八村塁 RUI HACHIMURA
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wolfpaclaker
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 3:17 am    Post subject:

tox wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
mhan00 wrote:
I hope people see why Rui is important now.


Yeah, I'm happily eating crow. Need him back.

I gotta go and delete the 30 trade proposals I made of him in the last 3 months

I would still await the playoffs. Right now what I see is that they're a lot of really good RS teams. We're one of them. We certainly have enough star talent to win a ring. We have enough talent. Do the pieces all fit and compliment each other on a championship level? That's going to be determined in the playoffs.

That's why I think we should wait. Some posters were ready to sell Reaves away now we hear some comparing him to HOFs. Even with Reaves, I'd wait to see what happens in the playoffs.

Depth wins you RS games, cores win you titles. We'll have a great sense about the core of Hayes/Rui/Lebron/Reaves/Doncic after the playoffs. Do you keep roling with them? Do you make a change? Why? You'll know better after the playoffs IMO.
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tox
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 3:35 am    Post subject:

Agreed wolf but I also think you can't overreact to one playoffs (see: 2021, Caruso & KCP ). But at the same time you can learn plenty about a player (e.g. DLO in high leverage situations is just not reliable enough to have as one of your key rotation players)
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drae
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 4:26 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
tox wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
mhan00 wrote:
I hope people see why Rui is important now.


Yeah, I'm happily eating crow. Need him back.

I gotta go and delete the 30 trade proposals I made of him in the last 3 months

I would still await the playoffs. Right now what I see is that they're a lot of really good RS teams. We're one of them. We certainly have enough star talent to win a ring. We have enough talent. Do the pieces all fit and compliment each other on a championship level? That's going to be determined in the playoffs.

That's why I think we should wait. Some posters were ready to sell Reaves away now we hear some comparing him to HOFs. Even with Reaves, I'd wait to see what happens in the playoffs.

Depth wins you RS games, cores win you titles. We'll have a great sense about the core of Hayes/Rui/Lebron/Reaves/Doncic after the playoffs. Do you keep roling with them? Do you make a change? Why? You'll know better after the playoffs IMO.


Boston just won a title with depth. You cannot win a title in this current landscape with just a few stars, teams have tried the 3 star thing with no depth and have kept crashing out. You need a great TEAM now with plenty of depth.

Also you have to be crazy to give away a 40% 3 point shooter who just mauled Jokic on defense the other month. He also, over his career, is a 47% 3 point shooter in the playoffs. These players don't grow on trees, you keep these people and develop them. Also he's on Luka and Austin's timeline.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 6:40 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
tox wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
mhan00 wrote:
I hope people see why Rui is important now.


Yeah, I'm happily eating crow. Need him back.

I gotta go and delete the 30 trade proposals I made of him in the last 3 months

I would still await the playoffs. Right now what I see is that they're a lot of really good RS teams. We're one of them. We certainly have enough star talent to win a ring. We have enough talent. Do the pieces all fit and compliment each other on a championship level? That's going to be determined in the playoffs.

That's why I think we should wait. Some posters were ready to sell Reaves away now we hear some comparing him to HOFs. Even with Reaves, I'd wait to see what happens in the playoffs.

Depth wins you RS games, cores win you titles. We'll have a great sense about the core of Hayes/Rui/Lebron/Reaves/Doncic after the playoffs. Do you keep roling with them? Do you make a change? Why? You'll know better after the playoffs IMO.


Gotta do a better job surrounding Luka than that squad. Hayes come on now. Rui meh. And Lebron's last day could be any day. We need our 2nd star to be younger to match Luka's window. Luka has already proven that he will take a squad of bums to the WCF.

Also when Reaves is up for renewal he will probably want max $$ based on how he's playing and he's not worth it. But don't let me tell you all this, let's just wait for the playoffs.
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Lakesh0wtime
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 7:17 am    Post subject:

Snipes wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
tox wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
mhan00 wrote:
I hope people see why Rui is important now.


