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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 8:31 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
32 wrote:
Niners super bowl drought is now at 30 years.


3 time Super Bowl losers since their last win.


The new Buffalo Bills.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 8:48 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
The missed extra point was the end for the Niners. It meant all the Chiefs had to do was score FGs to extend or win the game. Reid and PM are always going to get in FG range when it matters.


It's just so interesting though because it may have gotten them to overtime as opposed to losing in regulation. If the Chiefs had been down by 4 when they had the ball with just a few minutes left, they most likely are going forward in four down territory, and wouldn't you think that Mahomes would have found a way to score a touchdown in that situation? I think it's quite likely that the fact that they were only down by 3 gave the Chiefs an out to kick a tying field goal instead of going for the touchdown. That actually may have worked in San Francisco's favor.

The biggest gaffe was the decision to take the ball first in overtime. I guarantee you that heavily swung the win probability to the Chiefs. I still genuinely can't believe it and it's an hour later. Teams have known about the new overtime rules for at least a couple of years. It should have been communicated to someone a long time ago that it's obvious that you go on defense first. Does anyone go on offense first in college football in overtime, for example? Of course not.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 8:48 pm    Post subject:

This was by far the most painful of the 49ers' three Super Bowl losses. You almost have to start to wonder if it will take on a life of its own the next time they get there or are in the NFC Championship Game.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 8:48 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
aprevo15 wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
"Let's take the ball first so that we guarantee that even if we score, Mahomes is going to get four downs on offense.".

Moronic.

I must say, this game went down almost exactly like what I thought. San Francisco had the majority of the matchup advantages. They have a better roster. However, the Chiefs had the coaching advantage, and they had the obvious huge edge at quarterback. This was the Chiefs' worst offense of the Mahomes era by far, and he still found a way to bring them back. He used his legs and ran for absolutely critical first downs when it was most important. I don't like the Chiefs, but one must recognize greatness. It's incredibly impressive.


I kinda thought it was a pretty good move. It gave his defense a bit longer to catch their breath since they were out there to finish off the regulation. Also he knows Mahome is going to get a TD regardless. So if the Niners scored the first TD then it might put a bit more pressure on Mahomes and make it a bit more difficult for him.


I don't care how tired the defense allegedly is, it's just not a move you can make. It's three downs versus four. It's a monumental difference to know what you have to do and that you have four downs to do it if you must score. It frees up your offense to know that you're going to get four downs to make 10 yd if you're behind. Plus, if you do happen to force a punt on defense first, you're in the extreme driver's seat because then it's a game of sudden death, and now you have the ball. As DMR said, no matter what, you can't end the game with the ball first, but with the ball second, you know you have four downs to tie it up at absolute worst.


I totally agree with you on that's how it should be. But we are talking about Mahome. It looked like shanahan's decisions tonight were based on his respect for Mohome's game. Even going for it on 4th and 3 when a field goal would have tied the game. I'm speculating of course but it seemed like Shanahan knows Mahome is going to score. So if Chiefs received first then he knows he would be down a touch down and the way his offense was all night, I just didn't think he wanted to put that type of pressure on Purdy where you go down on downs and it's game over. At the same time if Niners scored first then it does put unwanted pressure on Mahome and even the greats tend to make a mistake when they are under pressure.

I'm sure a reporter is going to ask him why he made the decision. Can't wait to hear it,


Last edited by aprevo15 on Sun Feb 11, 2024 8:53 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 8:51 pm    Post subject:

32 wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
32 wrote:
Niners super bowl drought is now at 30 years.


3 time Super Bowl losers since their last win.


The new Buffalo Bills.


It's a beautiful thing. I had no interest in seeing the Chiefs win, just the Niners lose.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 8:58 pm    Post subject:

slavavov wrote:
This was by far the most painful of the 49ers' three Super Bowl losses. You almost have to start to wonder if it will take on a life of its own the next time they get there or are in the NFC Championship Game.


Getting to the championship game and losing is probably the worst feeling. Thats a mountain that is going to be very hard to climb next season.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:08 pm    Post subject:

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1756888470599967000
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:14 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
The missed extra point was the end for the Niners. It meant all the Chiefs had to do was score FGs to extend or win the game. Reid and PM are always going to get in FG range when it matters.


It's just so interesting though because it may have gotten them to overtime as opposed to losing in regulation. If the Chiefs had been down by 4 when they had the ball with just a few minutes left, they most likely are going forward in four down territory, and wouldn't you think that Mahomes would have found a way to score a touchdown in that situation? I think it's quite likely that the fact that they were only down by 3 gave the Chiefs an out to kick a tying field goal instead of going for the touchdown. That actually may have worked in San Francisco's favor.

