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DLaker
Star Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 1539
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 Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 9:10 am Post subject: |
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| Phil is full of BS. unless u cheat, injure another star player to win a championship your championship counts in my book. Else this argument will go on for ever, East vs West, shortened season, Covid, referees …. |
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Aeneas Hunter
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Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 31763
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 9:42 am Post subject: |
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| vasashi17+ wrote: | Other than the obvious few who don’t deserve my respect....I respectfully disagree with the most of you and I’m positive most of y’all would be buggin had circumstances proven otherwise.
No season has ever had a 4 month break in between. Every team gains an advantage with that type of break, but imho it would be the teams who have older players and/or injury plagued players that gain a higher advantage. That 4 month break is arguably a well timed refresh to our duo.
Let’s just cLip the script...after their entire history of futility and ineptitude, what if the clips had won the bubble? What if Kawhi/PG used that time off to load manage their wounds? I’m almost positive most of y’all would be buggin at the result. Meanwhile, I would be consistent in saying that the cLips would have to show the world it wasn’t a fluke.
Kawhi and his load-managing ass would have to show me he could do it again without a 4 month reCOVIDry power down...PG and his reconstructed shoulders would have to show me that he could shoulder the load in the playoffs instead of reverting back to his usual layoff P form. They would have to show that their bubble title wasn’t a full on exploitation of an in-season 4 month hiatus, that no other regular season has ever featured. There is no way I accept that organizations only title in their history coming in this type of way until they prove it wasn’t based on the uniqueness of that season. I wouldn’t be buggin’ then, would I? |
Well, sure, there have always been people on this board who have been quick to assign asterisks for whatever reason. That's just sports fans being sports fans. If the Clippers had won the title that year, I have no doubt that a fair number of people around here would be mocking it. But so what? If the Clippers win a title under normal circumstances, it's not like those folks won't find a reason to mock it anyway.
My problem with the bubble title is not its legitimacy, but rather that the playoffs were unfulfilling, at least for me. It was like watching a high level version of The Basketball Tournament. There were no big crowds, we never had to play in hostile arenas, there were players who opted out, and in general the whole thing felt sort of sterile. If we had the playoffs in a bubble every year, it wouldn't be long before hardly anyone cared. But that does not affect the legitimacy of the title. It affects the payoff to me as a fan. Other people don't feel that way, and that is cool.
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Texas_Pete
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 12825
Location: Somewhere watching a Laker game
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 10:24 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | League source: Should the NBA sign a new TV deal worth $75 billion, early projections indicate that a 2025 salary cap number of $171 million is possible, assuming no cap smoothing.
More later on @ForbesSports |
https://twitter.com/msjnba/status/1439635396955049990?s=19
LINK
Cha-ching!  Lakers will be able to add even more free agents to AD for years to come if this projection is true. |
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Aeneas Hunter
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Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 31763
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 10:49 am Post subject: |
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| Texas_Pete wrote: | | Quote: | League source: Should the NBA sign a new TV deal worth $75 billion, early projections indicate that a 2025 salary cap number of $171 million is possible, assuming no cap smoothing.
More later on @ForbesSports |
https://twitter.com/msjnba/status/1439635396955049990?s=19
LINK
Cha-ching! Lakers will be able to add even more free agents to AD for years to come if this projection is true. |
If the $75M deal really happens (and right now this is just talk as far as I can tell), the price of those free agents is going to skyrocket.
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Texas_Pete
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 12825
Location: Somewhere watching a Laker game
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:04 am Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | Texas_Pete wrote: | | Quote: | League source: Should the NBA sign a new TV deal worth $75 billion, early projections indicate that a 2025 salary cap number of $171 million is possible, assuming no cap smoothing.
More later on @ForbesSports |
https://twitter.com/msjnba/status/1439635396955049990?s=19
LINK
Cha-ching! Lakers will be able to add even more free agents to AD for years to come if this projection is true. |
If the $75M deal really happens (and right now this is just talk as far as I can tell), the price of those free agents is going to skyrocket. |
True, but there will also be some good players that will be willing to take a haircut to play with a contender like the Lakers as well. I trust Rob to manage this new cap to ensure good players are around AD going forward. |
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Robz
Sixth Man
Joined: 03 Mar 2012
Posts: 26
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Texas_Pete wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | Texas_Pete wrote: | | Quote: | League source: Should the NBA sign a new TV deal worth $75 billion, early projections indicate that a 2025 salary cap number of $171 million is possible, assuming no cap smoothing.