Yeah, I'm happily eating crow. Need him back.

I gotta go and delete the 30 trade proposals I made of him in the last 3 months

I would still await the playoffs. Right now what I see is that they're a lot of really good RS teams. We're one of them. We certainly have enough star talent to win a ring. We have enough talent. Do the pieces all fit and compliment each other on a championship level? That's going to be determined in the playoffs.

That's why I think we should wait. Some posters were ready to sell Reaves away now we hear some comparing him to HOFs. Even with Reaves, I'd wait to see what happens in the playoffs.

Depth wins you RS games, cores win you titles. We'll have a great sense about the core of Hayes/Rui/Lebron/Reaves/Doncic after the playoffs. Do you keep roling with them? Do you make a change? Why? You'll know better after the playoffs IMO.


Gotta do a better job surrounding Luka than that squad. Hayes come on now. Rui meh. And Lebron's last day could be any day. We need our 2nd star to be younger to match Luka's window. Luka has already proven that he will take a squad of bums to the WCF.

Also when Reaves is up for renewal he will probably want max $$ based on how he's playing and he's not worth it. But don't let me tell you all this, let's just wait for the playoffs.


I guess we don’t need to watch the rest of the season then
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MJST
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 7:26 am    Post subject:

I think Hayes is more important than Rui for the team when it comes to players we can't afford to be missing. But Rui is very important in terms of putting this team over the hump particularly when the Playoffs roll around.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 7:48 am    Post subject:

Lakesh0wtime wrote:
Snipes wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
tox wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
mhan00 wrote:
I hope people see why Rui is important now.


Yeah, I'm happily eating crow. Need him back.

I gotta go and delete the 30 trade proposals I made of him in the last 3 months

I would still await the playoffs. Right now what I see is that they're a lot of really good RS teams. We're one of them. We certainly have enough star talent to win a ring. We have enough talent. Do the pieces all fit and compliment each other on a championship level? That's going to be determined in the playoffs.

That's why I think we should wait. Some posters were ready to sell Reaves away now we hear some comparing him to HOFs. Even with Reaves, I'd wait to see what happens in the playoffs.

Depth wins you RS games, cores win you titles. We'll have a great sense about the core of Hayes/Rui/Lebron/Reaves/Doncic after the playoffs. Do you keep roling with them? Do you make a change? Why? You'll know better after the playoffs IMO.


Gotta do a better job surrounding Luka than that squad. Hayes come on now. Rui meh. And Lebron's last day could be any day. We need our 2nd star to be younger to match Luka's window. Luka has already proven that he will take a squad of bums to the WCF.

Also when Reaves is up for renewal he will probably want max $$ based on how he's playing and he's not worth it. But don't let me tell you all this, let's just wait for the playoffs.


I guess we don’t need to watch the rest of the season then


So you’re saying this squad is good enough to compete with teams like Okc/Bos/Cle on a year to year basis going forward?

I’m not talking about this year. We took a giant leap forward with the Luka trade, but this team still needs more to compete with the legit contenders. That will take a couple of off seasons to build.
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defense
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 7:50 am    Post subject:

Snipes wrote:
Lakesh0wtime wrote:
Snipes wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
tox wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
mhan00 wrote:
I hope people see why Rui is important now.


Yeah, I'm happily eating crow. Need him back.

I gotta go and delete the 30 trade proposals I made of him in the last 3 months

I would still await the playoffs. Right now what I see is that they're a lot of really good RS teams. We're one of them. We certainly have enough star talent to win a ring. We have enough talent. Do the pieces all fit and compliment each other on a championship level? That's going to be determined in the playoffs.

That's why I think we should wait. Some posters were ready to sell Reaves away now we hear some comparing him to HOFs. Even with Reaves, I'd wait to see what happens in the playoffs.

