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alleyoop
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2025 9:18 pm    Post subject:

PICKnPOP wrote:
alleyoop wrote:
PICKnPOP wrote:
alleyoop wrote:
PICKnPOP wrote:
They should move Rui for Lonzo. He fits what we’re trying to do imo.

You could always try for both

Lonzo/Vooch for Rui/Gabe/Vando/JHS

Not sure what kind of pick capital you’d have to give up though, with them taking on Vando’s deal

FWIW we probably can’t trade Rui without getting equal or better scoring punch back


I kinda want to keep one of Vando or Rui because we need wings.

We could do Bruce brown and Robert Williams

Or Lonzo and Williams without giving up both Vando and Rui. I think it would make for better roster balance

Rui and JHS for Lonzo
Gabe and hayes for Williams


AD/Williams
Lebron/wood
DFS/vando
Max/Dalton
Austin/ Lonzo

I still don't love that we're decreasing our offensive firepower with those trades. Lonzo and Brown are good defensive guards, but they don't provide a lot on the offensive end right now, especially for what they're being paid

I guess the main fix to that would be to get Kessler or Sharpe, plus Brown or Lonzo, without trading Rui. But then again, we'll probably have to pay extra to 'get off of' Vando's contract


What if Austin is moved to the bench? I agree with what you’re saying but I think defense might be more important. There’s only one ball and it will be in the hands of AD, Lebron, and Austin.

I'd like having the comfortability of a reliable-ish fourth scoring option if possible

Past three champs have all had four 15+ppg scorers. 21 Bucks had three, but then had 4 more at 10pp or more

That said, I do agree that upgrading the defense in some way is important, too. If we can find a way to do it whilst not downgrading the offense, I'm all for it
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governator
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 8:22 am    Post subject:

Can we pull of something like:

Rui+Cam+’29 FRP+pick swap+’27 unprotect for Sexton+Kessler
Hope Wood can fill in Rui’s stretch big role. With Sexton/Milton on board, wouldn’t mind moving Gabe+Hayes+JHS+ the remaining SRPs for Bogdan Bogdanovich. Maybe prorate Lonnie Walker IV at min, does the math work?

Sexton-Milton-Oliveri
AR-Bogdanovich-Bronny-LW4
Vando-DFS-Max
Bron-Wood-Traore
AD-Kessler-Koloko
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Hanging from Rafters
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 8:45 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Can we pull of something like:

Rui+Cam+’29 FRP+pick swap+’27 unprotect for Sexton+Kessler
Hope Wood can fill in Rui’s stretch big role. With Sexton/Milton on board, wouldn’t mind moving Gabe+Hayes+JHS+ the remaining SRPs for Bogdan Bogdanovich. Maybe prorate Lonnie Walker IV at min, does the math work?

Sexton-Milton-Oliveri
AR-Bogdanovich-Bronny-LW4
Vando-DFS-Max
Bron-Wood-Traore
AD-Kessler-Koloko


Need better defense in the back court, AR/Sexton would be a disaster.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 10:40 am    Post subject:

I could see a Collins/Sexton package, seems like the Jazz FO really loves Kessler, Collins is better then Rui and Sexton gives us another ball handler, something like that could materialize before the trade deadline involving the Lakers and Jazz
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alleyoop
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 10:43 am    Post subject:

Inspector Gadget wrote:
I could see a Collins/Sexton package, seems like the Jazz FO really loves Kessler, Collins is better then Rui and Sexton gives us another ball handler, something like that could materialize before the trade deadline involving the Lakers and Jazz

I can’t, that’s a LOT of salary to match
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 11:05 am    Post subject:

Also if you want a Wish.com Shaun Livingston for backup point guard, there's always 6'9 Point Guard Dalano Banton on the Blazers




Don't expect him to be a savior, he's a 'when engaged' player like Hachimura, higher upside defensively, but for a backup 1 whose contract is basically a rookie sized deal, you can do far worse.
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pjiddy
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 11:28 am    Post subject:

Inspector Gadget wrote:
I could see a Collins/Sexton package, seems like the Jazz FO really loves Kessler, Collins is better then Rui and Sexton gives us another ball handler, something like that could materialize before the trade deadline involving the Lakers and Jazz


I can def see the Lakers making not one but two non-needle-moves.
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Kobe_Is_King13
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 11:39 am    Post subject:

Rui/Reaves/Gabe/JHS + 2nd for Lavine
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governator
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 12:00 pm    Post subject:

Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
Rui/Reaves/Gabe/JHS + 2nd for Lavine


Basically upgrading AR to LaVine and subbing Wood for Rui, only work if LeBron takes the MLE next year
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 12:21 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
Rui/Reaves/Gabe/JHS + 2nd for Lavine


Basically upgrading AR to LaVine and subbing Wood for Rui, only work if LeBron takes the MLE next year


