| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
MJST
Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26627
|
 Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CandyCanes wrote: | | HermosaJoe wrote: | | MJST wrote: | Not Trezz's thread but I have to say, Vogel not playing Gasol at backup 5 and Harrell at backup 4 which he said HE WOULD DO is getting frustrating by this point.
Trez is a solid backup 5, the best backup 5 in the game. But we have an opportunity to have Gasol as the backup 5 and him as the backup 4... and Vogel isn't even attempting it despite their games complimenting each other.
It's annoying and frustrating.
Anyway Drummond did fine. |
Exactly! I agree, very frustrating! Trez should be backup 4 with Gasol backup 5.
I disagree with Trez being a "solid" backup 5.......I just don't like his defense and rebounding, easy layups given up, etc. |
Can Trezz hit jumpers? Or would playing him at 4 be a spacing nightmare? He just isn’t tall enough to play Center on defense. |
Trez can hit jumpers but he'd be primarily playing in the paint. Gasol would be the one stretching the floor. Which is why they wouldn't be in each other'a way.
_________________
How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight. |
Vogel's reluctance to pull him in an actual meaningful game was strange.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
leking006
Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2018
Posts: 6457
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight. |
Powell ain't a shooter. It's them doing Blitz on Luka that was killed them and free those big men. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| leking006 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight. |
Powell ain't a shooter. It's them doing Blitz on Luka that was killed them and free those big men. |
The effect is the same when Luka is drawing a double team from your center 25 feet from the basket.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
leking006
Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2018
Posts: 6457
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | leking006 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight. |
Powell ain't a shooter. It's them doing Blitz on Luka that was killed them and free those big men. |
The effect is the same when Luka is drawing a double team from your center 25 feet from the basket. |
That's why I said its the Blitz that killed them. If they don't Blitz they can cover the shooters. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| leking006 wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | leking006 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight. |
Powell ain't a shooter. It's them doing Blitz on Luka that was killed them and free those big men. |
The effect is the same when Luka is drawing a double team from your center 25 feet from the basket. |
That's why I said its the Blitz that killed them. If they don't Blitz they can cover the shooters. |
A drop coverage with Drummond may have worked better at that point.
I still would take Luka isos against AD over any other defense, though.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BandwagonLBJhopper
Star Player
Joined: 07 Feb 2020
Posts: 3609
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2021 9:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| I don’t blame Drummond - Vogel has to be smarter that blitzing got wrecked from half time onward. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
governator
Retired Number
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 25138
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 25, 2021 7:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
| can't let a Powell outworked you, ever |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lar9149
Star Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2010
Posts: 2410
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | leking006 wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | leking006 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight. |
Powell ain't a shooter. It's them doing Blitz on Luka that was killed them and free those big men. |
The effect is the same when Luka is drawing a double team from your center 25 feet from the basket. |
That's why I said its the Blitz that killed them. If they don't Blitz they can cover the shooters. |
A drop coverage with Drummond may have worked better at that point.
I still would take Luka isos against AD over any other defense, though. |
I heard from the postgame basically Luka starting getting screens around the middle of the court rather than the sides which made the blitz vulnerable. Luka and coach Carlifse are masters at end of game adjustments like these. I remember last year the Lakers did a similar strategy against Luka but than they started doing screens further out. I think this was game 2 against the Mavs which the Lakers lost.
Unfortunately it seems the Lakers get flat footed on these adjustments and don’t seem to effective counterstratgies. At least right away. I mean I would think they have backup plan for these situations.
I also did notice one play where Luka got blitz on the screen on the lower corner of the court and AD correctly covered the man under the basket AD2 left. But when the ball was swung to the opposite end of the court AD2 looked like he was getting ready to guard the man under the basket again but he was suppose to guard the man on the opposite corner 3 which he was slow to rotate too. The shot was missed but it was open.
In the playoffs these rotations have to be spot on and fast. Hopefully over time theu can figure it out. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lakurluv
Star Player
Joined: 17 May 2010
Posts: 2529
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
Drummond has looked somewhat clumsy out on the floor at times. I can't tell if he's apprehensive or still getting back into basketball shape after sitting out for so long, who knows maybe it's the big-toe still giving him some trouble.
