Do we need a new GM / Front Office
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Hanging from Rafters
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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2024 8:28 pm    Post subject:

miggz23 wrote:
Big Game James wrote:
youcantguardme wrote:
Rob is doing what he can with the limitations that the organization has...


How is it that so many people forget the two massive mistakes Pelinka made that destroyed this team's chances at winning more than a single championship?

Yes, Westbrook was one of them.

The second was in overpaying for Davis, a catastrophic mistake that we are still suffering from today! No way we should have had to add draft picks (nonetheless four) to make the Davis trade when we were already giving up multiple top lottery picks (Ingram, Ball, De'Andre Hunter) and Josh Hart. Davis was going to leave the Pelicans the following year for nothing and no other teams were bidding for him! But there went our foolish Pelinka forking over everything we had, bidding against himself!

Yeah, count me as one who wants to clean house in the front office!


I thought he's biggest mistake was not bringing back that 2020 team.

Which led to all the decisions above.


Nah, it was a mistake for sure breaking up the ship team…Dwight/Rondo particularly…but I’ve said it somewhere here before, Rob fixed messing up the ship team adding Schroeder and getting Drummond later on the buy out market. The Lakers started very well that year before injuries to LBJ/AD and looked to be handling the Suns…eventual west conf champs…in the playoffs before AD went down.

It was the following year that killed it. Reports were that Rob rejected Schroeder’s request to comeback for cheap to back up Westbrook, Drummond signed for vet min elsewhere, and the Lakers also let Kief walk, plus they chose THT over Caruso seemingly forgetting that Caruso started in the ship close out game.

Not only that but Pelinka should have lost his job signing 8 short guards and 8 over the hill former Lakers with DeAndre Jordan and Melo. That season is unforgivable. Instead he got an extension after that.

Oh yea, the AD overpay, and Vogel over Lue were mistakes too, covered up by the bubble ship.
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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2024 9:33 pm    Post subject:

Forget new GM… We need a new owner, not a bunch of trust funders.
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2024 7:44 am    Post subject:

Hanging from Rafters wrote:
miggz23 wrote:
Big Game James wrote:
youcantguardme wrote:
Rob is doing what he can with the limitations that the organization has...


How is it that so many people forget the two massive mistakes Pelinka made that destroyed this team's chances at winning more than a single championship?

Yes, Westbrook was one of them.

The second was in overpaying for Davis, a catastrophic mistake that we are still suffering from today! No way we should have had to add draft picks (nonetheless four) to make the Davis trade when we were already giving up multiple top lottery picks (Ingram, Ball, De'Andre Hunter) and Josh Hart. Davis was going to leave the Pelicans the following year for nothing and no other teams were bidding for him! But there went our foolish Pelinka forking over everything we had, bidding against himself!

Yeah, count me as one who wants to clean house in the front office!


I thought he's biggest mistake was not bringing back that 2020 team.

Which led to all the decisions above.


Nah, it was a mistake for sure breaking up the ship team…Dwight/Rondo particularly…but I’ve said it somewhere here before, Rob fixed messing up the ship team adding Schroeder and getting Drummond later on the buy out market. The Lakers started very well that year before injuries to LBJ/AD and looked to be handling the Suns…eventual west conf champs…in the playoffs before AD went down.

It was the following year that killed it. Reports were that Rob rejected Schroeder’s request to comeback for cheap to back up Westbrook, Drummond signed for vet min elsewhere, and the Lakers also let Kief walk, plus they chose THT over Caruso seemingly forgetting that Caruso started in the ship close out game.

Not only that but Pelinka should have lost his job signing 8 short guards and 8 over the hill former Lakers with DeAndre Jordan and Melo. That season is unforgivable. Instead he got an extension after that.

Oh yea, the AD overpay, and Vogel over Lue were mistakes too, covered up by the bubble ship.


Letting Schro walk the first time around, nevermind AC fresh and big penguin, and putting a team of NBA burn outs next to the most poorly constructed “big 3” of all time was probably the single worst off season in franchise history. Somehow Rob/Klutch made the Magic HIV announcement/retirement season more bearable.

Unlike a lot of the spoiled Laker fans that cry out “championship or bust cause we are the Lakers” I know too well what “bust” really means here. It means unwatchable basketball for 99% of the years and then maybe you get lucky one year out of 10-15 when the stars align. I’d much have a reason to watch every night with a competitive team on the floor and a clear multi year vision from the FO. The Lakers haven’t had that since Jerry West left. Honestly they haven’t. The new FO would have traded Kobe his rookie year for whatever big name they could get their hands on. Zero vision. Superficial. Star (bleep).
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2024 8:55 am    Post subject:

Is this a rhetorical question?
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2024 4:30 pm    Post subject:

This team needs an enema.
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2024 4:43 pm    Post subject:

take a poll and see if anybody votes no, lol
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2024 5:22 pm    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:
Forget new GM… We need a new owner, not a bunch of trust funders.