Don't think we need Rui eith Lavine here. The main reason Rui is critical is because we don't have a dependable 3rd option and LeBron is 40. With Lavine we get a guy that you KNOW can score it night in night out. Lavine is an underrated passer as well. He's basically a more consistent, more athletic, better 3pt shooting version of Reaves

Lavine, Max,DFS, Bron and AD is a hyper athletic lineup. Go sign minimum guys like Dennis Smith Jr and Lonnie Walker and we really might have something
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 12:23 pm    Post subject:

I'd love a way to get Lonzo back.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 12:28 pm    Post subject:

Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
governator wrote:
Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
Rui/Reaves/Gabe/JHS + 2nd for Lavine


Basically upgrading AR to LaVine and subbing Wood for Rui, only work if LeBron takes the MLE next year


Don't think we need Rui eith Lavine here. The main reason Rui is critical is because we don't have a dependable 3rd option and LeBron is 40. With Lavine we get a guy that you KNOW can score it night in night out. Lavine is an underrated passer as well. He's basically a more consistent, more athletic, better 3pt shooting version of Reaves

Lavine, Max,DFS, Bron and AD is a hyper athletic lineup. Go sign minimum guys like Dennis Smith Jr and Lonnie Walker and we really might have something


Your third option is Reaves whom in that position is giving us 22 a game.

That's about as good as you could ask for on a third option. No third option is putting up 25-27 a game. They are effectively a high end role player, and they shouldn't be getting paid first option money AND they shouldn't be expected to put up first option numbers.

If you got a third option that gives you 18-20 a night for less than 20M which is already a rarity means that any move to replace them is just a more expensive lateral move that weakens your team for the same statistical impact.

You basically trade 20 ppg as a third option + depth
for 21 ppg as a third option with no depth.

if it hasn't been clear watching what's happened with Phoenix and Bradley Beal, the lesson should have been learned with Westbrook.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 12:45 pm    Post subject:

Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
Rui/Reaves/Gabe/JHS + 2nd for Lavine


Rui, Vando, and Gabe .. you don’t give up Reaves for them. You give up Rui though and have 4 options to attack teams easily. Tell Max and DFS defend they ass off and go with it
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 12:48 pm    Post subject:

Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
Rui/Reaves/Gabe/JHS + 2nd for Lavine


I would love this*. When we have to sit Reaves because defenses are absolutely cooking him and scoring at will, they can do the same (or worse) to Lavine. And it would secure our identity as a team of strictly one-way players that can't get past the play-in for another 3 years.



*if i'm a fan of any other team.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 12:49 pm    Post subject:

Day wrote:
I'd love a way to get Lonzo back.


Same. He’d be perfect if he was healthy
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 1:56 pm    Post subject:

pjiddy wrote:
Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
Rui/Reaves/Gabe/JHS + 2nd for Lavine


I would love this*. When we have to sit Reaves because defenses are absolutely cooking him and scoring at will, they can do the same (or worse) to Lavine. And it would secure our identity as a team of strictly one-way players that can't get past the play-in for another 3 years.



*if i'm a fan of any other team.


Weird logic when we would be trading 2 guys who have the same issue on defense. Rui and Reaves already get torched in our starting 5. Trading them allows DFS to start which helps the defense and you upgrade Reaves to an objectively better version of himself.

You aren't really losing anything at all. You're gaining a dynamic and athletic scorer
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 1:58 pm    Post subject:

Would you give up Reaves and Knecht for Kessler and Trae?

Hawks get:
Reaves
Rui
Gabe
Wood
pick/s

Jazz get:
Knecht
JHS
Vando
Hayes
Take protection off pick

Lakers get:
Trae
Kessler
Sexton
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 2:09 pm    Post subject:

Lonzo coming back would be great, gives us the chance to get LaMelo, dealing with LaVar would be a headache and I think the Lakers organization doesn’t want to deal with the drama anymore so I’m wondering if he prefers both of his sons on the Clippers
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 2:18 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
Rui/Reaves/“Vando”/JHS + 2nd for Lavine


Basically upgrading AR to LaVine and subbing Wood for Rui, only work if LeBron takes the MLE next year


The things the Lakers need the most are;
1) a starting PG who can make plays, score, and play defense
-Schroeder?
2) a back up C that can rebound and defend
-Richards?
3) a dynamic shot creator as a legitimate 3rd scoring option
-LaVine?

The scenario on the previous prior post needs to have a slight tweak (in bold) to better entice the other teams and an agreement already in place that it will be followed up immediately with:
”Vincent”/Knecht/Hayes flipped for Richards/Schroeder
(Knecht/Hayes to Char; Vincent/2ndRP to GSW) then yea!

AD/Richards
LBJ/Wood
DFS
Lavine/Max
Schroeder

And:
Cam/Shake/Bronny

Plus:
Koloko/Traore/(Olivari and/or DennisSmithJR)

This would put the Lakers in play for a ship build now, on a timeline with AD post LBJ, and perserve the FPS for the future.

