Who Should the Lakers Target as Their "Missing Piece(s)"?
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governator
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2024 3:55 am    Post subject:

ducasse wrote:
governator wrote:
DLo for Marcus Smart
Gabe for Stephen Adams
Rui for Cam Johnson


Not sure why Grizz let Adams go. He's a beast. He was out for the year but they weren't contending so they could afford to wait.

Yeah, they drafted a center so Adams would be a perfect mentor/segway but he would’ve been perfect next to AD
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2024 4:54 am    Post subject:

PICKnPOP wrote:
Max getting a bigger role, Gabe, vando, wood being healthy. Kenecht…new coaching staff.

Basically a different team than last year even if it doesn’t seem like it.

We got more defense this year

Gave
Max
Vando
AD

Legit defenders.

I think we will be ok even if they make no moves. I hope they make some move but we don’t really need much imo


I agree with this. Good enough to get us a top 6 spot behind OKC, Denver, Minni and Dallas.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2024 5:48 pm    Post subject:

Killer_Z wrote:
PICKnPOP wrote:
Max getting a bigger role, Gabe, vando, wood being healthy. Kenecht…new coaching staff.

Basically a different team than last year even if it doesn’t seem like it.

We got more defense this year

Gabe
Max
Vando
AD

Legit defenders.

I think we will be ok even if they make no moves. I hope they make some move but we don’t really need much imo
I agree with this. Good enough to get us a top 6 spot behind OKC, Denver, Minni and Dallas.
Definitely behind OKC with the addition of Carusco and Harkenstein. They are definitely getting a roster to beat the Celtics!!

Nuggets lost KCP and hoping that their rookies are ready

Mavs' D is not great, but adequate if Kyrie & Luka defends

TWolves' Gobert is often not playing during crunch time, last season
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Hanging from Rafters
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2024 10:35 pm    Post subject:

The more I think about it the more it seems that Valanciunas was the missing piece. Rob should have called LBJ’s bluff and signed him with the full MLE. I’ll let someone else figure out which vet min would have had to be gone and the best way to free that roster spot.

I know, I know, Val ain’t all that but hear me out with an open mind.

The main probs this past season was defense, rebounding, and degraded play for non-AD minutes. Oct was rough with a poor shooting start but the starters rebounded winning the IST champ, a decent overall start. Then…I don’t recall exactly when…Dlo/AR/Rui were benched and with the new starters the Lakers routinely fell behind by double digits to start the game in the 1st quarter. Dlo/AR/Rui…or some combination since Rui missed time with injury…would come off the bench to bring the Lakers back into those games only to lose, expending too much energy on the comebacks to close the game by a margin typically less than that initial 1st qtr deficit given up by the faulty starters TPrince/CamRed/Vando.

For Feb/Mar/Apr…with the best players reinstated as starters…the team went 23-10 overall, which includes 12-5 against playoff teams and 8-3 against the top 4 seeds from each conference. So except for the time when the starting line up was messed up causing the team to fall behind by double digits early, the Lakers won the IST championship before, and then won 70% of their games afterwards. Over half of the final 33 games were playoff teams and a 3rd were against top 4 seeds, a strength of schedule harder than a regular season strength of schedule since a regular season schedule has about only a fourth against top 4 seeds.

Well, what’s the point, they still lost in the 1st round? Wood was out, Vando was out, Cam was out and the coach didn’t try MaxC when Dinwiddie/Vincent and Hayes was putting up bagels for scores. The points is, the Lakers played like a championship team in the regular season with Dlo/AR/LBJ/Rui/AD as starters even with bad defense, bad rebounding, and bad non-AD minutes in the front court plus poor coaching. If JJ is a better coach (if), MaxC/Cam/Vincent can provide back court defense, Vando wing defense, then..

drum roll…

The whole points is that Valancuinas would have plugged the only remaining holes of rebounding and solid production for the non-AD minutes as a backup to AD to maintain the starting lineup and also could play with AD if the other 3 on the floor with them at the time were good shooters (Dlo/MaxC?/LBJ).

I don’t know why I torture myself like this, I guess it’s a coping mechanism for disappointment. I guess it’s now relying on Wood/Hayes to fix rebounding and non-AD production.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2024 1:14 pm    Post subject:

Hanging from Rafters wrote:
The whole points is that Valancuinas would have plugged the only remaining holes of rebounding and solid production for the non-AD minutes as a backup to AD to maintain the starting lineup and also could play with AD if the other 3 on the floor with them at the time were good shooters (Dlo/MaxC?/LBJ).