More later on @ForbesSports |
https://twitter.com/msjnba/status/1439635396955049990?s=19
LINK
Cha-ching! Lakers will be able to add even more free agents to AD for years to come if this projection is true. |
If the $75M deal really happens (and right now this is just talk as far as I can tell), the price of those free agents is going to skyrocket. |
True, but there will also be some good players that will be willing to take a haircut to play with a contender like the Lakers as well. I trust Rob to manage this new cap to ensure good players are around AD going forward. |
Davis plus Ball brothers plus Tatum. |
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Swagron12
Starting Rotation
Joined: 27 Sep 2020
Posts: 328
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:28 pm Post subject: |
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| LGFan wrote: | | Asterisks are written by internet clowns who have never played any competitive sports like Tim bontemps |
Exactly. I think that is the case here. Non competitors and a gamer mostly post here. The championship was real. These clowns can write all the paragraphs they want to. |
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venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144492
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Maginka wrote: | The season obviously wasn't normal, same with the 2021 title to less of an extent.
But every team played on the same 94 ft. of hardwood with 2 baskets. Every team had an opportunity at the title, it's really the only thing anyone can come up with....is there someone that can argue a different team that should of or would've won that year |
That is where the argument starts making sense. The conditions were the same for all teams (at least those teams “invited” to Disneyland). The Lakers won under the same circumstances and deserved to be the champions. But you can’t argue that it wasn’t the most bastardized season in my lifetime. Stern was trying to fill the BA coffers by making up playoff scenarios as objections were made. What they ended up with wasn’t what they began with. The Laker title is legit, the season was something I think that the league would like to distance themselves from. But when you need the money, a shakedown doesn’t seem that bad.
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RG73
Franchise Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2001
Posts: 11508
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: |
That is where the argument starts making sense. The conditions were the same for all teams (at least those teams “invited” to Disneyland). The Lakers won under the same circumstances and deserved to be the champions. But you can’t argue that it wasn’t the most bastardized season in my lifetime. Stern was trying to fill the BA coffers by making up playoff scenarios as objections were made. What they ended up with wasn’t what they began with. The Laker title is legit, the season was something I think that the league would like to distance themselves from. But when you need the money, a shakedown doesn’t seem that bad. |
How was it a bastardized season? What else were they supposed to do during the pandemic? No sports league has ever had to operate through something like that ( save maybe some prehistoric MLB in 1918). Given the circumstances I would call it a creative and reasonable solution to continuing the season rather than ending the whole season prematurely and without a champion.
I will again come back to this notion of the mythical consistent NBA postseason. When there were 8 teams and 2 rounds those championships count as much as everything up until the 2020 championship. But they were easier playoffs under different rules. We had the infamously shortened 1999 season. Phil’s feelings not withstanding, it counted, even if the format of the season was dramatically truncated.
I understand the format was completely different than anything we’ve seen before and probably won’t see it again. But so what? Isn’t that the entire reason we watch? To see highly skilled athletes deal with adversity? The bubble was adversity—maybe of a different nature than the grind of flying cross country and having tens of thousands of screaming fans. But it was a different sort of challenge. Some guys rose to that challenge and the Lakers rose more than anyone else. I don’t see why there is a need for the qualifying it or even how the league responded at the time with what they knew. |
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Lonzo-Lite
Star Player
Joined: 17 May 2011
Posts: 5102
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joeblow
Star Player
Joined: 24 Nov 2008
Posts: 3092
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Lonzo-Lite wrote: | https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2021/09/18/report-darren-collison-eyeing-training-camp-invite-from-lakers/
| Quote: | NBA point guard Darren Collison is hoping the Lakers invite him to training camp.
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Finally! I was actually concerned that our lack of players 6'4" and shorter would not be addressed.  |
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Inspector Gadget
Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46784
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Lonzo-Lite wrote: | https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2021/09/18/report-darren-collison-eyeing-training-camp-invite-from-lakers/
| Quote: | NBA point guard Darren Collison is hoping the Lakers invite him to training camp.