The biggest gaffe was the decision to take the ball first in overtime. I guarantee you that heavily swung the win probability to the Chiefs. I still genuinely can't believe it and it's an hour later. Teams have known about the new overtime rules for at least a couple of years. It should have been communicated to someone a long time ago that it's obvious that you go on defense first. Does anyone go on offense first in college football in overtime, for example? Of course not.


I get what you are saying about a 4 point lead likely making the Chiefs go for a four down go for it mentality. My point is that the missed point meant the Chiefs never had to take that gamble. They just had to play to get to OT, which for Reid and Mahomes is easy if all they have to do is get into FG range.

Obviously, the decision to receive in overtime was idiotic, but if that point after wasn’t missed, the odds of having to face OT drop remarkably; Mohomes or not.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:17 pm    Post subject:

Here's the reason why Shanahan decided to get first possession in OT. Man did I over think much. LOL. Not sure how credible this guy is. I just googled it.

Quote:
Matt Maiocco (Threads @maiocconbcs)
@MaioccoNBCS
Coach Kyle Shanahan said the decision to take the ball at the beginning of overtime was pre-determined. If both teams were tied after one possession apiece, he wanted to be the one that got the third possession, and the sudden-death advantage.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:19 pm    Post subject:

aprevo15 wrote:
Here's the reason why Shanahan decided to get first possession in OT. Man did I over think much. LOL. Not sure how credible this guy is. I just googled it.

Quote:
Matt Maiocco (Threads @maiocconbcs)
@MaioccoNBCS
Coach Kyle Shanahan said the decision to take the ball at the beginning of overtime was pre-determined. If both teams were tied after one possession apiece, he wanted to be the one that got the third possession, and the sudden-death advantage.


Yeah, but you gotta score a TD for that to work out.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:23 pm    Post subject:

aprevo15 wrote:
Here's the reason why Shanahan decided to get first possession in OT. Man did I over think much. LOL. Not sure how credible this guy is. I just googled it.

Quote:
Matt Maiocco (Threads @maiocconbcs)
@MaioccoNBCS
Coach Kyle Shanahan said the decision to take the ball at the beginning of overtime was pre-determined. If both teams were tied after one possession apiece, he wanted to be the one that got the third possession, and the sudden-death advantage.


He must have not watch Mahomes play. It rarely ever gets to the point where the other team can get the ball back....
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:29 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
It's just so interesting though because it may have gotten them to overtime as opposed to losing in regulation. If the Chiefs had been down by 4 when they had the ball with just a few minutes left, they most likely are going forward in four down territory, and wouldn't you think that Mahomes would have found a way to score a touchdown in that situation? I think it's quite likely that the fact that they were only down by 3 gave the Chiefs an out to kick a tying field goal instead of going for the touchdown. That actually may have worked in San Francisco's favor.


Agreed



ChickenStu wrote:
The biggest gaffe was the decision to take the ball first in overtime. I guarantee you that heavily swung the win probability to the Chiefs. I still genuinely can't believe it and it's an hour later. Teams have known about the new overtime rules for at least a couple of years. It should have been communicated to someone a long time ago that it's obvious that you go on defense first. Does anyone go on offense first in college football in overtime, for example? Of course not.


Interesting take.

The comparison to college football isn't analogous to me. Here's why.

In college football, you're guaranteed a possession (even if the opponent scores a TD). So it makes sense to play D first and see if you need a FG or TD to tie.

In the NFL you're not. A TD ends the game.

Also, if both teams end up kicking a fg (or punting), then the team with the ball first would have the advantage of working with 1 more possession than the opposition.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:32 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
It's just so interesting though because it may have gotten them to overtime as opposed to losing in regulation. If the Chiefs had been down by 4 when they had the ball with just a few minutes left, they most likely are going forward in four down territory, and wouldn't you think that Mahomes would have found a way to score a touchdown in that situation? I think it's quite likely that the fact that they were only down by 3 gave the Chiefs an out to kick a tying field goal instead of going for the touchdown. That actually may have worked in San Francisco's favor.


Agreed



ChickenStu wrote:
The biggest gaffe was the decision to take the ball first in overtime. I guarantee you that heavily swung the win probability to the Chiefs. I still genuinely can't believe it and it's an hour later. Teams have known about the new overtime rules for at least a couple of years. It should have been communicated to someone a long time ago that it's obvious that you go on defense first. Does anyone go on offense first in college football in overtime, for example? Of course not.


Interesting take.

The comparison to college football isn't analogous to me. Here's why.

In college football, you're guaranteed a possession (even if the opponent scores a TD). So it makes sense to play D first and see if you need a FG or TD to tie.

In the NFL you're not. A TD ends the game.