I don’t know why I torture myself like this, I guess it’s a coping mechanism for disappointment. I guess it’s now relying on Wood/Hayes to fix rebounding and non-AD production.
Surprised that LBJ actually believes that he would actually "Moves the Needle."

He is a good old school post player that means he is taking up space where LBJ and AD are their most effective.

Scouting reports have noted that he slow-footed on defense, hence opposing teams would just switch and take him to the perimeter "On An Island."

We are more effective with AD at the 5. Would Valancuinas be satisfied and/or even consider being a backup 5, especially with his contract? Myles Turner would/was a better option to consider, but salary and PT made that option not viable.

When we have The Greek Freak to KD to KP to Towns and selected others, while considering today's NBA, it is hard for centers from Gobert to Valancuinas to Steven Adams and others to stay on the court

Did you see Luka take Gobert (On an Island) and toyed with the reigning DPOY during the playoffs. Cs, without KP, were effective in rebounding and playing defense.

Good idea, wrong player (IMHO)
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2024 1:18 pm    Post subject:

Hanging from Rafters wrote:
The whole points is that Valancuinas would have plugged the only remaining holes of rebounding and solid production for the non-AD minutes as a backup to AD to maintain the starting lineup and also could play with AD if the other 3 on the floor with them at the time were good shooters (Dlo/MaxC?/LBJ).

I don’t know why I torture myself like this, I guess it’s a coping mechanism for disappointment. I guess it’s now relying on Wood/Hayes to fix rebounding and non-AD production.
Surprised that LBJ actually believes that he would actually "Moves the Needle."

He is a good old school post player that means he is taking up space where LBJ and AD are their most effective.

Scouting reports have noted that he slow-footed on defense, hence opposing teams would just switch and take him to the perimeter "On An Island."

We are more effective with AD at the 5. Would Valancuinas be satisfied and/or even consider being a backup 5, especially with his contract? Myles Turner would/was a better option to consider, but salary and PT made that option not viable.

When we have The Greek Freak to KD to KP to Towns and selected others, while considering today's NBA, it is hard for centers from Gobert to Valancuinas to Steven Adams and others to stay on the court

Did you see Luka take Gobert (On an Island) and toyed with the reigning DPOY during the playoffs. Cs, without KP, were effective in rebounding and playing defense.

Good idea, wrong player (IMHO)
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2024 1:25 pm    Post subject:

A Mad Chinaman wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
The whole points is that Valancuinas would have plugged the only remaining holes of rebounding and solid production for the non-AD minutes as a backup to AD to maintain the starting lineup and also could play with AD if the other 3 on the floor with them at the time were good shooters (Dlo/MaxC?/LBJ).

I don’t know why I torture myself like this, I guess it’s a coping mechanism for disappointment. I guess it’s now relying on Wood/Hayes to fix rebounding and non-AD production.
Surprised that LBJ actually believes that he would actually "Moves the Needle."

He is a good old school post player that means he is taking up space where LBJ and AD are their most effective.

Scouting reports have noted that he slow-footed on defense, hence opposing teams would just switch and take him to the perimeter "On An Island."

We are more effective with AD at the 5. Would Valancuinas be satisfied and/or even consider being a backup 5, especially with his contract? Myles Turner would/was a better option to consider, but salary and PT made that option not viable.

When we have The Greek Freak to KD to KP to Towns and selected others, while considering today's NBA, it is hard for centers from Gobert to Valancuinas to Steven Adams and others to stay on the court

Did you see Luka take Gobert (On an Island) and toyed with the reigning DPOY during the playoffs. Cs, without KP, were effective in rebounding and playing defense.

Good idea, wrong player (IMHO)


The point…could be hard to see and miss it…is that he would have been basically FREE, and somewhat useful in the appropriate defensive schemes of zone, or blitz double, instead of switching. I wouldn’t use assets to get Val or plan on him as a full time starter, but I sure would have called LBJ’s bluff to add him for the same amount of resources I was spending without him anyway.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2024 1:06 am    Post subject:

Hanging from Rafters wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
The whole points is that Valancuinas would have plugged the only remaining holes of rebounding and solid production for the non-AD minutes as a backup to AD to maintain the starting lineup and also could play with AD if the other 3 on the floor with them at the time were good shooters (Dlo/MaxC?/LBJ).

I don’t know why I torture myself like this, I guess it’s a coping mechanism for disappointment. I guess it’s now relying on Wood/Hayes to fix rebounding and non-AD production.
Surprised that LBJ actually believes that he would actually "Moves the Needle."