Yup.
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2024 5:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Do we need a new GM / Front Office

danzag wrote:
Jeanie is happy to hear some more Kobe stories from Pelinka


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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2024 4:22 pm    Post subject:

Snipes wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
Forget new GM… We need a new owner, not a bunch of trust funders.


Yup.


I had to resurrect this thread. The Times Laker beat writer, Dan Woike, mentioned the name Kurt Rambis in his newsletter today. The mention of his name jarred me awake. I really hadn't thought much about his presence, nor his influence. I realize now just how much the owner is being influenced by Rambis & wife.

The league landscape has changed significantly since the Jerry Buss days. I actually find Jeanie likeable, but damn, I wish she'd sell the team as soon as possible.

We need an owner who is ready to compete with the guy moving his team to their new home on Century & Prairie.
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2024 4:34 pm    Post subject:

For sure. It certainly starts with ownership.
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2024 7:05 pm    Post subject:

Do you even need to ask this question? LOL
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2024 7:23 pm    Post subject:

FO still lives in the fantasy land and believes every megastar free agent will flock to them. It didn't happen with AD because of the sheer number of assets given up, and it certainly isn't happening with guys like Luka, Giannis or Ant.

They don't understand the value of draft picks in the context of the current era, and how refined players are coming into the league today, so why should we care? They clearly don't. They devalue young talent and discard them like candy.
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2024 7:25 pm    Post subject:

whoever is the GM/FO will have a hard time building a team around a 40yo centerpiece
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2024 8:04 pm    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
whoever is the GM/FO will have a hard time building a team around a 40yo centerpiece


100%.
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2024 9:37 pm    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
whoever is the GM/FO will have a hard time building a team around a 40yo centerpiece


who was the reason they won their 17th championship. With Lebron, you have to subtract 10 from the age so pretend he's a 30 year old NBA player rn.
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 3:02 am    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
whoever is the GM/FO will have a hard time building a team around a 40yo centerpiece


That GM/FO needs to do that “hard job” they’ve s been counted on to do. That GM/FO also has two All NBA players plus role players that won a lot of games as starters so the challenge may be no more than what they’re expected to do.

The biggest challenge, imo, is for the GM/FO to rescue themself from their own failed knee jerk tendency to let go of the wrong players resulting in a downgraded team from the year before. Evaluate the team on accomplishments compared to deficiencies then add players to fit and fix it. Don’t just add bodies or a 3rd star that doesn’t even upgrade the team on paper just to feel good about the allure of change.
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 6:57 am    Post subject:

kfkilla wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
miggz23 wrote:
Big Game James wrote:
youcantguardme wrote:
Rob is doing what he can with the limitations that the organization has...


How is it that so many people forget the two massive mistakes Pelinka made that destroyed this team's chances at winning more than a single championship?

Yes, Westbrook was one of them.

The second was in overpaying for Davis, a catastrophic mistake that we are still suffering from today! No way we should have had to add draft picks (nonetheless four) to make the Davis trade when we were already giving up multiple top lottery picks (Ingram, Ball, De'Andre Hunter) and Josh Hart. Davis was going to leave the Pelicans the following year for nothing and no other teams were bidding for him! But there went our foolish Pelinka forking over everything we had, bidding against himself!

Yeah, count me as one who wants to clean house in the front office!


I thought he's biggest mistake was not bringing back that 2020 team.

Which led to all the decisions above.


Nah, it was a mistake for sure breaking up the ship team…Dwight/Rondo particularly…but I’ve said it somewhere here before, Rob fixed messing up the ship team adding Schroeder and getting Drummond later on the buy out market. The Lakers started very well that year before injuries to LBJ/AD and looked to be handling the Suns…eventual west conf champs…in the playoffs before AD went down.

It was the following year that killed it. Reports were that Rob rejected Schroeder’s request to comeback for cheap to back up Westbrook, Drummond signed for vet min elsewhere, and the Lakers also let Kief walk, plus they chose THT over Caruso seemingly forgetting that Caruso started in the ship close out game.

Not only that but Pelinka should have lost his job signing 8 short guards and 8 over the hill former Lakers with DeAndre Jordan and Melo. That season is unforgivable. Instead he got an extension after that.

