Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 63194 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 11:39 am Post subject: Tyre Nichols killed by 5 Memphis police officers
The video of Tyre's beating will be released today. I hope it doesn't prompt violence. I'm almost positive these officers won't get the treatment as Laurence Powell, Theodore Briseno, and Timothy Wind the White officers who beat Rodney King.
The Nichols family press conference.
LINK _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Last edited by jodeke on Fri Jan 27, 2023 1:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 51319 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 12:27 pm Post subject:
I updated the pinned BLM thread at the top of the forum for this case. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 63194 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 12:43 pm Post subject:
DaMuleRules wrote:
I updated the pinned BLM thread at the top of the forum for this case.
I saw that. I posted there. I think Tyre should have an independent thread where he can be the topic. BLM is convoluted. Relating to the family video LAPD is on alert. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 63194 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 4:37 pm Post subject:
That was violent. Nichols was kicked, tased and knockout punched. It was heart-wrenching hearing Trye calling for his mother. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Street CrimesOperation to Restore Peace In Our Nneighborhoods SCORPION unit is under scruinty. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Last edited by jodeke on Fri Jan 27, 2023 6:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
I read descriptions then decided to watch some of it. As a parent, I don”t think I want to see the whole thing. Just so violent.
We really need to address the cultures in police departments. It’s “us versus them.” It’s my tribe against your tribe. The empathy they have only extends to their small circle. It’s ethnocentric. It is disconnected from the community instead of part of the community. You have to start building love and kindness into the system one small step at a time, layer upon layer upon layer until it starts to build into something of substance.
(Corrupt institutions cannot be assuaged by 'the talk' or other concessions: Glaude)
Quote:
Eddie Glaude, chair of the Department of African-American Studies at Princeton University, talks with Alex Wagner about the futility of putting the responsibility for police violence on people of color for not being sufficiently deferential or accommodating when the system is pre-geared for violence.
Joined: 05 Nov 2005 Posts: 10692 Location: Hoosier Nation
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 4:10 am Post subject:
Police need to keep getting arrested, tried, and convicted for their despicable actions. At some point maybe police will think twice before they beat someone to death over a traffic stop or petty crime.
Edit: I don't mean to generalize here. I know not all police are rageaholics. But the ones who are need to be sent a message. _________________ Not a legend
Just saw the body cam, so sad/scary/infuriating, they beat the (bleep) out of him on the ground, this was murder. Some of u guys are seasoned lawyers, setting aside emotion, what would be the PD defense? Nichols wasn’t resisting on the body cam, just crying out ‘mom’s
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 63194 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 10:16 am Post subject:
Now starts the rinse and repeat concerns about the need for police reform. Until those at the top of the ladder are held accountable nothing will change. Chief Cerelyn Davis and a Memphis jury can set a precedent.
Once it's set unless White officers are dealt with as I'm almost sure these Black officers will be there won't be a change. I'm not sure because I don't have the stats but I think most brutality is committed by White officers. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
(Paul Butler: “This is warrior policing on steroids”)
Quote:
As we follow the nationwide outrage over the videos of Memphis police officers beating Tyre Nichols that lead to his death, Paul Butler, Professor at Georgetown Law and author of “Chokehold” joins Ali to discuss the videos, the charges against the officers, and the state of policing in America. “He does what I would have done,” says Butler of Nichols’ instinct to run after the initial beating. He credits the pressure put on by the movement for Black lives for the swift charges and transparency. “One of the ironies of this video is that if these officers weren’t in uniform and badges, the same thing that happened to Mr. Nichols could have happened to them.”
Joined: 03 Oct 2003 Posts: 7437 Location: Santa Monica
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 1:00 am Post subject:
What maddening about these incidents is the attempts at police reform, only to have conservatives claim that police reform is somehow making it hard for cops to do their job. Now you have politicians who are running on a platform of reversing police reform so that "cops can do their job."
It sounds like the new kind of racism and gaslighting: claiming that a problem doesn't exist and that fixing that problem is the real problem.
