OJ Simpson is Disgusting
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 3:30 pm    Post subject:

Exick wrote:
Ah, Arrested Development. You live on in DVD form.


Actually, Arrested Development also lives on this obscure cable channel that I have called G4 TechTV. If you have digital cable, you might have it. They run the show frequently. I've got my DVR to record it whenever it comes on because I didn't catch onto the show until the final season.

It is by the way one of the best TV shows to ever air...and is definitely one of the best shows to have ever been cancelled...in it's prime no less.

I really, really hope that Ron Howard figures out a way to turn it into a movie.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 5:00 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
The Dagger wrote:
All proceeds from the book should go to his victim's family.


well i think indirectly they are. i think he's doing this because he needs cash to keeping paying the families from the civil trial. however mocking the fact that he murdered their children on national television and print..in order to pay damages for killing their children...is about as despicable an act as i can think of.


The families have not recieved any money owed to them. They won't get any from this either. After the civil trial, he vowed that they would not get a dime. I heard an attorney on the radio this morning saying that he has found a loophole or something about this deal and that he would not have done this if the families were to get any money from it.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
The families could go after the proceeds from the book's sales to pay off the judgment. But one legal analyst said there are ways to get around that requirement — such as having proceeds not go directly to Simpson.


LINK

:roll:
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 5:34 pm    Post subject:

I have an opinion and I wish to speak my mind about OJ Simpson.

If anyone buys his book or watches the Fox interview, they are supporting a murderer.

Yes, there are still some numbskulls on this earth that still believe OJ Simpson did not commit murder that June night in 1994.

If anyone has their doubt still or was too young to really know the details about the murder and botched trial, there are books to read that will let you know what REALLY happened and why he was found not guilty in his criminal trial but subsequently found guilty in his civil case. One in which he hasn't paid the Brown's or the Goldman's a dime for KILLING a member of each of their family.

Fox should be ashamed of themselves and people that watch this because reality tv is so brain numbing that keep in mind you are supporting a murderer.

Back in 1977 I had a babysitter that was murdered by the Hillside Strangler in Los Angeles. I have no pity and don't support murderers.

Anyone with a brain in their head should not support this man. I get sick to my stomach each time this man shows up at autograph sessions and people actually show up and ask this murderer to sign an USC jersey or make small talk with him.

Every time I see a clip of someone talking to him, I say to myself:

HE IS A MURDERER YOU STUPID FOOL.

Some people are just that stupid and blind to not know what happened that night.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 7:04 pm    Post subject:

TACH wrote:
So who's going to watch the interview? And who's going to boycott Fox?


If it takes this to get you to boycott Fox, you haven't been paying attention.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 11:27 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
The Dagger wrote:
All proceeds from the book should go to his victim's family.


well i think indirectly they are. i think he's doing this because he needs cash to keeping paying the families from the civil trial. however mocking the fact that he murdered their children on national television and print..in order to pay damages for killing their children...is about as despicable an act as i can think of.


Revised version below.


Last edited by postandpivot on Fri Nov 17, 2006 11:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 11:54 pm    Post subject:

I think this is OJ's confession, he knows it, we know it, and he knows we know it, but he can't come out and say it, so he writes a fictional story about the events of that night. But if he really is guilty, which he is, and which we all believe, then there is no doubt in my mind that everything written in that book is straight from his personal memory of that night. Think about it. If OJ killed Nicole and Ron, he obviously remembers every little detail that happened that night, and this is just a way to get everything off his chest. Wouldn't surprise me if he commits suicide after this.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:41 am    Post subject:

postandpivot, I tried reading your post, but it was so full of typos and grammatical mistakes, I couldn't make it through the first two paragraphs.

Anyways, talking about confessions:

Quote:
Publisher Calls Book a Confession by O. J. Simpson
By EDWARD WYATT

LOS ANGELES, Nov. 16 — The publisher of a book by O. J. Simpson, in which he hypothesizes about how he could have committed the 1994 murder of his ex-wife and her friend, said on Thursday that she believed Mr. Simpson’s statements were, in fact, a confession.