Oh yea, the AD overpay, and Vogel over Lue were mistakes too, covered up by the bubble ship.


Letting Schro walk the first time around, nevermind AC fresh and big penguin, and putting a team of NBA burn outs next to the most poorly constructed “big 3” of all time was probably the single worst off season in franchise history. Somehow Rob/Klutch made the Magic HIV announcement/retirement season more bearable.

Unlike a lot of the spoiled Laker fans that cry out “championship or bust cause we are the Lakers” I know too well what “bust” really means here. It means unwatchable basketball for 99% of the years and then maybe you get lucky one year out of 10-15 when the stars align. I’d much have a reason to watch every night with a competitive team on the floor and a clear multi year vision from the FO. The Lakers haven’t had that since Jerry West left. Honestly they haven’t. The new FO would have traded Kobe his rookie year for whatever big name they could get their hands on. Zero vision. Superficial. Star (bleep).


I can't disagree with anything said on this thread. Spot on how the Lakers squandered an opportunity to field a title contending team for several more years and replaced it with some of the worst basketball I've ever seen, for myopic reasons. The answer is an obvious "Yes" we need a new FO.

We need new ownership or a complete 180 degree change in mind set, so top level FO talent is free to make the right decisions for all levels of the organization as well as the basketball team, on strategy, roadmap, talent acquisition, coaching, integrating all parts of the organization so they're cohesive, and rebuilding respect around the league.

None of this can happen if Jeannie doesn't decide it's best in the long run for her and her inner circle to step out of the decision making process and let some real talent do this instead.
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 7:05 am    Post subject:

Rob will hire JJ and we will ride that until Lebron fades out.

If JJ works we will celebrate Rob and if it doesn't Rob will be given another opportunity saying that was a Lebron hire

Rob is safe for a few more seasons
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 7:17 am    Post subject:

PNWlakers wrote:
Rob will hire JJ and we will ride that until Lebron fades out.

If JJ works we will celebrate Rob and if it doesn't Rob will be given another opportunity saying that was a Lebron hire

Rob is safe for a few more seasons


Rob is safe because he's salary is cheap compare to other well regarded GMs. and he will not make Jeannie look foolish in media.
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 9:09 am    Post subject:

Danny Green, 1st (Bane?) for 1 Year of Dennis
KCP, Kuz, Harrell, 1st (Herb Jones?) for Russ
Russ, 27 1st for Vando, D'lo, Beasley (3 months)

Let Caruso walk then want him back via trade.
Let Dwight walk then sign him a year later.

Refuse to give championship winner Ty Lue 5 years and staff control then hire Vogel.
Vogel wins a a title then fire Vogel to give never been HC Darvin Ham staff control.
Fire Ham then be infatuated with (never been a HC) JJ Redick but only because Ty Lue isn't an option but he is #1 target.

Let Klutch audition player after player here in LA only to leave.
Swing wildly from one summer to the next on how you build roster.



I think it's fair to say this FO has no idea wtf they're doing
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dcarter4kobe
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 11:37 am    Post subject:

2019 wrote:
Danny Green, 1st (Bane?) for 1 Year of Dennis
KCP, Kuz, Harrell, 1st (Herb Jones?) for Russ
Russ, 27 1st for Vando, D'lo, Beasley (3 months)

Let Caruso walk then want him back via trade.
Let Dwight walk then sign him a year later.

Refuse to give championship winner Ty Lue 5 years and staff control then hire Vogel.
Vogel wins a a title then fire Vogel to give never been HC Darvin Ham staff control.
Fire Ham then be infatuated with (never been a HC) JJ Redick but only because Ty Lue isn't an option but he is #1 target.

Let Klutch audition player after player here in LA only to leave.
Swing wildly from one summer to the next on how you build roster.



I think it's fair to say this FO has no idea wtf they're doing

In hindsight that Dennis trade sucks, but at the time that's one of the few moves I liked from Pelinka. Let's start from the top