Also, if both teams end up kicking a fg (or punting), then the team with the ball first would have the advantage of working with 1 more possession than the opposition.


That's incorrect. The new playoff overtime rule guarantees you get the ball, even if the other team scores an offensive TD first.

That's why ChickenStu is saying what he's saying.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:33 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
The missed extra point was the end for the Niners. It meant all the Chiefs had to do was score FGs to extend or win the game. Reid and PM are always going to get in FG range when it matters.


It's just so interesting though because it may have gotten them to overtime as opposed to losing in regulation. If the Chiefs had been down by 4 when they had the ball with just a few minutes left, they most likely are going forward in four down territory, and wouldn't you think that Mahomes would have found a way to score a touchdown in that situation? I think it's quite likely that the fact that they were only down by 3 gave the Chiefs an out to kick a tying field goal instead of going for the touchdown. That actually may have worked in San Francisco's favor.

The biggest gaffe was the decision to take the ball first in overtime. I guarantee you that heavily swung the win probability to the Chiefs. I still genuinely can't believe it and it's an hour later. Teams have known about the new overtime rules for at least a couple of years. It should have been communicated to someone a long time ago that it's obvious that you go on defense first. Does anyone go on offense first in college football in overtime, for example? Of course not.


Is it possible they didn't know the rule? Bizarre decision and Shanahan's explanation after the game (valuing the 3rd possession) didn't make much sense.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:36 pm    Post subject:

slavavov wrote:
This was by far the most painful of the 49ers' three Super Bowl losses. You almost have to start to wonder if it will take on a life of its own the next time they get there or are in the NFC Championship Game.


Both of the 49ers losses to KC were brutal, they lead for the vast majority of both of them and came up short in the 4th quarter both times.

Mahomes and Kelce were just too much, again.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:36 pm    Post subject:

That's his explanation? Holy mother of God. Again, no one goes on offense first in college OT. And it's actually even worse to go on offense first in NFL playoff OT because unlike in college, you might actually force a punt if you are on defense first. In college, of course, the offense is already in FG range, and the only way you wouldn't get to attempt a FG is if something catastrophic happens such as a turnover, a play that loses 20 yards, or a series of penalties. So in college, you're virtually assured of at least having a FG attempt to get a 3-point lead...and no one opts for that. It's just so crazy to me.

And if Shanahan was so afraid of Mahomes (and that's why he went for it on 4th and 3, if that's the logic)...you're telling me you think it's smarter to give him FOUR downs instead of maybe three? Let's say the Chiefs get the ball first in OT and they go down and score a TD. You know there's no way that Andy Reid is going for 2, so you're going to be down by 7 (assuming Butker makes the PAT). OK, so now you know you get 4 downs to try to get the touchdown. Let's say you get that touchdown. Well, now, instead of kicking the tying PAT which gives Mahomes and the Chiefs the ball in sudden death...now perhaps you go for 2 and the win. I mean, if you're that afraid of Mahomes, right?!?! Right?!?!

You just can't do it. I still think in terms of stupidity, Dan Campbell's decision to call the timeout with 3 left in that spot was the worst, since it essentially ended the game. Shanahan's decision didn't effectively end the game. But still, it should be common knowledge that you kickoff.

I would be so full of emotions if I were a 49er fan.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:38 pm    Post subject:

After seeing his reason, now I agree with you CS. That's why I said I over thinnked it after seeing that comment. LOL

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:39 pm    Post subject:

LakerLanny wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
The missed extra point was the end for the Niners. It meant all the Chiefs had to do was score FGs to extend or win the game. Reid and PM are always going to get in FG range when it matters.


It's just so interesting though because it may have gotten them to overtime as opposed to losing in regulation. If the Chiefs had been down by 4 when they had the ball with just a few minutes left, they most likely are going forward in four down territory, and wouldn't you think that Mahomes would have found a way to score a touchdown in that situation? I think it's quite likely that the fact that they were only down by 3 gave the Chiefs an out to kick a tying field goal instead of going for the touchdown. That actually may have worked in San Francisco's favor.

The biggest gaffe was the decision to take the ball first in overtime. I guarantee you that heavily swung the win probability to the Chiefs. I still genuinely can't believe it and it's an hour later. Teams have known about the new overtime rules for at least a couple of years. It should have been communicated to someone a long time ago that it's obvious that you go on defense first. Does anyone go on offense first in college football in overtime, for example? Of course not.


Is it possible they didn't know the rule? Bizarre decision and Shanahan's explanation after the game (valuing the 3rd possession) didn't make much sense.


They certainly knew the rule, based on him saying that if it's still tied after each possession, it does then turn into sudden death. If he thought it was still the old rules, he never mentioned that "of course we take the ball first, you idiots, because if we score a TD it's over!" The fact that he's mentioning that the other team gets a possession tells you he knows of the new rule of playoff OT.