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Collison and Schroeder have similarities in there games, so it will be like adding a 6th man PG off the bench, maybe we give Nunn minutes at the SG spot. |
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deal
Franchise Player
Joined: 17 Aug 2008
Posts: 14931
Location: Earth
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| joeblow wrote: | | Lonzo-Lite wrote: | https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2021/09/18/report-darren-collison-eyeing-training-camp-invite-from-lakers/
| Quote: | NBA point guard Darren Collison is hoping the Lakers invite him to training camp.
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Finally! I was actually concerned that our lack of players 6'4" and shorter would not be addressed. |
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Lakers need to build a freaking team ! |
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LGFan
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jun 2021
Posts: 1860
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Lonzo-Lite wrote: | https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2021/09/18/report-darren-collison-eyeing-training-camp-invite-from-lakers/
| Quote: | NBA point guard Darren Collison is hoping the Lakers invite him to training camp.
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the money ballmer paid him dried up? |
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Halflife
Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Aug 2015
Posts: 16923
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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| LGFan wrote: | | Lonzo-Lite wrote: | https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2021/09/18/report-darren-collison-eyeing-training-camp-invite-from-lakers/
| Quote: | NBA point guard Darren Collison is hoping the Lakers invite him to training camp.
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the money ballmer paid him dried up? |
i also think guys see our roster and realize playing time will be sporadic at best. get paid to cheerlead sounds good to some. |
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activeverb
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 37470
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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| joeblow wrote: | | Lonzo-Lite wrote: | https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2021/09/18/report-darren-collison-eyeing-training-camp-invite-from-lakers/
| Quote: | NBA point guard Darren Collison is hoping the Lakers invite him to training camp.
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Finally! I was actually concerned that our lack of players 6'4" and shorter would not be addressed. |
This team is in desperate need of another 6'0", 34-year-old point guard. He'll fit right in.
Westbrook is going to feel like a giant. |
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MJST
Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26593
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Lonzo-Lite wrote: | https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2021/09/18/report-darren-collison-eyeing-training-camp-invite-from-lakers/
| Quote: | NBA point guard Darren Collison is hoping the Lakers invite him to training camp.
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Collison and Schroeder have similarities in there games, so it will be like adding a 6th man PG off the bench, maybe we give Nunn minutes at the SG spot. |
We have Bazemore, THT, Ellington for that.
Then we have Westbrook, Nunn, Rondo for point guard.
Lakers don't need another guard.
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JUST-MING
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 44017
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Morten Stig Jensen wrote: |
League source: Should the NBA sign a new TV deal worth $75 billion, early projections indicate that a 2025 salary cap number of $171 million is possible, assuming no cap smoothing.
More later on @ForbesSports
Sep 19, 2021 • Reply • Retweet • Favorite |
Excerpt:
The 2025 cap spike will see $200 million contracts get normalized, and for the league's elite, $300 million will become the new threshold.
Based off a cap that by 2025 sits at $171 million, a 35% max deal would start at $59.85 million and carry 8% annual raises. Over a five year period, that becomes $347.1 million with the final year being worth $79 million alone, which is $9 million more than the entire salary cap number in 2015.
$79 million |
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Aeneas Hunter
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Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 31763
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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| RG73 wrote: | | How was it a bastardized season? What else were they supposed to do during the pandemic? No sports league has ever had to operate through something like that ( save maybe some prehistoric MLB in 1918). Given the circumstances I would call it a creative and reasonable solution to continuing the season rather than ending the whole season prematurely and without a champion. |
You answered your own question. You're simply justifying the bastardization of the season. Sure, it was a reasonable solution. This was all about money, which is the lifeblood of pro sports. The players didn't want to do it, and I'm not sure that the fans really wanted it. But the NBA runs on its TV contracts, so the league needed to come up with something. Even though the TV ratings were awful, the NBA provided content at the height of the first wave of the pandemic.
This was different from the 1994 baseball calamity. If the NBA had canceled the season, the fans would generally have been understanding. But there would have been hell to pay with the TV contracts. So the league worked out a deal with ESPN and TNT, and we got the bastardized season. This does not affect the legitimacy of the title, but the other arguments are just rationalizations.