1. Clarkson/Nance traded for a 1st (wagner) and exp k.
-At the time was fine with the move b/c I thought we could get PG along with LeBron to sign. That was a whiff so ended up using cap on Lance/Bealsey/Rondo/KCP
2. Svi/2nd for Reggie Bullock
-Liked the deal at the time but ended up letting Bullock walk after a subpar showing. Wasted 2nd
3. Zubac/Beasley for Muscula
-Terrible.
4. AD Trade
-Only thing I hated was the right to defer pick.
5. Green/1st for Dennis
-Most people liked this trade at the time. Danny had an up and down year and we needed another playmaker.
6. McGee+2nd for McKinnie
-Did this trade for Gasol, which made sense at the time.
7. Westbrook trade
-Terrible.
8. Marc Gasol/2024 2nd to Memphis
-Traded a 2nd to get Gasol in McGee trade. Then traded a 2nd to dump him a year later. Terrible asset management.
9. THT for Pet Bev
-Blah on paper. Terrible when you realize we basically picked THT over Caruso
10. Nunn+3 2nds for Rui
-Solid deal.
11. Thomas Bryant for 3 2nds
-Rare good asset management
12. Mo Bamba for Pat Bev+2nd
-Turned into another wasted 2nd
Edit-13. DLO/Mozgov for Lopez/Kuzma deal
-Would have been a solid move if the Lakers would have did the common sense thing and keep Lopez for cheap.

Not to go into the free agency signings. There is one constant, The Lakers front office appear to have no center of gravity. Are very wishy washy and seem to lack good judgement most front offices have.
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 12:08 pm    Post subject:

lakersfever714 wrote:
Drifts wrote:
whoever is the GM/FO will have a hard time building a team around a 40yo centerpiece


who was the reason they won their 17th championship. With Lebron, you have to subtract 10 from the age so pretend he's a 30 year old NBA player rn.


Appreciate Lebron, but at some point, his age will finally show. I mean it already has in some ways…but one day he’s gonna start playing his age. We’re done for when that day comes….

He looks more like a 33-34 year old out there imo. My worry is next season the drop off comes and he’ll be 40 playing like a 40 year old….
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 12:49 pm    Post subject:

dcarter4kobe wrote:
2019 wrote:
Danny Green, 1st (Bane?) for 1 Year of Dennis
KCP, Kuz, Harrell, 1st (Herb Jones?) for Russ
Russ, 27 1st for Vando, D'lo, Beasley (3 months)

Let Caruso walk then want him back via trade.
Let Dwight walk then sign him a year later.

Refuse to give championship winner Ty Lue 5 years and staff control then hire Vogel.
Vogel wins a a title then fire Vogel to give never been HC Darvin Ham staff control.
Fire Ham then be infatuated with (never been a HC) JJ Redick but only because Ty Lue isn't an option but he is #1 target.

Let Klutch audition player after player here in LA only to leave.
Swing wildly from one summer to the next on how you build roster.



I think it's fair to say this FO has no idea wtf they're doing

In hindsight that Dennis trade sucks, but at the time that's one of the few moves I liked from Pelinka. Let's start from the top

1. Clarkson/Nance traded for a 1st (wagner) and exp k.
-At the time was fine with the move b/c I thought we could get PG along with LeBron to sign. That was a whiff so ended up using cap on Lance/Bealsey/Rondo/KCP
2. Svi/2nd for Reggie Bullock
-Liked the deal at the time but ended up letting Bullock walk after a subpar showing. Wasted 2nd
3. Zubac/Beasley for Muscula
-Terrible.
4. AD Trade
-Only thing I hated was the right to defer pick.
5. Green/1st for Dennis
-Most people liked this trade at the time. Danny had an up and down year and we needed another playmaker.
6. McGee+2nd for McKinnie
-Did this trade for Gasol, which made sense at the time.
7. Westbrook trade
-Terrible.
8. Marc Gasol/2024 2nd to Memphis
-Traded a 2nd to get Gasol in McGee trade. Then traded a 2nd to dump him a year later. Terrible asset management.
9. THT for Pet Bev
-Blah on paper. Terrible when you realize we basically picked THT over Caruso
10. Nunn+3 2nds for Rui
-Solid deal.
11. Thomas Bryant for 3 2nds
-Rare good asset management
12. Mo Bamba for Pat Bev+2nd
-Turned into another wasted 2nd
Edit-13. DLO/Mozgov for Lopez/Kuzma deal
-Would have been a solid move if the Lakers would have did the common sense thing and keep Lopez for cheap.

Not to go into the free agency signings. There is one constant, The Lakers front office appear to have no center of gravity. Are very wishy washy and seem to lack good judgement most front offices have.


I didn't even want to list pre-championship because well, championship.

I don't disagree... there were plenty of smaller moves that were actually pretty good - great. But as a whole - there is no vision, direction or plan. Every off season is a complete new approach.

2020:Win a title -> let some key role players go in favor a talent/name
2021: Lose because of health -> trade for a big 3, let 3 very key role players go and add the all geriatric squad
2022: terrible again but go from big 3 + geriatrics to big 3 + barely NBA level younger guys

Russ trade

2023: after surprising run to WCF, never addressed biggest needs but structured deals in preparation of another major trade
2024: ????