Depth wins you RS games, cores win you titles. We'll have a great sense about the core of Hayes/Rui/Lebron/Reaves/Doncic after the playoffs. Do you keep roling with them? Do you make a change? Why? You'll know better after the playoffs IMO.


Gotta do a better job surrounding Luka than that squad. Hayes come on now. Rui meh. And Lebron's last day could be any day. We need our 2nd star to be younger to match Luka's window. Luka has already proven that he will take a squad of bums to the WCF.

Also when Reaves is up for renewal he will probably want max $$ based on how he's playing and he's not worth it. But don't let me tell you all this, let's just wait for the playoffs.


I guess we don’t need to watch the rest of the season then


So you’re saying this squad is good enough to compete with teams like Okc/Bos/Cle on a year to year basis going forward?

I’m not talking about this year. We took a giant leap forward with the Luka trade, but this team still needs more to compete with the legit contenders. That will take a couple of off seasons to build.


This is an unknown, that wont be answered until the playoffs. Wait for it!
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wolfpaclaker
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 1:21 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
Agreed wolf but I also think you can't overreact to one playoffs (see: 2021, Caruso & KCP ). But at the same time you can learn plenty about a player (e.g. DLO in high leverage situations is just not reliable enough to have as one of your key rotation players)

Trading KCP and Kuz for a 3rd star wasn’t the bad move especially if you kept Caruso and THT, had some depth with some youth instead of just signing old washed guys. Remember we also added Reaves that year. Caruso, THT, Reaves and Monk would have given us enough youth and energy that was lost with KCP/Kuz going .

The issue was whom we traded for. Just such a bad fit since he can’t shoot and can’t play without the ball. Combined with letting Caruso go, and then also using vet mins all on washed old players…… imo that was the mistake.

Let’s say we had traded for DWhite and Porzingis both of whom were traded within the coming months of the 2021 trade debacle. I think we’d have been more than happy. Porzingis got moved for 2nd rounders and role guys and White cost 1 FrP and 1 pick swap.

I think you can lose 1-2 core guys even on a title team. Just not dismantle the complete lot like Pelinka likes to do. I’m not advocating trading Rui, Reaves, and letting DFS + Hayes all go if we lose in the playoffs. I’m just saying we probably will know what areas and players are more expendable. 1-2 changes with upgrades can definitely make a difference.

Basically unless we win a title, I am open to moving anyone not named Doncic if it’s an upgrade and makes the team as a whole better. Have to think about building a winner around LD.
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tox
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 5:31 pm    Post subject:

Snipes wrote:
Lakesh0wtime wrote:


I guess we don’t need to watch the rest of the season then


So you’re saying this squad is good enough to compete with teams like Okc/Bos/Cle on a year to year basis going forward?

I’m not talking about this year. We took a giant leap forward with the Luka trade, but this team still needs more to compete with the legit contenders. That will take a couple of off seasons to build.

I would've agreed with you right after the trade but somehow this team is still elite defensively. Does that hold up in the playoffs? That's what we'll find out.
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tox
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 5:34 pm    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
tox wrote:
Agreed wolf but I also think you can't overreact to one playoffs (see: 2021, Caruso & KCP ). But at the same time you can learn plenty about a player (e.g. DLO in high leverage situations is just not reliable enough to have as one of your key rotation players)

Trading KCP and Kuz for a 3rd star wasn’t the bad move especially if you kept Caruso and THT, had some depth with some youth instead of just signing old washed guys. Remember we also added Reaves that year. Caruso, THT, Reaves and Monk would have given us enough youth and energy that was lost with KCP/Kuz going .

The issue was whom we traded for. Just such a bad fit since he can’t shoot and can’t play without the ball. Combined with letting Caruso go, and then also using vet mins all on washed old players…… imo that was the mistake.

Let’s say we had traded for DWhite and Porzingis both of whom were traded within the coming months of the 2021 trade debacle. I think we’d have been more than happy. Porzingis got moved for 2nd rounders and role guys and White cost 1 FrP and 1 pick swap.

