Anything could happen but the best predictor of future performance is past performance. I hope Hayes performs much better than he has over the last 4 years but the odds don’t favor it, he most likely will be who he has been. Realizing he is a long shot with his emergence only thought of as a bonus then he would be a decent gamble but expecting his emergence as part of the initial plan for winning is irresponsible and shows a lack of commitment to a championship pursuit.
The gamble on a player like Hayes to turn it around is more suited for a team without realistic championship aspirations such as a lottery team trying to get to the playin, or perhaps a playin team trying to get a better seed. Expecting a player like Hayes to change his game…acquiring him with hope that his contributions would be a bonus is ok…but counting on a player to have to improve to the point where he would have to be a different player as much as Hayes would need to improve isn’t something a team gambles on with with championship aspirations.
Eh. The pressure of being a lottery pick is now off as he is a minimum deal player. On the Pels, they were hoping he was a foundational player for the team, which obviously he was not.
On this team, he has a more limited set of duties and expectations and I think he can meet those. Compare him to what we were using last year (undersized Wenyen) or an oft injured Mo who had not motor?
pio2u wrote:
What should Lakers fans expect from Jaxson Hayes?
Quote:
Jaxson Hayes’ tenure was a mixed bag throughout his four years in New Orleans.
His length and athleticism are first-class, as evidenced by a mountain of highlight dunks, defensive plays and soaring rebounds.
His fundamentals, understanding of the game and motor though — while all improved since his rookie season — still lack that desired consistency.
The lack of motor has been used to describe them both.
The difference in MoBa and Hayes is that MoBa has shown the production in the past whereas Hayes hasn’t. MoBa needs to show he can do it again but Hayes has to do something he has not shown he can do. Perhaps he can. Let’s hope so.
Hoping for the past production to return for MoBa and hoping for the future production to emerge for Hayes would have been a decent gamble if we had them both. Gambling on either one of them by themself shows imo a lack of commitment to a ship run or lack of understanding of a roster construction needed for such.
Hopefully being around "Adults" (LBR/AD) will provide a Role Model/Example/Standard for Hayes to follow. Plus LBR/AD/Ham will NOT allow stupidity and unprofessionalism seap into the locker room - otherwise they will be instantly jettisoned.
Hayes can bang with the Big Boys while MoBa appears to be too frail/think to be able to bang with most of his skillset seemingly on the perimeter where a Christian Woods/Morris/Green would probably put up better numbers.
Hayes weighs 10 pounds less than Bamba and struggles to play the 5. He's not banging with any Big Boys. _________________ It was reminiscent of one of those Most Interesting Man in the World advertisements: "I don't always shoot 6-for-28 from the field, but when I do, I become the youngest player in league history to score 28,000 career points."
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 143614 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2023 8:59 am Post subject:
Yeah, I don’t see why anyone would think that Hayes is some kind of banger. He relies on athleticism, not brawn. And that isn’t even considering if he has the desire to body up bigger centers. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
For comparison, Javale McGee weighed 270 and had a 4.5 GPA in high school. People kinda act as if players like him grow on trees. _________________ It was reminiscent of one of those Most Interesting Man in the World advertisements: "I don't always shoot 6-for-28 from the field, but when I do, I become the youngest player in league history to score 28,000 career points."
The gamble on Thomas Bryant last year included signing Damien Jones as insurance such that if TB wasn’t able to regain his pre-injury production then perhaps DJ could emerge into a player he hasn’t shown himself to be yet. It was a decent gamble as either one could flake out but the risk was mitigated by having both. Just having Hayes this year imo would have been like just signing Jones by himself without adding Bryant. You just don’t do that if you have a realistic commitment to a run at a title. _________________ “When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.”
Yeah, I don’t see why anyone would think that Hayes is some kind of banger. He relies on athleticism, not brawn. And that isn’t even considering if he has the desire to body up bigger centers.
Agree. It revolves around expectations of how a player fits into the overall roster puzzle.
I do not expect Hayes to be a physical presence in the Lopez or Adams mold. Or be as skilled as Jokic or Embid. He is not those players.
Hayes is a role player. His athleticism “should” fit in nicely IMO. His activity to get a hand on a ball, extend out to defend a shooter or run the court on a break is where he will excel on this roster.
I would love to see him earn around 20 mpg. Anything more would be fantastic! But unexpected.
Lakers do not need him to be a star. They just need quality mpg that I think he can deliver. Just need to keep the expectations realistic. There are several players on the roster that I have similar thoughts on. Just contribute. Simple as that.
More and more rumblings that the Lakers want to start Hayes next to Davis.
Starters:
D'Angelo Russell
Austin Reaves
LeBron James
Anthony Davis
Jaxson Hayes
Bench:
Gabe Vincent
Max Christie / Cam Reddish
Taurean Prince
Rui Hachimura
Jarred Vanderbilt _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
More and more rumblings that the Lakers want to start Hayes next to Davis.
Starters:
D'Angelo Russell
Austin Reaves
LeBron James
Anthony Davis
Jaxson Hayes
Bench:
Gabe Vincent
Max Christie / Cam Reddish
Taurean Prince
Rui Hachimura
Jarred Vanderbilt
Starting Hayes means you have a max of 2 shooters. I get the need to support AD for stretches with a 5, but you need 3 shooters around them or even AD won't be able to operate in mid range.
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 143614 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Fri Aug 04, 2023 1:46 pm Post subject:
With Hayes playing neither AD or Lebron will have room to work in the paint, whoever is guarding Hayes can leave him open. Evidently many here and in the FO want to relive the past, 2020 is 3-4 years in the rear view mirror. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
With Hayes playing neither AD or Lebron will have room to work in the paint, whoever is guarding Hayes can leave him open. Evidently many here and in the FO want to relive the past, 2020 is 3-4 years in the rear view mirror.