What maddening about these incidents is the attempts at police reform, only to have conservatives claim that police reform is somehow making it hard for cops to do their job. Now you have politicians who are running on a platform of reversing police reform so that "cops can do their job."
It sounds like the new kind of racism and gaslighting: claiming that a problem doesn't exist and that fixing that problem is the real problem.
If theres any hope its that this is a generational gap. The old folks that are running the show have polar opposite views of the people protesting out in the streets.
What maddening about these incidents is the attempts at police reform, only to have conservatives claim that police reform is somehow making it hard for cops to do their job. Now you have politicians who are running on a platform of reversing police reform so that "cops can do their job."
It sounds like the new kind of racism and gaslighting: claiming that a problem doesn't exist and that fixing that problem is the real problem.
If theres any hope its that this is a generational gap. The old folks that are running the show have polar opposite views of the people protesting out in the streets.
have you not seen the ages of the killers? You see these internal police gangs are all youngish men.
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 63194 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:48 pm Post subject:
Halflife wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
slavavov wrote:
What maddening about these incidents is the attempts at police reform, only to have conservatives claim that police reform is somehow making it hard for cops to do their job. Now you have politicians who are running on a platform of reversing police reform so that "cops can do their job."
It sounds like the new kind of racism and gaslighting: claiming that a problem doesn't exist and that fixing that problem is the real problem.
If theres any hope its that this is a generational gap. The old folks that are running the show have polar opposite views of the people protesting out in the streets.
have you not seen the ages of the killers? You see these internal police gangs are all youngish men.
The anger is with our youth on both sides. Old folks are apathetic.
No we ain't Old Folks _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
What maddening about these incidents is the attempts at police reform, only to have conservatives claim that police reform is somehow making it hard for cops to do their job. Now you have politicians who are running on a platform of reversing police reform so that "cops can do their job."
It sounds like the new kind of racism and gaslighting: claiming that a problem doesn't exist and that fixing that problem is the real problem.
If theres any hope its that this is a generational gap. The old folks that are running the show have polar opposite views of the people protesting out in the streets.
have you not seen the ages of the killers? You see these internal police gangs are all youngish men.
The anger is with our youth on both sides. Old folks are apathetic.
I'm talking about the people going out there and protesting. At least here in LA it was mostly young people in their 20's.
Joined: 22 Apr 2001 Posts: 1670 Location: Cerritos, California
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 9:41 am Post subject:
governator wrote:
Just saw the body cam, so sad/scary/infuriating, they beat the (bleep) out of him on the ground, this was murder. Some of u guys are seasoned lawyers, setting aside emotion, what would be the PD defense? Nichols wasn’t resisting on the body cam, just crying out ‘mom’s
There is no defense. But individual officers may request varying charges based upon level of involvement.
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 63194 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:55 am Post subject:
What disturbs me is the officers tried to justify their actions by shouting false commands. They shouted "get on the ground" when he was already on the ground. They shouted "put your hands behind your back" when his hands were behind his back and other commands they thought were veiled.
They made sure their body cams were in positions to not record their actions. What they didn't know a surveillance camera on a pole was recording them. Had it not been for that camera they may have gotten away with beating Tyre. A beating he later died because of.
I know it won't happen but when they're convicted and given jail time I wish they'd them put in the GP. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
What maddening about these incidents is the attempts at police reform, only to have conservatives claim that police reform is somehow making it hard for cops to do their job. Now you have politicians who are running on a platform of reversing police reform so that "cops can do their job."
It sounds like the new kind of racism and gaslighting: claiming that a problem doesn't exist and that fixing that problem is the real problem.
If theres any hope its that this is a generational gap. The old folks that are running the show have polar opposite views of the people protesting out in the streets.
Maybe if you are stepping back and looking at it 50 or 100 years from now. Cultural evolution will do it's thing over time. But in the next 10 years? The older generations in the police unions still have a ton of influence, so maybe that helps there since there is so much old school mentality and it starts to move along. But even then, I don't think it makes a big difference. The culture needs a thousand little changes over years, not one or two things. It's like water on rock, nothing is going to change unless it's constantly/relentlessly working on it and over a long period of time.