I think you can lose 1-2 core guys even on a title team. Just not dismantle the complete lot like Pelinka likes to do. I’m not advocating trading Rui, Reaves, and letting DFS + Hayes all go if we lose in the playoffs. I’m just saying we probably will know what areas and players are more expendable. 1-2 changes with upgrades can definitely make a difference.

Basically unless we win a title, I am open to moving anyone not named Doncic if it’s an upgrade and makes the team as a whole better. Have to think about building a winner around LD.

Totally agree, I guess my point about KCP was mostly that he was terrible in the '21 playoffs and people were eager to get rid of him and we regretted it later. One bad series isn't the end of the world especially for shooters who are high variance. Obviously he wasn't untouchable.

The Lakers are in a great situation to improve because they can bring back their entire core and still upgrade via Kleber's salary. To say nothing of LBJ deciding to take a paycut to open up tpMLE or even ntMLE. Although Hayes' new contract might eat into that
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drae
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 5:36 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
tox wrote:
Agreed wolf but I also think you can't overreact to one playoffs (see: 2021, Caruso & KCP ). But at the same time you can learn plenty about a player (e.g. DLO in high leverage situations is just not reliable enough to have as one of your key rotation players)

Trading KCP and Kuz for a 3rd star wasn’t the bad move especially if you kept Caruso and THT, had some depth with some youth instead of just signing old washed guys. Remember we also added Reaves that year. Caruso, THT, Reaves and Monk would have given us enough youth and energy that was lost with KCP/Kuz going .

The issue was whom we traded for. Just such a bad fit since he can’t shoot and can’t play without the ball. Combined with letting Caruso go, and then also using vet mins all on washed old players…… imo that was the mistake.

Let’s say we had traded for DWhite and Porzingis both of whom were traded within the coming months of the 2021 trade debacle. I think we’d have been more than happy. Porzingis got moved for 2nd rounders and role guys and White cost 1 FrP and 1 pick swap.

I think you can lose 1-2 core guys even on a title team. Just not dismantle the complete lot like Pelinka likes to do. I’m not advocating trading Rui, Reaves, and letting DFS + Hayes all go if we lose in the playoffs. I’m just saying we probably will know what areas and players are more expendable. 1-2 changes with upgrades can definitely make a difference.

Basically unless we win a title, I am open to moving anyone not named Doncic if it’s an upgrade and makes the team as a whole better. Have to think about building a winner around LD.

Totally agree, I guess my point about KCP was mostly that he was terrible in the '21 playoffs and people were eager to get rid of him and we regretted it later. One bad series isn't the end of the world especially for shooters who are high variance. Obviously he wasn't untouchable.

The Lakers are in a great situation to improve because they can bring back their entire core and still upgrade via Kleber's salary. To say nothing of LBJ deciding to take a paycut to open up tpMLE or even ntMLE. Although Hayes' new contract might eat into that


KCP was also one of the reasons the Nuggets won also. And one of the reasons they're no longer winning is they had to move KCP because they foolishly gave Porter Jr an unholy amount.

KCP undervalued everywhere he goes 3 and D players who shoot 40% from 3 are the types of players who help win you titles *looks at Rui*
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2025 7:39 pm    Post subject:

Imagine if Bronny has a crazy 2nd half and leads the Lakers to a victory.

It's unlikely...

But just think about WHAT IF.

Holy crap that would be crazy The next King anointed
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2025 4:57 am    Post subject:

^
Been mentioning KCP's value big time. Totally agree on his value. I just feel if you got the right 3rd star, considering that you would also have the option of keeping Caruso, you could negate the defense lost with KCP if your 3rd star could shoot. Caruso+3rd star + 2 superstars was enough of a change, because you'd still have some core players (your 2 stars, Caruso, THT, etc) back. It was the whole sale changes.