“The book is his confession,” the publisher, Judith Regan, said during a telephone interview. “I would have had no interest in publishing anything but that.”

Titled “If I Did It,” the book is scheduled for release on Nov. 30. A two-part television interview of Mr. Simpson is to be broadcast on Fox on Nov. 27 and Nov. 29.

Ms. Regan acknowledged, however, that Mr. Simpson, who was acquitted of criminal charges in the slayings, did not say directly in the book or the interview that he killed his former wife, Nicole Brown Simpson, and her friend, Ronald L. Goldman. Rather, he spoke about the murders in the hypothetical sense, a stance that admits nothing and could be viewed as a denial.

But the plans for the book, and the interviews, have created a storm of outrage from family members of the victims and from women’s groups and victims’ rights organizations.

Ms. Regan defended her decision to publish the book, which she said was spurred in part because she, like Nicole Brown Simpson, was a victim of domestic abuse. She added that she was willing to help the victims’ families recover any money that flowed to Mr. Simpson from the book.

Ms. Regan also said she was told that the advance and royalties for the book, which was written with an uncredited ghostwriter, would go to Mr. Simpson’s children and not to him. Mr. Simpson owes $33.5 million plus accumulated interest to the victims’ families after being judged responsible for the deaths in civil court.

Fred Goldman, the father of Ronald Goldman, said in an interview on ABC’s “Good Morning America” on Thursday that Mr. Simpson did not deserve the public forum being given to him by Fox and ReganBooks, an imprint of HarperCollins.

“He destroyed my son and took from my family Ron’s life and future,” Mr. Goldman said. “And for that I’ll hate him always and find him despicable.”

Denise Brown, the sister of Nicole Brown Simpson, issued a statement accusing Ms. Regan of “promoting the wrongdoing of criminals.”

Ms. Regan defended her actions, saying that she was approached with the idea of a book by “a manager who represents a third party,” and that the third party owned the rights to the story. She declined to identify the party and referred a reporter to a lawyer at HarperCollins. Telephone calls to HarperCollins and its legal department were not returned.

“We contracted with the third party,” she said. “I was told that the money would go to his children. They said the money was not going to Simpson. If it is I hope Fred Goldman and the Browns and everyone else can get it.”

Asked if she would help the victims’ families gain access to the money to help satisfy the court judgment against Mr. Simpson, Ms. Regan said, “If they want any information I’m happy to give it to them.”

A Florida lawyer who represents Mr. Simpson was quoted by The New York Post on Thursday as saying that he had no knowledge of the deal before the news was released on Tuesday. The lawyer, Yale Galanter, did not return repeated telephone calls for comment.

Mr. Simpson lives in Florida, where homestead laws protect a person’s house against seizure for the payment of court judgments. His pension from the National Football League, which has been estimated at $400,000 a year, also cannot be seized. With no other obvious income, there has been little for the victims’ families to recover.

Ms. Regan said she did not understand the criticism being leveled at her over the book and television interview.

“Barbara Walters interviews murderers, dictators and criminals,” she said. “Katie Couric interviewed him, and no one said anything,” she added.

However, an interview with Mr. Simpson conducted by Ms. Couric and broadcast on NBC in 2004 on the 10th anniversary of the murders, drew protest from some viewers.

In 1995, Mr. Simpson had sought a pay-per-view arrangement for the interview, but pay-per-view sponsors balked. NBC said this week that it had been offered the chance to bid on the rights to broadcast the new interview with Mr. Simpson, which was conducted by Ms. Regan, but that it declined.

ABC executives, who spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak for the network, said on Thursday that the network also declined to bid on the interview rights.

Unlike most news organizations that conduct interviews, Ms. Regan’s publishing company paid millions of dollars for the rights to Mr. Simpson’s story. The National Enquirer reported last month that ReganBooks is paying $3.5 million for the rights, but Ms. Regan said on Thursday that the amount was “far less,” though she declined to specify by how much.

Ms. Regan said that Mr. Simpson’s conduct during the interview convinced her of his guilt. A segment of the interview is on Fox’s Web site at www.fox.com/oj.