You bring in new officers, what's going to happen? Not much different. The culture will impose itself on them and they will get in line with the way things are done.
Some of the more progressive forces out there are looking for different types of background experience in their hiring. (I've worked on this with them and it's really great to see some of the young people they are trying to bring in.) But if the culture is still crap, they're going to either get bullied into going along with how things are done. Or they are going to make a lateral move to another city somewhere else and still nothing changes. You see so many in law enforcement who don't feel they can speak up in public because of this relentless bullcrap.
For reform, you also have to acknowledge that there are a lot of loving/caring law enforcement officers. They are humans and believe in love and community. You have to start with finding the commonalities and connecting. If you come in there with your own us vs. them approach, they will just circle the wagons. They will contract like most people naturally do when under attack.
Obviously, taking care of the clearly criminal cops should be easier (again police unions, conservatives, etc., make this really, really difficult). But we will be back here again and again because you are 3 to 4 times more likely to be killed by our police than in any other country. You have to address the factory that pumps them out. BUT WE WILL NEVER GET ANYWHERE unless everyone starts walking in each others shoes more and quit making it an us versus them issue.
The more progressive communities and law enforcement need to lead the way. They need to be more experimental and look for more alternative solutions. Then maybe you can get some peer-to-peer momentum and pressure into the more troubled areas. There won't be one radical change that magically fixes this. I do think we need to embrace more and more kindness initiatives on city wide levels. Challenge local law enforcement to do the same. There needs to be hundreds of little changes that turn into something with more substance and make us more loving to each other.
Joined: 22 Apr 2001 Posts: 1670 Location: Cerritos, California
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 12:46 pm Post subject:
jodeke wrote:
What disturbs me is the officers tried to justify their actions by shouting false commands. They shouted "get on the ground" when he was already on the ground. They shouted "put your hands behind your back" when his hands were behind his back and other commands they thought were veiled.
They made sure their body cams were in positions to not record their actions. What they didn't know a surveillance camera on a pole was recording them. Had it not been for that camera they may have gotten away with beating Tyre. A beating he later died because of.
I know it won't happen but when they're convicted and given jail time I wish they'd them put in the GP.
Unfortunately, this is what officers do. Another popular phrase is stating, "stop resisting," even when the person is not resisting. Also, its hard to put your hand behind your back when being pepper sprayed in the face--the immediate reaction is to grab at your face/eyes which are likely burning. Total nonsense. And, there is no need to approach a car with multiple officers, with guns blazing, and have the suspect get on the ground for (what at worst) was a traffic offense. Total Nonsense. All of it.
Joined: 03 Oct 2003 Posts: 7437 Location: Santa Monica
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 8:50 pm Post subject:
DancingBarry wrote:
Some of the more progressive forces out there are looking for different types of background experience in their hiring. (I've worked on this with them and it's really great to see some of the young people they are trying to bring in.) But if the culture is still crap, they're going to either get bullied into going along with how things are done. Or they are going to make a lateral move to another city somewhere else and still nothing changes.
i remember reading a New Yorker article about the white cop who murdered Michael Brown in Ferguson, Mo. He tried to learn how to relate to black people, and there was another white cop who was good at relating to black people whom he looked up to. But that other cop left, and it looked like the culture eventually got to him.
I wonder why police culture in our country is so much more violent and authoritarian than that in, say, Canada, the U.K. or Australia, the countries that are most similar to us. I've even read and heard that cops in some countries don't even carry guns, such as China, which is surprising.
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 63194 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2023 11:13 am Post subject:
Caused me to wonder if the adequate assessment protocols had been followed would Tyre have lived? This incident stinks to high heaven on many levels. Two of those employees are black. I usually capitalize Black and White. I won't in this case.
2 EMTs, lieutenant involved in Tyre Nichols’ assault fired
EMT-Basic Robert Long and EMT-Advance JaMicheal Sandridge made the scene where Tyre Nichols was located handcuffed on the ground and leaning against a police vehicle approximately at 8:41 p.m. The driver of Engine 55, Lieutenant Michelle Whitaker, remained inside the fire engine.
_________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
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