And yeah, LBP, they changed the rule a couple of years ago, and now in the playoffs, each team is guaranteed an offensive possession (unless the defense scores a safety or TD on the first possession, then it's over, obviously). This was the first NFL playoff game played under those rules.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:41 pm    Post subject:

49ers reddit is on suicide watch......
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:43 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
49ers reddit is on suicide watch......


Yeah it's pretty funny in there. I feel fortunate to have seen at least 1 SB win with Montana and 1 with Young.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:48 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
It's just so interesting though because it may have gotten them to overtime as opposed to losing in regulation. If the Chiefs had been down by 4 when they had the ball with just a few minutes left, they most likely are going forward in four down territory, and wouldn't you think that Mahomes would have found a way to score a touchdown in that situation? I think it's quite likely that the fact that they were only down by 3 gave the Chiefs an out to kick a tying field goal instead of going for the touchdown. That actually may have worked in San Francisco's favor.


Agreed



ChickenStu wrote:
The biggest gaffe was the decision to take the ball first in overtime. I guarantee you that heavily swung the win probability to the Chiefs. I still genuinely can't believe it and it's an hour later. Teams have known about the new overtime rules for at least a couple of years. It should have been communicated to someone a long time ago that it's obvious that you go on defense first. Does anyone go on offense first in college football in overtime, for example? Of course not.


Interesting take.

The comparison to college football isn't analogous to me. Here's why.

In college football, you're guaranteed a possession (even if the opponent scores a TD). So it makes sense to play D first and see if you need a FG or TD to tie.

In the NFL you're not. A TD ends the game.

Also, if both teams end up kicking a fg (or punting), then the team with the ball first would have the advantage of working with 1 more possession than the opposition.


That's incorrect. The new playoff overtime rule guarantees you get the ball, even if the other team scores an offensive TD first.

That's why ChickenStu is saying what he's saying.


Didn't know that. I stand corrected on that part.

But even then, after the first 2 possessions, the team that received first would have the upper hand with having an extra possession.

But you guys might be right that it might be better to defer. I wonder what the analytics say.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:48 pm    Post subject:

Mahomes might have several years in front of him where he has an okay season, gets into the playoffs, and puts them in a position to win the Super Bowl, while not winning the regular season MVP and being far the best player in the league.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:51 pm    Post subject:

aprevo15 wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
49ers reddit is on suicide watch......


Yeah it's pretty funny in there. I feel fortunate to have seen at least 1 SB win with Montana and 1 with Young.


Grew up in the 80's when Joe Montana and the 49ers were dominating the NFL. Feels bad for 49ers fans who grew up after all the Super Bowls were won and only know losing in the big game. Kinda like those Cowboys fans who only heard stories of the Cowboys dynasty with Aikman, Emmitt, Irvin.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:53 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
That's his explanation? Holy mother of God. Again, no one goes on offense first in college OT. And it's actually even worse to go on offense first in NFL playoff OT because unlike in college, you might actually force a punt if you are on defense first. In college, of course, the offense is already in FG range, and the only way you wouldn't get to attempt a FG is if something catastrophic happens such as a turnover, a play that loses 20 yards, or a series of penalties. So in college, you're virtually assured of at least having a FG attempt to get a 3-point lead...and no one opts for that. It's just so crazy to me.

And if Shanahan was so afraid of Mahomes (and that's why he went for it on 4th and 3, if that's the logic)...you're telling me you think it's smarter to give him FOUR downs instead of maybe three? Let's say the Chiefs get the ball first in OT and they go down and score a TD. You know there's no way that Andy Reid is going for 2, so you're going to be down by 7 (assuming Butker makes the PAT). OK, so now you know you get 4 downs to try to get the touchdown. Let's say you get that touchdown. Well, now, instead of kicking the tying PAT which gives Mahomes and the Chiefs the ball in sudden death...now perhaps you go for 2 and the win. I mean, if you're that afraid of Mahomes, right?!?! Right?!?!

You just can't do it. I still think in terms of stupidity, Dan Campbell's decision to call the timeout with 3 left in that spot was the worst, since it essentially ended the game. Shanahan's decision didn't effectively end the game. But still, it should be common knowledge that you kickoff.

I would be so full of emotions if I were a 49er fan.


Completely forgot about the 2 point conversion. This would have made my original opinion different.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:55 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
Mahomes might have several years in front of him where he has an okay season, gets into the playoffs, and puts them in a position to win the Super Bowl, while not winning the regular season MVP and being far the best player in the league.


Chiefs have the system figured out. Play good enough to get to the tournament and then dominate.
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