“When you see the interview, you’ll be stunned by his thought process,” she said. “In my view, this is his confession.”

Ms. Regan said she took on the subject because she viewed it as her duty as a publisher and because “I wanted him to confess for very personal reasons.”

Ms. Regan expounded on those reasons in an essay that she provided to The New York Times. In the 2,200-word essay, Ms. Regan states that she was the victim of domestic abuse and that she was not surprised that many people did not believe Mr. Simpson could be guilty of murder or abuse.

“I’d seen it before,” Ms. Regan wrote, “the men in court, dressed in their designer suits, blaming the women they attacked. I’d seen, firsthand, the ‘criminal injustice system,’ as I called it in my 20s — the system that let him go one night after assaulting me so he could come right back and do it again.”

Ms. Regan also wrote that she believed it was her responsibility as a publisher to bring Mr. Simpson’s words to the public, and she likened her role to “the mainstream publishers who keep Adolf Hitler’s ‘Mein Kampf’ in print to this day.”

In her phone interview she said: “I think this confession is a historic part of an event that needed closure. We are all in the publishing business, and our business is to tell stories about what is going on. This is a news event.”

Bill Carter contributed reporting from New York.


NY Times LINK
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 7:04 am    Post subject:

Ouch, encina, ouch.



Ojay did lossed it did not him?
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 8:29 am    Post subject:

I met Denise Brown a couple weeks back at a DA/law enforcement function.

Nice lady, not what I expected and a tall drink of water.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 10:56 pm    Post subject:

encina1 wrote:
postandpivot, I tried reading your post, but it was so full of typos and grammatical mistakes, I couldn't make it through the first two paragraphs.

Anyways, talking about confessions:

Quote:
Publisher Calls Book a Confession by O. J. Simpson
By EDWARD WYATT

LOS ANGELES, Nov. 16 — The publisher of a book by O. J. Simpson, in which he hypothesizes about how he could have committed the 1994 murder of his ex-wife and her friend, said on Thursday that she believed Mr. Simpson’s statements were, in fact, a confession.

“The book is his confession,” the publisher, Judith Regan, said during a telephone interview. “I would have had no interest in publishing anything but that.”

Titled “If I Did It,” the book is scheduled for release on Nov. 30. A two-part television interview of Mr. Simpson is to be broadcast on Fox on Nov. 27 and Nov. 29.

Ms. Regan acknowledged, however, that Mr. Simpson, who was acquitted of criminal charges in the slayings, did not say directly in the book or the interview that he killed his former wife, Nicole Brown Simpson, and her friend, Ronald L. Goldman. Rather, he spoke about the murders in the hypothetical sense, a stance that admits nothing and could be viewed as a denial.

But the plans for the book, and the interviews, have created a storm of outrage from family members of the victims and from women’s groups and victims’ rights organizations.

Ms. Regan defended her decision to publish the book, which she said was spurred in part because she, like Nicole Brown Simpson, was a victim of domestic abuse. She added that she was willing to help the victims’ families recover any money that flowed to Mr. Simpson from the book.

Ms. Regan also said she was told that the advance and royalties for the book, which was written with an uncredited ghostwriter, would go to Mr. Simpson’s children and not to him. Mr. Simpson owes $33.5 million plus accumulated interest to the victims’ families after being judged responsible for the deaths in civil court.

Fred Goldman, the father of Ronald Goldman, said in an interview on ABC’s “Good Morning America” on Thursday that Mr. Simpson did not deserve the public forum being given to him by Fox and ReganBooks, an imprint of HarperCollins.

“He destroyed my son and took from my family Ron’s life and future,” Mr. Goldman said. “And for that I’ll hate him always and find him despicable.”

Denise Brown, the sister of Nicole Brown Simpson, issued a statement accusing Ms. Regan of “promoting the wrongdoing of criminals.”

Ms. Regan defended her actions, saying that she was approached with the idea of a book by “a manager who represents a third party,” and that the third party owned the rights to the story. She declined to identify the party and referred a reporter to a lawyer at HarperCollins. Telephone calls to HarperCollins and its legal department were not returned.