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vasashi17+
Star Player
Joined: 13 Dec 2019
Posts: 5650
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | vasashi17+ wrote: | Other than the obvious few who don’t deserve my respect....I respectfully disagree with the most of you and I’m positive most of y’all would be buggin had circumstances proven otherwise.
No season has ever had a 4 month break in between. Every team gains an advantage with that type of break, but imho it would be the teams who have older players and/or injury plagued players that gain a higher advantage. That 4 month break is arguably a well timed refresh to our duo.
Let’s just cLip the script...after their entire history of futility and ineptitude, what if the clips had won the bubble? What if Kawhi/PG used that time off to load manage their wounds? I’m almost positive most of y’all would be buggin at the result. Meanwhile, I would be consistent in saying that the cLips would have to show the world it wasn’t a fluke.
Kawhi and his load-managing ass would have to show me he could do it again without a 4 month reCOVIDry power down...PG and his reconstructed shoulders would have to show me that he could shoulder the load in the playoffs instead of reverting back to his usual layoff P form. They would have to show that their bubble title wasn’t a full on exploitation of an in-season 4 month hiatus, that no other regular season has ever featured. There is no way I accept that organizations only title in their history coming in this type of way until they prove it wasn’t based on the uniqueness of that season. I wouldn’t be buggin’ then, would I? |
Well, sure, there have always been people on this board who have been quick to assign asterisks for whatever reason. That's just sports fans being sports fans. If the Clippers had won the title that year, I have no doubt that a fair number of people around here would be mocking it. But so what? If the Clippers win a title under normal circumstances, it's not like those folks won't find a reason to mock it anyway.
My problem with the bubble title is not its legitimacy, but rather that the playoffs were unfulfilling, at least for me. It was like watching a high level version of The Basketball Tournament. There were no big crowds, we never had to play in hostile arenas, there were players who opted out, and in general the whole thing felt sort of sterile. If we had the playoffs in a bubble every year, it wouldn't be long before hardly anyone cared. But that does not affect the legitimacy of the title. It affects the payoff to me as a fan. Other people don't feel that way, and that is cool. |
@PlantedTanks: see what you made me do haha. See what I meant by discussing this ad nauseam. It’s quite nauseating to me that certain members (let’s call em the RobMob) can’t discuss a topic in an appropriate manner (let’s call it the RobMobBob, thinking dude can do no wrong as they’re bobbin on Rob’s member), so they resort to diluting the integrity of the discussion...they know who they are.
But like you said, not AH. Even if dude disagrees with your take, he respects your opinion and disputes it accordingly. Thanks AH for doing it here once again. I got nothing to refute, cause I absolutely see & understand your point of view, as you have done with mine. I always look forward to your takes, especially when they differ from mine, since you open my perspective up to things that I had not even considered. 
| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | Texas_Pete wrote: | | Quote: | League source: Should the NBA sign a new TV deal worth $75 billion, early projections indicate that a 2025 salary cap number of $171 million is possible, assuming no cap smoothing.
More later on @ForbesSports |
https://twitter.com/msjnba/status/1439635396955049990?s=19
LINK
Cha-ching! Lakers will be able to add even more free agents to AD for years to come if this projection is true. |
If the $75M deal really happens (and right now this is just talk as far as I can tell), the price of those free agents is going to skyrocket. |
True! The FA class of ‘25 is going to be insane. Wonder who the new Chandler Parsons, Otto Porter and MozDengs will be for that class.
However also consider the cap smoothing/correcting approach till we get that point. As salary caps gradually but markedly escalate, the deals that were signed to below average sakary this summer will look so much better on the cap sheet...especially since the tax line will also be set at a higher limit. A certain Alex Caruso’s deal comes to mind. Shoulda held onto that asset...especially since now he will likely be seen as a team friendly deal.
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Laker's Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12900
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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I think there was discussion after the fact by the Players Union that they should have agreed to a mechanism that smoothed the cap increase over multiple years. The league had proposed a number of solutions, including giving a large chunk of revenue to the Union to distribute. Just seeing a singular spike didn’t do good things for most teams or most players.