He is a good old school post player that means he is taking up space where LBJ and AD are their most effective.

Scouting reports have noted that he slow-footed on defense, hence opposing teams would just switch and take him to the perimeter "On An Island."

We are more effective with AD at the 5. Would Valancuinas be satisfied and/or even consider being a backup 5, especially with his contract? Myles Turner would/was a better option to consider, but salary and PT made that option not viable.

When we have The Greek Freak to KD to KP to Towns and selected others, while considering today's NBA, it is hard for centers from Gobert to Valancuinas to Steven Adams and others to stay on the court

Did you see Luka take Gobert (On an Island) and toyed with the reigning DPOY during the playoffs. Cs, without KP, were effective in rebounding and playing defense.

Good idea, wrong player (IMHO)
The point…could be hard to see and miss it…is that he would have been basically FREE, and somewhat useful in the appropriate defensive schemes of zone, or blitz double, instead of switching. I wouldn’t use assets to get Val or plan on him as a full time starter, but I sure would have called LBJ’s bluff to add him for the same amount of resources I was spending without him anyway.
Big assumption that Valancuinas would agree to being a backup center. Nothing under the new CBA is "free" since it would automatically take up cap space and Rob would have to make some room on this roster.

"Somewhat useful in appropriate defensive schemes of zone" is a big IF especially for a backup 5. Opposing teams would do to Valancuinas like how they would play Gobert to expose his defensive liabilities on the perimeter.

One would only use him against a few centers like Joker, Embiid, Adams and very few others. Centers mentioned would eat Valancuinas for breakfast lunch and dinner. Only Joker has remained relatively injury-free, maybe because of the demands of the current NBA that prompts the requirement to have mobility and quickness that places a great deal of strengths on the bigs mentioned.

As shared - good idea but wrong player.
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defense
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2024 5:51 am    Post subject:

[quote="unleasHell"]
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:

How would one rank these teams with Big 3s as legitimate title-contending teams
Embiid/Maxey/PG
Luka/Kyrie/Klay
Greek Freak/Dame/Middleton
KD/Booker/Beal
AntMan/Gobert/KAT


Embiid/Maxey/PG
KD/Booker/Beal
Luka/Kyrie/Klay
Greek Freak/Dame/Middleton
AntMan/Gobert/KAT
LeBron/Davis/Russel


As an effective trio I would go

Embiid-Maxi-PG
Freak-Dame-Mid
Ant-Gobert-Towns
Luka-Klay-Kyrie
Shai-Chet-Jalen
Jokic-Murray-Porter
US

With that said... 3 guys don't win games. The whole team does.
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deal
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2024 1:33 pm    Post subject:

A Mad Chinaman wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
The whole points is that Valancuinas would have plugged the only remaining holes of rebounding and solid production for the non-AD minutes as a backup to AD to maintain the starting lineup and also could play with AD if the other 3 on the floor with them at the time were good shooters (Dlo/MaxC?/LBJ).

I don’t know why I torture myself like this, I guess it’s a coping mechanism for disappointment. I guess it’s now relying on Wood/Hayes to fix rebounding and non-AD production.
Surprised that LBJ actually believes that he would actually "Moves the Needle."

He is a good old school post player that means he is taking up space where LBJ and AD are their most effective.

Scouting reports have noted that he slow-footed on defense, hence opposing teams would just switch and take him to the perimeter "On An Island."

We are more effective with AD at the 5. Would Valancuinas be satisfied and/or even consider being a backup 5, especially with his contract? Myles Turner would/was a better option to consider, but salary and PT made that option not viable.

When we have The Greek Freak to KD to KP to Towns and selected others, while considering today's NBA, it is hard for centers from Gobert to Valancuinas to Steven Adams and others to stay on the court

Did you see Luka take Gobert (On an Island) and toyed with the reigning DPOY during the playoffs. Cs, without KP, were effective in rebounding and playing defense.

Good idea, wrong player (IMHO)
The point…could be hard to see and miss it…is that he would have been basically FREE, and somewhat useful in the appropriate defensive schemes of zone, or blitz double, instead of switching. I wouldn’t use assets to get Val or plan on him as a full time starter, but I sure would have called LBJ’s bluff to add him for the same amount of resources I was spending without him anyway.
Big assumption that Valancuinas would agree to being a backup center. Nothing under the new CBA is "free" since it would automatically take up cap space and Rob would have to make some room on this roster.

