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yinoma2001
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 Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:51 am Post subject: |
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Yup. AD is one of the top players in the league. He's fortunate though, to have LBJ really going balls to the walls every game, even in his 134th year in the NBA.
I'm just curious one day when LBJ hangs it up, who will push AD like that? I just don't think that's how AD rolls.
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ThePageDude
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 11:52 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | AD is still the man, and I know when it's actual winning time, he'll be ready.
But post LBJ, it's clear to me, that you will need an alpha dog who will push him on a game to game basis. He's so talented but still prone to mental coasting. |
I know this is the wrong thread for this but really this shows what an absolutely out-of-this-world player LBJ is. |
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ZeroDark30_
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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| MJST wrote: | These are the same problems that we had with AD last year.
But in the bubble he brought it and we were NBA Champions. There's no doubt AD can play better, but we've known he has a tendency to coast when he shouldn't and at times to a frustrating degree. But it's what you get with him, the good and the bad. Ultimately if the good outweighs the bad, especially if/when he elevates his game during the playoffs/finals that's what you want more than anything else because that's what gets the chip. |
If we’re being honest, AD had moments like this in the bubble too. He usually followed it up with a monster game. AD has effort issues and that’s disappointing considering his age and being in his absolute prime. |
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ZeroDark30_
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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| I didn’t watch too much AD before last season. Always knew he was a great player. Was last year a normal year for him or close to a career year? Other things I noticed. I always assumed he was a beast on the boards but since being a Lakers he regularly grabs under 10... I wonder if my expectations of him from game to game is fair or too high. Yes, he has great games but has consistency been a problem his entire career? I probably need to adjust my expectations. Being a longtime Bron fan makes it hard |
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BILBJH
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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When players like Shaq, Kareem, LBJ, Hakeem came into the league their teams would improve around 20 games
Orlando before Shaq 21-61
Orlando after Shaq 41-41
Milwaukee before Kareem 27-55
Milwaukee after Kareem 56-26
Cleveland before LBJ 17-65
Cleveland after LBJ 35-47
Houston before Hakeem 29-53
Houston after Hakeem 48-34
What's more is that all of their teams either won a championship or got into the finals within a few years.
When AD joined the Pelicans their record hardly changed. He never won a playoff series until he had Playoff Rondo
New Orleans before AD .318 winning percentage
New Orleans after AD .329 winning percentage
(I used winning percentage because one was a strike shortened season)
This is why I was leery of trading so many assets to sign him... especially when we could have waited
I'll admit I was wrong because I thought we couldn't win a title after trading half the team... but then again, who could predict we'd sign two potential Hall of Fame talents at minimum salaries (Rondo and Dwight)
The team's success is all predicated on LBJ's ability to continue to perform at a level of a man ten years younger. Also something I couldn't foresee.
If LBJ goes down... I honestly don't think AD can even lead us to the playoffs without him. On the other hand if AD went down... I think LBJ would still lead us there.
AD is a great compliment to LBJ but I still have yet to see that alpha quality that allowed teams to elevate. In fairness, I haven't seen Ingram able to do that yet either... and Lonzo has done little so right now we are still doing okay in terms of the trade. If Ingram develops some killer closing ability... or if one of their draft picks pays off... then maybe it becomes a net loss. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:40 pm Post subject: |
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We will worry about filling LBJ's major alpha hole on the roster once we get there. We are not there right now.
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lakersboy
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 3:05 pm Post subject: |
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| blackmamba08 wrote: | Not worried for AD at all. He proved us he is a champion. Coming back from long title winning season, short off season, signed huge deal.
At the moment not much of a motivation for him. |
I have a major problem with the last sentence. He has 190 mil reasons to be motivated. No player should be handsomely rewarded for their efforts and then proceed to not do as much as they used to. It starts from putting in the work, which based on his ft % and 3 pt shooting, shows he hasn't worked as hard as he should have. Period. |
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ZeroDark30_
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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| AD is starting to fall into the same complacency trap that all great players fall into playing alongside LeBron. Yes, even Wade after year 1. Only Kyrie avoided this. LeBron is so good at everything that great players tend to step back and allow him to run the show. Best rebounder on your old team. LeBron can be that. Best playmaker. LeBron can be that too. Wade, Bosh, Love all settled many nights. Kyrie, with all his faults, still played like he truly believed he was the best player on the floor. This complacency is one of the reasons why LeBron’s “super teams” never become dynasties. We need AD to not fall into this trap. Never settle and chase his own individual greatness. People making excuses for him need to stop. He’s 27 yo in his absolute prime and being paid 190 mil |
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BandwagonLBJhopper
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 4:29 pm Post subject: |
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| lakersboy wrote: | | blackmamba08 wrote: | Not worried for AD at all. He proved us he is a champion. Coming back from long title winning season, short off season, signed huge deal.