I believe there are many Laker fans however that would prefer AR/Knecht…over the Lakers…so much that they wouldn’t even evaluate this upgrade lol!
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When it’s a reasonable possibility, I expect the Lakers to go after a ship like it can’t be denied. I haven’t seen a respectable effort by the Front Office for the last two off seasons nor the last trade deadline. What is going on?


Last edited by Hanging from Rafters on Mon Jan 13, 2025 2:24 pm; edited 2 times in total
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alleyoop
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 2:23 pm    Post subject:

Still don’t know why you’d bother to pay 30+mil salary more to a single player for ‘more athleticism’
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Hanging from Rafters
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 2:43 pm    Post subject:

alleyoop wrote:
Still don’t know why you’d bother to pay 30+mil salary more to a single player for ‘more athleticism’


Perhaps the “more athleticism” could translate into not getting abused as much defensively and it’s more than just “more athleticism”. It also includes much better shot creation/efficiency with ^6ppg (24vs18), ^8%FG (52vs44), and ^9%3pt (45vs36). The 1 less assist is negligible for playmaking since it’s from a SG vs PG with all else about the same. Those parameters together with the ability to acquire without having to give up a FRP could potentially be a significant impact.
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When it’s a reasonable possibility, I expect the Lakers to go after a ship like it can’t be denied. I haven’t seen a respectable effort by the Front Office for the last two off seasons nor the last trade deadline. What is going on?
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 3:19 pm    Post subject:

I didn't know Myles Turner was on an expiring contract.
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alleyoop
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 3:32 pm    Post subject:

Hanging from Rafters wrote:
alleyoop wrote:
Still don’t know why you’d bother to pay 30+mil salary more to a single player for ‘more athleticism’


Perhaps the “more athleticism” could translate into not getting abused as much defensively and it’s more than just “more athleticism”. It also includes much better shot creation/efficiency with ^6ppg (24vs18), ^8%FG (52vs44), and ^9%3pt (45vs36). The 1 less assist is negligible for playmaking since it’s from a SG vs PG with all else about the same. Those parameters together with the ability to acquire without having to give up a FRP could potentially be a significant impact.

I mean, since coming back from injury and without DLo, Austin's averaged 21ppg and 7.5apg. Yes, it remains to seen whether he'll keep it up, but he's a clear player of value right now that's probably not that different to LaVine defensively (though I'm basing my evaluation of the latter on reputation more than anything)

On LaVine, as well - 1) his usage rate almost certainly goes down with us, and 2) that 3pt percentage is a pretty significant historic outlier

I'm not doubting that LaVine isn't a more dynamic player, but 30mil better?
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Hanging from Rafters
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 3:55 pm    Post subject:

alleyoop wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
alleyoop wrote:
Still don’t know why you’d bother to pay 30+mil salary more to a single player for ‘more athleticism’


Perhaps the “more athleticism” could translate into not getting abused as much defensively and it’s more than just “more athleticism”. It also includes much better shot creation/efficiency with ^6ppg (24vs18), ^8%FG (52vs44), and ^9%3pt (45vs36). The 1 less assist is negligible for playmaking since it’s from a SG vs PG with all else about the same. Those parameters together with the ability to acquire without having to give up a FRP could potentially be a significant impact.

I mean, since coming back from injury and without DLo, Austin's averaged 21ppg and 7.5apg. Yes, it remains to seen whether he'll keep it up, but he's a clear player of value right now that's probably not that different to LaVine defensively (though I'm basing my evaluation of the latter on reputation more than anything)

On LaVine, as well - 1) his usage rate almost certainly goes down with us, and 2) that 3pt percentage is a pretty significant historic outlier

I'm not doubting that LaVine isn't a more dynamic player, but 30mil better?


That’s a hefty price tag for sure. Not good defense vs hunted on defense is a significant difference however, plus the efficiency difference is significant as well. Even if the valid points come true about usage reduction and efficiency going down, the difference is big enough to still realize a big improvement and the ISO shot creation ability looks to be a pivotal upgrade of a 3rd scoring option as well.

Still, you’re right to question if it will translate to good value at the cost. I’d prefer a deal to get a PG/C/3rdOption keeping AR/Knecht…they are fan favorites…but for me it’s team 1st so I’d still do the deal if a ship roster is constructed as a result and a better deal is not available. I wouldn’t do the deal hoping for additional ship upgrades tho. The only way I’d trade AR is if it is part of a comprehensive roster upgrade to reasonable ship expectation status as one of the favorites.
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When it’s a reasonable possibility, I expect the Lakers to go after a ship like it can’t be denied. I haven’t seen a respectable effort by the Front Office for the last two off seasons nor the last trade deadline. What is going on?
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2025 4:28 pm    Post subject:

Outspoken wrote:
I didn't know Myles Turner was on an expiring contract.


Yup, but the Pacers are apparently not inspired to move him.
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