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ChickenStu
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Joined: 25 Apr 2015
Posts: 31912
Location: Anaheim, CA
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 Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2022 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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| jodeke wrote: | Omar Little wrote: | jodeke wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Opinions are like (Y) everybody has one. I don't know Chappell's reasons for speaking as he did. Those who think they do are opining. The trans understood and accepted. Why is it so difficult for others too? |
You don’t know Dave’s reason for doubling tripling and quadrupling down on transphobic remarks? At some point you have to believe people when they show you who they are. |
I don't know the reasons. I've been played and I stay on guard for what the perp is doing and why. The trans accepted Dave's response. Why can't you? Chappell may be as you envision. I leave the door open. |
The trans? Is that like the gays?
I don't think they are same. IMO trans is a choice, gay is inbread.
I know a lot of trans people including my son who have not and do not accept Dave’s half ass attempt to deflect and then going right back to saying what he really means.
You have first hand knowledge I can't compete with. My stance is an opinion. I don't know and stay on alert for a stance I can live with. Is Dave CHA? I don't know and without solid evidence won't form an opinion. |
You're going down a track you don't want to go down. I'm not trans, but I am gay, and I can tell you that just as I had no choice in terms of what I was attracted to, trans people do not have a choice as to what feels right to them. As to what gender they feel they should be. I can appreciate that you seem aware that us gay folk have no choice, but you should carry that logic onto trans people as well. I had enough issues with coming out, but I can't even imagine the difficulties that trans people face. It's not a choice like deciding what to wear. I think you probably mean well, but I'd encourage you to educate yourself a little more on the subject.
By the way, I was one that had defended statements of Chappelle in the past in regard to the transphobia stuff. I thought (and still think) that's it's OK to make trans jokes on stage, depending on how you construct the joke, what the exaggeration is, etc. I thought that because he befriended a fellow trans comedian and also financially supported her daughter with a college fund that there was no way he should be criticized for any trans-related flak. Well, guess what? I was wrong. Just because he did those things does not absolve you from criticism, and I should have seen that earlier.
I'm sure Omar could speak to this much better than I can, but yes, I'd encourage you to educate yourself further on this. |
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DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52654
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | Omar Little wrote: | jodeke wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Opinions are like (Y) everybody has one. I don't know Chappell's reasons for speaking as he did. Those who think they do are opining. The trans understood and accepted. Why is it so difficult for others too? |
You don’t know Dave’s reason for doubling tripling and quadrupling down on transphobic remarks? At some point you have to believe people when they show you who they are. |
I don't know the reasons. I've been played and I stay on guard for what the perp is doing and why. The trans accepted Dave's response. Why can't you? Chappell may be as you envision. I leave the door open. |
The trans? Is that like the gays?
I don't think they are same. IMO trans is a choice, gay is inbread.
I know a lot of trans people including my son who have not and do not accept Dave’s half ass attempt to deflect and then going right back to saying what he really means.
You have first hand knowledge I can't compete with. My stance is an opinion. I don't know and stay on alert for a stance I can live with. Is Dave CHA? I don't know and without solid evidence won't form an opinion. |
You're going down a track you don't want to go down. I'm not trans, but I am gay, and I can tell you that just as I had no choice in terms of what I was attracted to, trans people do not have a choice as to what feels right to them. As to what gender they feel they should be. I can appreciate that you seem aware that us gay folk have no choice, but you should carry that logic onto trans people as well. I had enough issues with coming out, but I can't even imagine the difficulties that trans people face. It's not a choice like deciding what to wear. I think you probably mean well, but I'd encourage you to educate yourself a little more on the subject.
By the way, I was one that had defended statements of Chappelle in the past in regard to the transphobia stuff. I thought (and still think) that's it's OK to make trans jokes on stage, depending on how you construct the joke, what the exaggeration is, etc. I thought that because he befriended a fellow trans comedian and also financially supported her daughter with a college fund that there was no way he should be criticized for any trans-related flak. Well, guess what? I was wrong. Just because he did those things does not absolve you from criticism, and I should have seen that earlier.
I'm sure Omar could speak to this much better than I can, but yes, I'd encourage you to educate yourself further on this. |
Brilliant and poignant post.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 67620
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2022 8:20 am Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | Omar Little wrote: | jodeke wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Opinions are like (Y) everybody has one. I don't know Chappell's reasons for speaking as he did. Those who think they do are opining. The trans understood and accepted. Why is it so difficult for others too? |
You don’t know Dave’s reason for doubling tripling and quadrupling down on transphobic remarks? At some point you have to believe people when they show you who they are. |
I don't know the reasons. I've been played and I stay on guard for what the perp is doing and why. The trans accepted Dave's response. Why can't you? Chappell may be as you envision. I leave the door open. |
The trans? Is that like the gays?
I don't think they are same. IMO trans is a choice, gay is inbread.
I know a lot of trans people including my son who have not and do not accept Dave’s half ass attempt to deflect and then going right back to saying what he really means.
You have first hand knowledge I can't compete with. My stance is an opinion. I don't know and stay on alert for a stance I can live with. Is Dave CHA? I don't know and without solid evidence won't form an opinion. |
You're going down a track you don't want to go down. I'm not trans, but I am gay, and I can tell you that just as I had no choice in terms of what I was attracted to, trans people do not have a choice as to what feels right to them. As to what gender they feel they should be. I can appreciate that you seem aware that us gay folk have no choice, but you should carry that logic onto trans people as well. I had enough issues with coming out, but I can't even imagine the difficulties that trans people face. It's not a choice like deciding what to wear. I think you probably mean well, but I'd encourage you to educate yourself a little more on the subject.
By the way, I was one that had defended statements of Chappelle in the past in regard to the transphobia stuff. I thought (and still think) that's it's OK to make trans jokes on stage, depending on how you construct the joke, what the exaggeration is, etc. I thought that because he befriended a fellow trans comedian and also financially supported her daughter with a college fund that there was no way he should be criticized for any trans-related flak. Well, guess what? I was wrong. Just because he did those things does not absolve you from criticism, and I should have seen that earlier.
I'm sure Omar could speak to this much better than I can, but yes, I'd encourage you to educate yourself further on this.
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I'll take the advice of one living the life. Your asking to view trans choice the same as gays is something I will give thought to. I consider your opinion as one with knowledge on the subject on a higher tier than I do one such as myself who's opining, you're living the life. I appreciate your response and applaud you for revealing your status.
As an aside. Suggested reading Giovanni's Room, by James Baldwin. It's a book so well written one can understand how it's possible for a man to truly love another man in the Merriam-Webster definition of love. It's been banned in some places. | Quote: | | Giovanni's Room by James Baldwin. And it was banned because it's a really frank and open discussion of one guy falling in love for another guy, and he's not okay with that and meanwhile to complicate things he's also in love with a woman. When I first read the book, I mean I was living the situation of the book. |
Giovanni's Room was descriptively well written I felt as though I was living the situation.
Another aside: Today Biden signed into law the Respect For Marriage/Marriage Equality Bill
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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