There are times, I expect him to go up and tear the rim down, catch a lob or just finish strong, but he goes up with a soft layup and oftentimes can't score the ball.
I'm starting to get suspect, however I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, because of all things considered. IMO he has until LBJ comes back to figure it out. Just the thought of him and AD in the front court is scary, so hopefully they can build a true chemistry to dominate the rest of this season.
The offense is significantly slower with both of them on the floor though. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Texas_Pete
Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 12825
Location: Somewhere watching a Laker game
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
Bron made Tristan Kardashian and Mozgov look good. Lakers paid big bucks to the latter player no thanks to Bron 
Drummond will look dominant at times in the playoffs. Bron seeks out mismatches all the time. In PnR, I could even see him seeking out 225lb KD with 280lb Drummond. KD gonna be in foul trouble.
As long as Drummond don't have Kwame hands he's gonna be a force when Bron gets back. Mark my words  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Cyberfreak444
Starting Rotation
Joined: 28 Nov 2019
Posts: 318
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:45 am Post subject: |
|
|
| BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | | I don’t blame Drummond - Vogel has to be smarter that blitzing got wrecked from half time onward. |
The problem is that Drummond isn’t particularly good at executing other schemes. When he drops he doesn’t have the leaping ability to still prevent the lob to athletic fives. He can’t switch. Trapping or at least hard hedging leverages his best defensive skills - his speed and his his active hands. But it also requires great team coordination that the Lakers just don’t have yet with Drummond and particularly with AD coming back into the lineup after a two month absence.
But yea there’s no question that trapping someone as talented at passing as Luka is asking for trouble. The fact that Drummond limits the Lakers’ otherwise more flexible defense is one of the reasons I don’t see him playing significant minutes (or at all) against certain playoff opponents. On the other hand, against a team where trapping is really useful like Portland, Drummond’s skillset will prove useful. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 6:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
I don’t think Drummond (or Trezz) will be in our closing playoff lineups. Maybe in some matchups Drummond may but I can see us going with:
Dennis/AC/KCP/LBJ/AD.
or
Dennis/KCP/LBJ/Morris/AD.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mamba Mentality
Star Player
Joined: 04 May 2017
Posts: 3078
Location: The Left Coast
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 10:45 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | I don’t think Drummond (or Trezz) will be in our closing playoff lineups. Maybe in some matchups Drummond may but I can see us going with:
Dennis/AC/KCP/LBJ/AD.
or
Dennis/KCP/LBJ/Morris/AD. |
I can see that DS/KCP/LBJ/Morris/AD.
Love AC, but we need some someone who can shoot down the stretch. He's like Trez, where he's only valuable on one side of the floor.
_________________
“You can't be held captive by the fear of failure or the fear of what people may say.” - Kobe Bryant |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakerSD
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016
Posts: 23798
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Mamba Mentality wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | I don’t think Drummond (or Trezz) will be in our closing playoff lineups. Maybe in some matchups Drummond may but I can see us going with:
Dennis/AC/KCP/LBJ/AD.
or
Dennis/KCP/LBJ/Morris/AD. |
I can see that DS/KCP/LBJ/Morris/AD.
Love AC, but we need some someone who can shoot down the stretch. He's like Trez, where he's only valuable on one side of the floor. |
To be fair AC has shown he’s a clutch, closing player.
He showed it last season in the Rockets series with the big game 4 shot. He has full confidence from coaching staff and teammates. Lebron doesn’t hesitate passing to him for 3s.
This season, he even helped Schroder close out the Hornets and after dropping both in Dallas, that’s looking like a critical W.
Vogel will have no issue using that 3 guard lineup. They showed some dominant minutes early this season. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think AC will likely close out with Dennis/KCP as a smaller backcourt.