No identification of a core, no continuity, no vision for style of play. FO just wings it every summer and the guy at the helm is trigger happy as heck.
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 1:20 pm    Post subject:

2019 wrote:


I didn't even want to list pre-championship because well, championship.

I don't disagree... there were plenty of smaller moves that were actually pretty good - great. But as a whole - there is no vision, direction or plan. Every off season is a complete new approach.

2020:Win a title -> let some key role players go in favor a talent/name
2021: Lose because of health -> trade for a big 3, let 3 very key role players go and add the all geriatric squad
2022: terrible again but go from big 3 + geriatrics to big 3 + barely NBA level younger guys

Russ trade

2023: after surprising run to WCF, never addressed biggest needs but structured deals in preparation of another major trade
2024: ????


No identification of a core, no continuity, no vision for style of play. FO just wings it every summer and the guy at the helm is trigger happy as heck.


No plan. No direction. Not surprising that the FO goes around in circles.

I think Rob has gotten better in terms of structuring trades and making moves that give him flexibility to make future moves, but that's only because he was so bad when he started. The Lakers paid a price for his on-the-job training.

Tactically Rob's better, but he still doesn't seem have to a longer-term strategy or plan. Maybe he's still figuring that part out or maybe Jeanie's only directive to him is to keep LeBron happy and not to rebuild.
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2024 2:47 pm    Post subject:

2019 wrote:
dcarter4kobe wrote:
2019 wrote:
Danny Green, 1st (Bane?) for 1 Year of Dennis
KCP, Kuz, Harrell, 1st (Herb Jones?) for Russ
Russ, 27 1st for Vando, D'lo, Beasley (3 months)

Let Caruso walk then want him back via trade.
Let Dwight walk then sign him a year later.

Refuse to give championship winner Ty Lue 5 years and staff control then hire Vogel.
Vogel wins a a title then fire Vogel to give never been HC Darvin Ham staff control.
Fire Ham then be infatuated with (never been a HC) JJ Redick but only because Ty Lue isn't an option but he is #1 target.

Let Klutch audition player after player here in LA only to leave.
Swing wildly from one summer to the next on how you build roster.



I think it's fair to say this FO has no idea wtf they're doing

In hindsight that Dennis trade sucks, but at the time that's one of the few moves I liked from Pelinka. Let's start from the top

1. Clarkson/Nance traded for a 1st (wagner) and exp k.
-At the time was fine with the move b/c I thought we could get PG along with LeBron to sign. That was a whiff so ended up using cap on Lance/Bealsey/Rondo/KCP
2. Svi/2nd for Reggie Bullock
-Liked the deal at the time but ended up letting Bullock walk after a subpar showing. Wasted 2nd
3. Zubac/Beasley for Muscula
-Terrible.
4. AD Trade
-Only thing I hated was the right to defer pick.
5. Green/1st for Dennis
-Most people liked this trade at the time. Danny had an up and down year and we needed another playmaker.
6. McGee+2nd for McKinnie
-Did this trade for Gasol, which made sense at the time.
7. Westbrook trade
-Terrible.
8. Marc Gasol/2024 2nd to Memphis
-Traded a 2nd to get Gasol in McGee trade. Then traded a 2nd to dump him a year later. Terrible asset management.
9. THT for Pet Bev
-Blah on paper. Terrible when you realize we basically picked THT over Caruso
10. Nunn+3 2nds for Rui
-Solid deal.
11. Thomas Bryant for 3 2nds
-Rare good asset management
12. Mo Bamba for Pat Bev+2nd
-Turned into another wasted 2nd
Edit-13. DLO/Mozgov for Lopez/Kuzma deal
-Would have been a solid move if the Lakers would have did the common sense thing and keep Lopez for cheap.

Not to go into the free agency signings. There is one constant, The Lakers front office appear to have no center of gravity. Are very wishy washy and seem to lack good judgement most front offices have.


I didn't even want to list pre-championship because well, championship.

I don't disagree... there were plenty of smaller moves that were actually pretty good - great. But as a whole - there is no vision, direction or plan. Every off season is a complete new approach.

2020:Win a title -> let some key role players go in favor a talent/name
2021: Lose because of health -> trade for a big 3, let 3 very key role players go and add the all geriatric squad
2022: terrible again but go from big 3 + geriatrics to big 3 + barely NBA level younger guys

Russ trade

2023: after surprising run to WCF, never addressed biggest needs but structured deals in preparation of another major trade
2024: ????


No identification of a core, no continuity, no vision for style of play. FO just wings it every summer and the guy at the helm is trigger happy as heck.

Why do you leave out 2019?
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