We want that pick n roll action, Bron/DLo/Reaves/Max/Gabe can make the other big work on D
With Hayes playing neither AD or Lebron will have room to work in the paint, whoever is guarding Hayes can leave him open. Evidently many here and in the FO want to relive the past, 2020 is 3-4 years in the rear view mirror.
Because Vando gave them great room? He literally had the paint sealed off the last two rounds. The jumper is decent enough to hit at a rate higher than Vando
With Hayes playing neither AD or Lebron will have room to work in the paint, whoever is guarding Hayes can leave him open. Evidently many here and in the FO want to relive the past, 2020 is 3-4 years in the rear view mirror.
Because Vando gave them great room? He literally had the paint sealed off the last two rounds. The jumper is decent enough to hit at a rate higher than Vando
In 2020, Javale and AD played together and I think it worked because Javale was a serious lob threat. If Hayes (no doubt a serious lob threat) man tries to leave him open, they will lobe it up near the rim and give up a slam dunk which is worse than giving up a 3.
Now one thing ADs 3 point shot was better in 2020. But even if AD is standing in the corner 3 for example, his man wasn't pulled out of the paint because AD doesn't hit them at a high enough volume to do that..even in 2020.
So I can see how Hayes and AD can work on paper at least.
Joined: 13 Jan 2002 Posts: 7726 Location: Lake Forest
Posted: Fri Aug 04, 2023 10:36 pm Post subject:
lar9149 wrote:
Kblo247! wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
With Hayes playing neither AD or Lebron will have room to work in the paint, whoever is guarding Hayes can leave him open. Evidently many here and in the FO want to relive the past, 2020 is 3-4 years in the rear view mirror.
Because Vando gave them great room? He literally had the paint sealed off the last two rounds. The jumper is decent enough to hit at a rate higher than Vando
In 2020, Javale and AD played together and I think it worked because Javale was a serious lob threat. If Hayes (no doubt a serious lob threat) man tries to leave him open, they will lobe it up near the rim and give up a slam dunk which is worse than giving up a 3.
Now one thing ADs 3 point shot was better in 2020. But even if AD is standing in the corner 3 for example, his man wasn't pulled out of the paint because AD doesn't hit them at a high enough volume to do that..even in 2020.
So I can see how Hayes and AD can work on paper at least.
Butterfinger Vando couldn't do anything with the ball in the paint. Hayes should be better than Vando was last year. Hopefully Vanod improves.....
To the people going "Davis needs to be a solid three point shooter for that to work or the offense is stagnant." Needs to go back and watch how the Lakers used Davis in 2019 while McGee and Howard were on the floor. McGee and Howard were there to finish lobs on overhelps and pick and rolls. The majority of the offense flowed through Davis in the paint and from the post.
For a 3 year span Davis shot 2-3 threes a game at 32% so he could occasionally hit one but it wasn't reliant to your offense. He could occasionally get hot from there but he wasn't a reliable three point shooter. He was most reliable from the post and from mid. If Davis can keep up that efficiency that will open up the court enough. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 143614 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 6:39 pm Post subject:
Kblo247! wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
With Hayes playing neither AD or Lebron will have room to work in the paint, whoever is guarding Hayes can leave him open. Evidently many here and in the FO want to relive the past, 2020 is 3-4 years in the rear view mirror.
Because Vando gave them great room? He literally had the paint sealed off the last two rounds. The jumper is decent enough to hit at a rate higher than Vando
Ha do didn’t give them better spacing but he brought elite defense. We get neither from Hayes. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
I think we are definitely going to experiment with starting Hayes. They will give it a run. If it doesn't do well, I'm sure Ham will revert to the same sort of lineups as last year.
Some people may not like Hayes, but Pelinka/Ham see him as a AD/McGee type. That may be an insult to those 2 (especially Dwight) but when you get that kind of praise from Pelinka, you're going to get some PT.
I mean he didn't talk about his way about Bamba, Jones, TBryant etc.
I think we are definitely going to experiment with starting Hayes. They will give it a run. If it doesn't do well, I'm sure Ham will revert to the same sort of lineups as last year.
Some people may not like Hayes, but Pelinka/Ham see him as a AD/McGee type. That may be an insult to those 2 (especially Dwight) but when you get that kind of praise from Pelinka, you're going to get some PT.
I mean he didn't talk about his way about Bamba, Jones, TBryant etc.
He did talk like this about DeAndre and Drummond though. It's hard to tell when Rob is being genuine or giving lip service and I don't know what evidence he's going off of when he says Hayes can be a starter, rim protector, screen setter etc. I think they'll attempt to start Hayes and it won't take long to see it's not a good idea. Where I think Hayes will find success is in small ball lineups next to Rui. As others have pointed out, he's more of a 4 so he should be able to keep up with other teams when they go small. _________________ It was reminiscent of one of those Most Interesting Man in the World advertisements: "I don't always shoot 6-for-28 from the field, but when I do, I become the youngest player in league history to score 28,000 career points."
I think we are definitely going to experiment with starting Hayes. They will give it a run. If it doesn't do well, I'm sure Ham will revert to the same sort of lineups as last year.
Some people may not like Hayes, but Pelinka/Ham see him as a AD/McGee type. That may be an insult to those 2 (especially Dwight) but when you get that kind of praise from Pelinka, you're going to get some PT.
I mean he didn't talk about his way about Bamba, Jones, TBryant etc.
Given the large number of roster changes, I expect Ham will experiment with a lot of different lineup combinations. I wouldn't be surprised if Hayes starting is in the mix.
I wouldn't put much significance into any comments Pelinka and Ham make about players. There really isn't a reason for them to make anything but positive remarks about Hayes at this point (and, yes, they said positive things about those other guys too).
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