But if size is imperative, then I could see AC out with Dennis/KCP plus LBJ/AD/3rd big/wing.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Yeah...no.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lar9149
Star Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2010
Posts: 2410
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
You know its interesting..prior to the Lakers getting AD2, some have said his post up efficiency is something like 0.143
which indicates he is really really bad
So far seeing him post up, hard to say if he is a great post up man, but he definitely isn't horrible. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hype
Star Player
Joined: 19 Nov 2007
Posts: 4386
Location: Lake Nacimiento
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2021 8:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| lar9149 wrote: | You know its interesting..prior to the Lakers getting AD2, some have said his post up efficiency is something like 0.143
which indicates he is really really bad
So far seeing him post up, hard to say if he is a great post up man, but he definitely isn't horrible. |
I think a lot of people forget that his best teammate for his entire career before coming here was Blake Griffin . Being a first option on lottery teams is not where Drummond should be. He's much better then that which is why so many people were laughing when those ridiculous stats kept being brought up here. He's got very solid hands, high iq and a strong desire to win. You don't want him consistently working the post especially on our team but he's far from bad or a liability there and if he has a mismatch i'd trust him.
Now when he has his first ever elite playmaker come back in Bron you'll see stretches in the Playoffs especially where he looks straight up dominant. Teams will have to worry about AD and Bron first by a large margin then there's also Dennis who is a legit threat all over the floor.. That's going to lead to times where Dre is going to learn how much easier life is not only playing for an actual solid team but with Bron. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
buduan
Starting Rotation
Joined: 24 Feb 2002
Posts: 773
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2021 8:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| hype wrote: | | buduan wrote: | If they can land Drummond then the Lakers title hopes are still alive.
If they can't I expect them to lose in the WC playoffs. |
By who? When healthy, they're pretty clearly the best team in the WC still and at worst still 100% capable of beating anyone even by standing pat.
EC is much more tricky with the Nets especially but I def. wouldn't say they have no chance at all especially if AD comes back healthy and fully rested. Good luck to at least the western conference when that happens  |
Utah and the Clippers. Phoenix would have a punchers chance. Big concern right now is can they get their rhythm by the time the playoffs start? They are rapidly approaching and Lebron is still not back.
Even if they find that rhythm the LAC and Utah are both dangerous teams. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JUST-MING
Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 44033
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2021 4:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
Not really sure about his fit.
We’ve seen Andre with Greg Monroe, Blake Griffin and Kevin Love. Is this the ideal pairing for Anthony Davis? For instance, Demarcus Cousins could shoot 3’s, handle and create for others. Stretch 5. His skills complimented Anthony as a banger and Lebron as a 3 point shooter. Andre doesn’t do any of that. If we’re honest, Marc is a better fit with Lebron than Andre. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lakerican
Star Player
Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 3793
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2021 5:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
| lakurluv wrote: | Drummond has looked somewhat clumsy out on the floor at times. I can't tell if he's apprehensive or still getting back into basketball shape after sitting out for so long, who knows maybe it's the big-toe still giving him some trouble.
There are times, I expect him to go up and tear the rim down, catch a lob or just finish strong, but he goes up with a soft layup and oftentimes can't score the ball.
I'm starting to get suspect, however I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, because of all things considered. IMO he has until LBJ comes back to figure it out. Just the thought of him and AD in the front court is scary, so hopefully they can build a true chemistry to dominate the rest of this season.
The offense is significantly slower with both of them on the floor though. |
He just play like this. Hopefully, he can continue shooting Free Throws at a 70%. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
King Randle
Star Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2014
Posts: 7313
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2021 5:19 am Post subject: |
|
|
| leking006 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight. |
Powell ain't a shooter. It's them doing Blitz on Luka that was killed them and free those big men. |
No question...that loss was on Vogel...Geez the Mavs figured out the trap at halftime and destroyed it....it was actually laughable Vogel made no adjustments. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakerSD
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016
Posts: 23798
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2021 6:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| King Randle wrote: | | leking006 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Can’t close out games with him against bigs who can spread the floor. He got destroyed tonight. |
Powell ain't a shooter. It's them doing Blitz on Luka that was killed them and free those big men. |
No question...that loss was on Vogel...Geez the Mavs figured out the trap at halftime and destroyed it....it was actually laughable Vogel made no adjustments. |
I’ll give Vogel the benefit of the doubt in this particular instance for 2 reasons:
1. He doesn’t have key guys in KCP and Lebron, who would make it that much tougher for Dallas to break the trap scheme and rotations.
2. Vogel doesn’t like to show his hand. I’m sure he has an adjustment to the Dallas adjustment if it’s exploited in the playoffs. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