At the moment not much of a motivation for him. |
I have a major problem with the last sentence. He has 190 mil reasons to be motivated. No player should be handsomely rewarded for their efforts and then proceed to not do as much as they used to. It starts from putting in the work, which based on his ft % and 3 pt shooting, shows he hasn't worked as hard as he should have. Period. |
Amen to this. There really is no excuse, plenty of time for AD to ramp it up but he needs to put on his big boy pants and get it together. We are almost a quarter of the way through the season at this point. |
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troy
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| lakersboy wrote: | | blackmamba08 wrote: | Not worried for AD at all. He proved us he is a champion. Coming back from long title winning season, short off season, signed huge deal.
At the moment not much of a motivation for him. |
I have a major problem with the last sentence. He has 190 mil reasons to be motivated. No player should be handsomely rewarded for their efforts and then proceed to not do as much as they used to. It starts from putting in the work, which based on his ft % and 3 pt shooting, shows he hasn't worked as hard as he should have. Period. |
Agreed, 100% And this is where I get angry. You are bagging $30 million a year, and you need to be MOTIVATED to do your job? Or you need to coast for several games after having TWO MONTHS off to soak up the sun in the Olympic sized pool in the backyard of ONE of your mansions, after riding the coattails of Lebon James?
Maybe AD has reached his peak? Maybe we're just expecting too much from him. |
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leking006
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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| troy wrote: | | lakersboy wrote: | | blackmamba08 wrote: | Not worried for AD at all. He proved us he is a champion. Coming back from long title winning season, short off season, signed huge deal.
At the moment not much of a motivation for him. |
I have a major problem with the last sentence. He has 190 mil reasons to be motivated. No player should be handsomely rewarded for their efforts and then proceed to not do as much as they used to. It starts from putting in the work, which based on his ft % and 3 pt shooting, shows he hasn't worked as hard as he should have. Period. |
Agreed, 100% And this is where I get angry. You are bagging $30 million a year, and you need to be MOTIVATED to do your job? Or you need to coast for several games after having TWO MONTHS off to soak up the sun in the Olympic sized pool in the backyard of ONE of your mansions, after riding the coattails of Lebon James?
Maybe AD has reached his peak? Maybe we're just expecting too much from him. |
GEESH, just chill. As long as he give his all in the playoffs, I doesnt even matter he played like ass in the reg season. |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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Without AD, pre-2019 season (that resulted in a ring BTW) the Lebron led Lakers went lottery.
Whatever anyone wants to say about AD, they are entitled to. But his impact is obvious to me even if he averages 22 ppg on a lower usage vs 28 ppg on a higher usage.
I don’t think we are even a guaranteed playoff team without AD. Same for without Bron.
We just need to get our big 2 healthy and ready by playoffs in their peak. |
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BILBJH
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | Without AD, pre-2019 season (that resulted in a ring BTW) the Lebron led Lakers went lottery.
Whatever anyone wants to say about AD, they are entitled to. But his impact is obvious to me even if he averages 22 ppg on a lower usage vs 28 ppg on a higher usage.
I don’t think we are even a guaranteed playoff team without AD. Same for without Bron.
We just need to get our big 2 healthy and ready by playoffs in their peak. |
Come on, man. You know that team was headed for the playoffs until LBJ tore his groin. Then all the trade rumors destroyed the chemistry and everything went off the rails. |
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ZeroDark30_
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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| AD not playing today after his poor play all season is as disappointing as it gets. Forcing LeBron to drag this team every night. He’s supposed to be helping to extend his career but instead we got him load managing while the 36 year old hasn’t missed a game. |
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Kobetan
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| Posted: Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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| ZeroDark30_ wrote: | | AD not playing today after his poor play all season is as disappointing as it gets. Forcing LeBron to drag this team every night. He’s supposed to be helping to extend his career but instead we got him load managing while the 36 year old hasn’t missed a game. |
Got to give AD the benefit of the doubt here, his poor play could definitely have been due to the injury leading him to sit out.
That being said I think it's much clearer this season what kind of player Anthony is, which is a 1b instead of 1a. If that makes sense lol |
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Snipes
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 4:24 am Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | Without AD, pre-2019 season (that resulted in a ring BTW) the Lebron led Lakers went lottery.
Whatever anyone wants to say about AD, they are entitled to. But his impact is obvious to me even if he averages 22 ppg on a lower usage vs 28 ppg on a higher usage.
I don’t think we are even a guaranteed playoff team without AD. Same for without Bron.