"Somewhat useful in appropriate defensive schemes of zone" is a big IF especially for a backup 5. Opposing teams would do to Valancuinas like how they would play Gobert to expose his defensive liabilities on the perimeter.

One would only use him against a few centers like Joker, Embiid, Adams and very few others. Centers mentioned would eat Valancuinas for breakfast lunch and dinner. Only Joker has remained relatively injury-free, maybe because of the demands of the current NBA that prompts the requirement to have mobility and quickness that places a great deal of strengths on the bigs mentioned.

As shared - good idea but wrong player.


Somehow having the opportunity to play Val next to AD would have been interesting. AD on help D instead of on the ball, could have worked.

We'll never know.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2024 2:44 pm    Post subject:

deal wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
The whole points is that Valancuinas would have plugged the only remaining holes of rebounding and solid production for the non-AD minutes as a backup to AD to maintain the starting lineup and also could play with AD if the other 3 on the floor with them at the time were good shooters (Dlo/MaxC?/LBJ).

I don’t know why I torture myself like this, I guess it’s a coping mechanism for disappointment. I guess it’s now relying on Wood/Hayes to fix rebounding and non-AD production.
Surprised that LBJ actually believes that he would actually "Moves the Needle."

He is a good old school post player that means he is taking up space where LBJ and AD are their most effective.

Scouting reports have noted that he slow-footed on defense, hence opposing teams would just switch and take him to the perimeter "On An Island."

We are more effective with AD at the 5. Would Valancuinas be satisfied and/or even consider being a backup 5, especially with his contract? Myles Turner would/was a better option to consider, but salary and PT made that option not viable.

When we have The Greek Freak to KD to KP to Towns and selected others, while considering today's NBA, it is hard for centers from Gobert to Valancuinas to Steven Adams and others to stay on the court

Did you see Luka take Gobert (On an Island) and toyed with the reigning DPOY during the playoffs. Cs, without KP, were effective in rebounding and playing defense.

Good idea, wrong player (IMHO)
The point…could be hard to see and miss it…is that he would have been basically FREE, and somewhat useful in the appropriate defensive schemes of zone, or blitz double, instead of switching. I wouldn’t use assets to get Val or plan on him as a full time starter, but I sure would have called LBJ’s bluff to add him for the same amount of resources I was spending without him anyway.
Big assumption that Valancuinas would agree to being a backup center. Nothing under the new CBA is "free" since it would automatically take up cap space and Rob would have to make some room on this roster.

"Somewhat useful in appropriate defensive schemes of zone" is a big IF especially for a backup 5. Opposing teams would do to Valancuinas like how they would play Gobert to expose his defensive liabilities on the perimeter.

One would only use him against a few centers like Joker, Embiid, Adams and very few others. Centers mentioned would eat Valancuinas for breakfast lunch and dinner. Only Joker has remained relatively injury-free, maybe because of the demands of the current NBA that prompts the requirement to have mobility and quickness that places a great deal of strengths on the bigs mentioned.

As shared - good idea but wrong player.
Somehow having the opportunity to play Val next to AD would have been interesting. AD on help D instead of on the ball, could have worked.

We'll never know.
V wanted his “bag” and PT with a major role that was not going to happen in LaLaLand

Rob/JJ are hoping that an AD/CWood/Hayes/Rui/Vando will provide what’s needed. The non-LBJ/AD victory over the Cs shows that the talent and potential is there and effective in the new NBA

V is part of the old NBA where players from V to Adams to Embiid to Gobert are struggling to stay on the court and effective
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2024 8:12 pm    Post subject:

What if the premise of the question isn't valid? As in the Lakers are missing pieces rather than just one piece.

VLF made a a good point a few days ago about the lack of two-way players on this team. I think it's a particular issue for the role players because AD and LeBron are playing regardless (although LeBron doesn't seem able to sustain his defensive effort for a whole game particularly at the end of games).

Vando is great on defense, but his offense is poor enough that teams sag off him. DLo is the opposite and teams target him. AR's offense is improving and maybe his defense can improve, but not good enough yet. Rui is ???, and so on.

KCP seems like the ideal role player because his offense is good enough that teams have to respect him and his flexibility on defense allows him to make up for weaker players.

If we had, I don't know, 2 role players like him, that could be enough.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2024 8:12 pm    Post subject:

Garland and markenan
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2024 10:18 pm    Post subject:

Kessler/Ingram/TyusJones
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2024 9:12 am    Post subject:

Mason Plumlee
Kris Dunn
Gary Trent Jr

Would have been a realistic/solid off season.
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