So while I agree Rui has held his own and held value to his 17M deal, and Reaves is a steal at the MLE, both are movable in my book if you have roster stabllity around them. I love Hayes but even him, same thing. 1-2 changes can go a LONG way.

Just look at the improvement with this team when they moved DLO for DFS. That's really when our defense improved. Go back and trace the season's steps. When we finally got rid of the DLO/Austin lineups, that's when the team's defense began to stablize.

Now fast forward to this offseason if we have info on some of our role guys like we had on DLO/Austin, we definitely should consider a trade, even if the player going out is better on offense. DLO is a better player than DFS in terms of regular season value for offense and what he can do for you individually. What I know is after the playoffs we'll have a great idea of what Rui/Austin/Hayes as a core guys look around Luka/Lebron. That's how you have to plan for the coming 2 years after that you'd have a great idea of what's needed.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2025 1:17 pm    Post subject:

Ignoring my post which was supposed to be in the game thread vs Bucks just above...

It's possible that we currently have the best #1 player in basketball.
It's possible that we currently have the best #1-#2 combo in basketball.
It's possible that we currently have the best #1-#2-#3 combo in basketball.

None of these statements can be definitively proven but they are all definitely arguably true as well.

I think Rui could *arguably* be considered at least a top-tier #4 player.

Jaxson is doing awesome as the #5 player in the starting lineup right now.

The playoffs will definitely tell a lot, although it's still only a small sample size. But if there's any time when it's "don't fix what ain't broken" (going into the off-season too)—this sure seems like the time.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 1:48 am    Post subject:

OKC vs. Lakers:

Luka < Shai (Only a slight advantage though)
LBJ > Williams
Reaves = Chet
Rui < Dort
Hayes < Hartenstein

Lakers vs. Celtics:

Luka > Tatum
LBJ > Brown
Reaves = White
Rui < Porzingis
Hayes < Holiday

Lakers vs. Cavs:
Luka > Mobley
LBJ > Mitchell
Reaves = Garland
Rui < Allen
Hayes < Hunter

Lakers vs. Nuggets:
Luka < Jokic
LBJ > Murray
Reaves > Gordon
Rui = MPJ
Hayes = Braun?

Kind of a pointless exercise but just wanted to see where we stack up against the top teams. Reaves is a tough player to evaluate against other elite third options, he's probably the best scorer but guys like White, Chet, Garland, and Gordon provide a lot of value in other ways.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 2:10 am    Post subject:

^
Unfortunately I don't think it's an individual assessment/competition when you talk about basketball teams in the playoffs. I believe it's about match ups and then how your team plays around those matchups advantages and disadvantages.

We have at least 1 match up advantage always with Luka/Lebron. Whomever is going off, or on, should get the ball. Then it's about what the defense gives us. Teams will sag off defensive players we have - who have limited offense. Hayes gets buckets because of that. Rui is another guy that can feast if left open.

The teams that concern me are the teams that would play us 1 on 1 with Luka/Lebron. We saw that with Boston, they can switch it up with doubles and then also go 1 on 1 defensively against our stars. With their wings they don't seem to be afraid to go 1 on 1 defensively against Luka as well. When the team doesn't need to help on Luka/Lebron, that's when you'll know the value of a Rui/Reaves/Hayes etc in a playoff setting.

Same thing for us on defense. When we decide to play elite teams on defense in the playoffs, what are our tactics with regards to doubles/help/man D? Where do Rui/Reaves/Hayes etc fit in those situations. That's the beauty of the playoffs you get to see those things play out and you know more about your core.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 2:37 am    Post subject:

Lakeshow23_ wrote:
OKC vs. Lakers:



Lakers vs. Celtics:

Luka > Tatum
LBJ > Brown
Reaves = White
Rui < Porzingis
Hayes < Holiday



Kind of a pointless exercise but just wanted to see where we stack up against the top teams. Reaves is a tough player to evaluate against other elite third options, he's probably the best scorer but guys like White, Chet, Garland, and Gordon provide a lot of value in other ways.