We just need to get our big 2 healthy and ready by playoffs in their peak. |
This. He’s an absolute beast and his presence is severely underrated. He doesn’t always put up the numbers or impose his will but he’s our anchor and 22ppg while coasting doesn’t seem like a problem to me. |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 5:34 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, putting it on AD was weird, as we saw without AD the team lost to a weak Detroit team by 10+ points. Only put 92 on the board.
AD is being used differently. The entire situation is a bit of a cluster (bleep), while guys figure out new roles. I think this is easily solved by playing guys in the roles they have already established pre this season.
AD is the #1 option last year with the starters. This year, he is #2 sometimes he fades into #3. We have to get Bron back as a PG with that unit, to establish AD and get ADs usage rate back to 30%. One of the easiest ways to accomplish that is Wesley in for Dennis. Wesley plays the Danny Green low usage rate jumpshooting role.
By bringing Dennis off the bench, we would get a lot of momentum swung our way when he is on. Right now, he is doing average as a starter, however his usage rate is twice that of Danny Greens. It is easily replaced by a Caruso or someone like Wesley.
But what Dennis could do in the role off the bench, no one else can do on the team, save for maybe THT. The entire issue with the team is the lineups. They have been off all season. I do not know when they will put it together, but when they do, it will be great to see. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:28 am Post subject: |
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Wolf, why is it that everything goes back to Dennis? I don't think that's a panacea for AD. He's clearly in a mental funk (and he's admitted such). Dennis has been taking fewer non-in-the-flow shots in the past 10 games or so. AD has also said he's "trying to fit in."
He's a 1B player but playing with the mentality of a 3rd option. That's not on Dennis.
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BadGuy
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:41 am Post subject: |
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| Don't really care what he does in the regular season as long as he shows up in the playoffs, which he will. |
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ThePageDude
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:48 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | Wolf, why is it that everything goes back to Dennis? I don't think that's a panacea for AD. He's clearly in a mental funk (and he's admitted such). Dennis has been taking fewer non-in-the-flow shots in the past 10 games or so. AD has also said he's "trying to fit in."
He's a 1B player but playing with the mentality of a 3rd option. That's not on Dennis. |
For me it's not about criticizing DS, it's about getting that second unit to really hum - which I *thought* was a fundamental construct of building this year's team. Trezz looks like a worse version of himself - so far. As does Wes. The second unit looks mediocre despite having 2 past 6MOY candidates. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:53 am Post subject: |
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| ThePageDude wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | Wolf, why is it that everything goes back to Dennis? I don't think that's a panacea for AD. He's clearly in a mental funk (and he's admitted such). Dennis has been taking fewer non-in-the-flow shots in the past 10 games or so. AD has also said he's "trying to fit in."
He's a 1B player but playing with the mentality of a 3rd option. That's not on Dennis. |
For me it's not about criticizing DS, it's about getting that second unit to really hum - which I *thought* was a fundamental construct of building this year's team. Trezz looks like a worse version of himself - so far. As does Wes. The second unit looks mediocre despite having 2 past 6MOY candidates. |
I'm not a fan of the current rotations, though I'll admit that Vogel is tinkering around. He leaves DS/LBJ together for way too long sometimes. I would like DS to start, but be an early sub out for AC (who is playing too little). Then when LBJ subs out bring in DS so you have a DS/AC backcourt. That would be my preference.
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 8:16 am Post subject: |
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DS not starting is about roles
Bron goes back to PG - 2 off ball shooters.
DS gives the Lakers a much needed ball handler that can score and can play with freedom.
Trez should probably even switch with Gasol as starter. We don’t use Gasol floor spacing to our advantage, but if Bron/AD go into the post having Gasol can be useful if he takes 3s without hesitating. |
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ZeroDark30_
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 8:17 am Post subject: |
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| BadGuy wrote: | | Don't really care what he does in the regular season as long as he shows up in the playoffs, which he will. |
If LeBron has the exact mind frame in the regular season what would our seed be heading into the playoffs? Does that pass also extend to him too? |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2021 8:20 am Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | DS not starting is about roles
Bron goes back to PG - 2 off ball shooters.
DS gives the Lakers a much needed ball handler that can score and can play with freedom.
Trez should probably even switch with Gasol as starter. We don’t use Gasol floor spacing to our advantage, but if Bron/AD go into the post having Gasol can be useful if he takes 3s without hesitating. |
LBJ is 36, has insane amount of mileage. Having him go back to being forced to be the only creator last season isn't ideal IMO. That's why the Lakers traded for Dennis to begin with. It's just not being fully implemented right, especially staggering the rotations.
I also think Trezz as a starting center is a disaster. He gets into foul trouble off the bench against centers, imagine going up against starting centers like Joel, Jokic, etc. He would be on the bench again, but not playing due to foul issues.
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LakerSD
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