MLE, LW4 for vet min, and Oubre for the BAE, instead of Vinc/MaxL/TaP and the Lakers look like they would have been on track for a ship run.
It’s not LBJ/AD that’s the problem. To win a ship, Every star needs an appropriate supporting cast with a good coach and the Lakers stars don’t have that. Once you factor in the coaching issues, poor game starting schemes, unable to motivate the team, lack of ability to devise an effective game closing focus, you then realize the real prob, which is the front office and the coach. AD/LBJ aren’t good enough to overcome those difficulties I agree, but with Shro/LW4/Oubre instead of Vin/MaxL/TaP I don’t think it would have been an issue. |
See I don’t see much difference in role players tbh. That’s why the NBA is dictated by stars.
Do we look bad because we don’t have our best role defending specialist in Vando? Of course, because without him you shouldn’t be playing Reaves and DLO together tbh and for sure not when AD is out.
I don’t see much difference in Schroder, Vincent, Walker IV, Prince, etc. All role players have strengths and weaknesses but they basically cancel each other out.
The issue I see is we have a 39 year old we are expecting to carry us and a 30 year old who isn’t available consistently and even doesn’t play like a star sometimes. That’s tough to overcome in a league that gets younger and younger with more guys coming in who are supremely confident in their abilities.
Why we were able to get to the WCF last season is because Reaves played like the 3rd star. That’s why national media and Laker haters were mad that he took the Lakers “bargain” deal.
With Reaves not performing like he did last season, we are back to what it looked like with Russ still on the team. Relying on LeGrandpa and AD to be 1/2 and they just simply can’t be that anymore for a sustained period. If Reaves gets back to what he looked like last postseason, everything will get back into place but they probably need Vando and Rui to be those big body defenders in the lineup because LeGrandpa and DLO are going to keep getting attacked/spammed by the opponent. |
It can be said that AD isn’t da Man, and LBJ is 39yrs old but to be a valid reason for the lack of success we have to look at their production and see where it is so subpar so that it uncovers the problem. When we do that…look at the production of AD/LBJ…it doesn’t seem to show that it supports the theory that they are the problem. Both have played well enough and produced sufficiently enough for the team to be successful. It is the role players that are failing. Looking at the role player production we see the subpar play that we’re looking for.
Some role players are about the same for sure, but when you look at what Shro is doing for Toronto, and what LW4 is doing for Brooklyn, and what Oubre is doing for Philly, it looks as if those role players for the Lakers instead of Vin/Cam/TaP would absolutely make a difference. Although It can be said that Oubre’s consideration is iffy, Shro/LW4 were Lakers last year and especially Shro was an integral part of the team’s success therefore a the very least Shro should have been retained if we wanted to sustain the success from last season’s end and that his absence is part of the reason for the disappointing start.
_________________
“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
emplay
Site Staff
Joined: 15 Apr 2001
Posts: 25535
|
| Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 1:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I don't see the Lakers considering moving LeBron at any point soon or maybe at all. TBD
_________________
Salary Cap Strategist and Columnist at Bleacher Report and on Twitter at http://www.twitter.com/EricPincus |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 6027
|
| Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 10:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
If age is the top and first criteria one looks at someone being Da Man
What are should we look at - Curry’s age, KD’s age, CP3’s age, etc
Maybe consistent high and effective production that has a direct impact on games should be the top and first factors to consider |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Scherm
Star Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2001
Posts: 4152
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 17, 2023 7:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The trade speculation automatically throws everyone up for grabs.
Losing productive players like Russell, Rui Hachimura, Austin Reaves and potentially Max Christie, Vincent and Hood-Schifino is not necessarily and upgrade.
Especially if it's for guys like Zach Lavine with bad knees and an overpriced contract, DeRozan who does not bring as much energy, rebounding or defense as as Rui, or Alex Caruso -- a likeable journeyman who is not better than Russell, Reaves or even Vincent is not an upgrade.
Adding a healthy Vanderbilt and Vincent to the roster would do more to improve it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