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Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
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activeverb
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 37470
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Laker's Fan wrote: | | I think there was discussion after the fact by the Players Union that they should have agreed to a mechanism that smoothed the cap increase over multiple years. The league had proposed a number of solutions, including giving a large chunk of revenue to the Union to distribute. Just seeing a singular spike didn’t do good things for most teams or most players. |
The union was dead set against smoothing the last time around. Hopefully their attitude has changed. |
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PlantedTanks
Star Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 3156
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | My problem with the bubble title is not its legitimacy, but rather that the playoffs were unfulfilling, at least for me. It was like watching a high level version of The Basketball Tournament. There were no big crowds, we never had to play in hostile arenas, there were players who opted out, and in general the whole thing felt sort of sterile. If we had the playoffs in a bubble every year, it wouldn't be long before hardly anyone cared. But that does not affect the legitimacy of the title. It affects the payoff to me as a fan. Other people don't feel that way, and that is cool. |
Very little to discuss here sooooo
I disagree with your unfulfilled statement for 2 reasons.
First and most important is the playoffs and title run was a very welcomed occurrence in a time where many of us were living our lives worrying and concerned about our future, our loved ones while having to deal with issues about our jobs, money, housing, food. Having those 3 hours of game time over multiple games and weeks was the distraction and stress relief I believe many of us needed to bring some normalcy back to our lives. Winning the title was the "coup de grace" or as we normally say "coo de grah" for me.
Second after 6 missed playoff years and hearing all the shade being thrown at the Lakers especially after the end of Magic's tenure the title was a sweet F***U to all those who regaled with pleasure in the Lakers demise. Sorry for the language but remembering the antics of Ballmer, Clipper players, Stephen A hits a sore spot. |
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Aeneas Hunter
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Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 31763
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| PlantedTanks wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | My problem with the bubble title is not its legitimacy, but rather that the playoffs were unfulfilling, at least for me. It was like watching a high level version of The Basketball Tournament. There were no big crowds, we never had to play in hostile arenas, there were players who opted out, and in general the whole thing felt sort of sterile. If we had the playoffs in a bubble every year, it wouldn't be long before hardly anyone cared. But that does not affect the legitimacy of the title. It affects the payoff to me as a fan. Other people don't feel that way, and that is cool. |
Very little to discuss here sooooo
I disagree with your unfulfilled statement for 2 reasons.
First and most important is the playoffs and title run was a very welcomed occurrence in a time where many of us were living our lives worrying and concerned about our future, our loved ones while having to deal with issues about our jobs, money, housing, food. Having those 3 hours of game time over multiple games and weeks was the distraction and stress relief I believe many of us needed to bring some normalcy back to our lives. Winning the title was the "coup de grace" or as we normally say "coo de grah" for me.
Second after 6 missed playoff years and hearing all the shade being thrown at the Lakers especially after the end of Magic's tenure the title was a sweet F***U to all those who regaled with pleasure in the Lakers demise. Sorry for the language but remembering the antics of Ballmer, Clipper players, Stephen A hits a sore spot. |
The highlighted sentence says it all.
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PlantedTanks
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Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 3156
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| Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | PlantedTanks wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | My problem with the bubble title is not its legitimacy, but rather that the playoffs were unfulfilling, at least for me. It was like watching a high level version of The Basketball Tournament. There were no big crowds, we never had to play in hostile arenas, there were players who opted out, and in general the whole thing felt sort of sterile. If we had the playoffs in a bubble every year, it wouldn't be long before hardly anyone cared. But that does not affect the legitimacy of the title. It affects the payoff to me as a fan. Other people don't feel that way, and that is cool. |
Very little to discuss here sooooo
I disagree with your unfulfilled statement for 2 reasons.
First and most important is the playoffs and title run was a very welcomed occurrence in a time where many of us were living our lives worrying and concerned about our future, our loved ones while having to deal with issues about our jobs, money, housing, food. Having those 3 hours of game time over multiple games and weeks was the distraction and stress relief I believe many of us needed to bring some normalcy back to our lives. Winning the title was the "coup de grace" or as we normally say "coo de grah" for me.
Second after 6 missed playoff years and hearing all the shade being thrown at the Lakers especially after the end of Magic's tenure the title was a sweet F***U to all those who regaled with pleasure in the Lakers demise. Sorry for the language but remembering the antics of Ballmer, Clipper players, Stephen A hits a sore spot. |
The highlighted sentence says it all. |
Understood but thought you may want to know why others disagree but if not interested that is fine. |
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