You forgot to add JJ >>>> Mazzulla
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 3:06 am    Post subject:

SGA needs to show that he is better than Luka in the POs. There haven a lot of great RS players that in the POs choke. LeBron (duh), Luka and AR have already showed that they are great PO players.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 3:26 am    Post subject:

On the subject of Rui, I really hope that his injury doesn't turn chronic nor linger like it did for Dr. J's career. Which is why I believe they are being so cautious.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 5:39 am    Post subject:

RI Laker wrote:
Lakeshow23_ wrote:
OKC vs. Lakers:



Lakers vs. Celtics:

Luka > Tatum
LBJ > Brown
Reaves = White
Rui < Porzingis
Hayes < Holiday



Kind of a pointless exercise but just wanted to see where we stack up against the top teams. Reaves is a tough player to evaluate against other elite third options, he's probably the best scorer but guys like White, Chet, Garland, and Gordon provide a lot of value in other ways.



You forgot to add JJ >>>> Mazzulla


Celtics 1-6 is a beast, all 6 can defend, both bigs can move their feet, all 6 can stretch and you can dump the ball to all 6 to get a bucket in a crunch… we def have the top 1, maybe 2 (Bron vs Tatum) but they are the most difficult match up in the league… I fully expect to see them in the finals and take them down in 6 in LA with Luka going nuclear revenge series
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 11:14 am    Post subject:

Welcome back bro, let's make quick work of da Bulls tonight to ease ya back.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 6:21 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
RI Laker wrote:
Lakeshow23_ wrote:
OKC vs. Lakers:



Lakers vs. Celtics:

Luka > Tatum
LBJ > Brown
Reaves = White
Rui < Porzingis
Hayes < Holiday



Kind of a pointless exercise but just wanted to see where we stack up against the top teams. Reaves is a tough player to evaluate against other elite third options, he's probably the best scorer but guys like White, Chet, Garland, and Gordon provide a lot of value in other ways.



You forgot to add JJ >>>> Mazzulla


Celtics 1-6 is a beast, all 6 can defend, both bigs can move their feet, all 6 can stretch and you can dump the ball to all 6 to get a bucket in a crunch… we def have the top 1, maybe 2 (Bron vs Tatum) but they are the most difficult match up in the league… I fully expect to see them in the finals and take them down in 6 in LA with Luka going nuclear revenge series


Going just a bit deeper shows the challenge; Pritchard/Horford/Hauser.
The Lakers counter with Goodwin/Gabe < Prichard, maybe DFS > Horford? and perhaps Knecht/Vando > Hauser?

Hayes vs Porzingis -2
LBJ vs Tatum +1
Rui vs Brown -2
AR vs White =
Luka vs Jrue +3

Goodwin/Gabe vs Pritchard -2
Knecht/Vando vs Hauser +1
DFS vs Horford +1

That tie is too close for comfort, some ratings could swing a point either way. I think it looks like the Lakers are 1 man short (Kessler?/Richards?/Williams?). If the Lakers med staff was scared of Williams long term then I am too! Too bad he couldn’t be leased short term (1 year? Maybe 2 or 3?) for a ship with an amended trade sending out Cam/Wood/Protected1st.
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When reasonably possible, I expect the Lakers to go after a ship like it can’t be denied. I haven’t seen a completely committed effort by the GM for the last 2 off seasons nor the last 2 trade deadlines. What is going on?
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MJST
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 8:58 pm    Post subject:

Should have started to get into a rhythm. Dfs starting against s guard heavy lineup where they could switch on him when he's weak guarding guards allowed the Bulls to eventually find a rhythm and never looked back.
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How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
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miggz23
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2025 9:20 pm    Post subject:

Rui is just not as productive off the bench. I know he was in minute restriction. I feel like he just floats around more off the bench.
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