“We contracted with the third party,” she said. “I was told that the money would go to his children. They said the money was not going to Simpson. If it is I hope Fred Goldman and the Browns and everyone else can get it.”

Asked if she would help the victims’ families gain access to the money to help satisfy the court judgment against Mr. Simpson, Ms. Regan said, “If they want any information I’m happy to give it to them.”

A Florida lawyer who represents Mr. Simpson was quoted by The New York Post on Thursday as saying that he had no knowledge of the deal before the news was released on Tuesday. The lawyer, Yale Galanter, did not return repeated telephone calls for comment.

Mr. Simpson lives in Florida, where homestead laws protect a person’s house against seizure for the payment of court judgments. His pension from the National Football League, which has been estimated at $400,000 a year, also cannot be seized. With no other obvious income, there has been little for the victims’ families to recover.

Ms. Regan said she did not understand the criticism being leveled at her over the book and television interview.

“Barbara Walters interviews murderers, dictators and criminals,” she said. “Katie Couric interviewed him, and no one said anything,” she added.

However, an interview with Mr. Simpson conducted by Ms. Couric and broadcast on NBC in 2004 on the 10th anniversary of the murders, drew protest from some viewers.

In 1995, Mr. Simpson had sought a pay-per-view arrangement for the interview, but pay-per-view sponsors balked. NBC said this week that it had been offered the chance to bid on the rights to broadcast the new interview with Mr. Simpson, which was conducted by Ms. Regan, but that it declined.

ABC executives, who spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak for the network, said on Thursday that the network also declined to bid on the interview rights.

Unlike most news organizations that conduct interviews, Ms. Regan’s publishing company paid millions of dollars for the rights to Mr. Simpson’s story. The National Enquirer reported last month that ReganBooks is paying $3.5 million for the rights, but Ms. Regan said on Thursday that the amount was “far less,” though she declined to specify by how much.

Ms. Regan said that Mr. Simpson’s conduct during the interview convinced her of his guilt. A segment of the interview is on Fox’s Web site at www.fox.com/oj.

“When you see the interview, you’ll be stunned by his thought process,” she said. “In my view, this is his confession.”

Ms. Regan said she took on the subject because she viewed it as her duty as a publisher and because “I wanted him to confess for very personal reasons.”

Ms. Regan expounded on those reasons in an essay that she provided to The New York Times. In the 2,200-word essay, Ms. Regan states that she was the victim of domestic abuse and that she was not surprised that many people did not believe Mr. Simpson could be guilty of murder or abuse.

“I’d seen it before,” Ms. Regan wrote, “the men in court, dressed in their designer suits, blaming the women they attacked. I’d seen, firsthand, the ‘criminal injustice system,’ as I called it in my 20s — the system that let him go one night after assaulting me so he could come right back and do it again.”

Ms. Regan also wrote that she believed it was her responsibility as a publisher to bring Mr. Simpson’s words to the public, and she likened her role to “the mainstream publishers who keep Adolf Hitler’s ‘Mein Kampf’ in print to this day.”

In her phone interview she said: “I think this confession is a historic part of an event that needed closure. We are all in the publishing business, and our business is to tell stories about what is going on. This is a news event.”

Bill Carter contributed reporting from New York.


NY Times LINK


if it was that tuFFFF. you should've thrown it in MS word. . i of couse didn't edit the thing after i posted. and didn't even proof read it. so it is what it is. or was what it was.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 11:05 pm    Post subject:

24 wrote:
TACH wrote:
So who's going to watch the interview? And who's going to boycott Fox?


If it takes this to get you to boycott Fox, you haven't been paying attention.
Although not a regular view of Fox News... I do tune in from time to time see what 'they' are up too...

However, I thought this was going to be on Fox (not Fox News)... I wasn't aware people were boycotting 24, NFC football, Prison Break, etc....
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 11:13 pm    Post subject:

alright encina. i read it over and you were correct. I didn't know it was that bad. "lossed =Lost". that's PandPbonics.

--
Okay, let me go ahead and play the other side of the fence. Just because it’s pretty obvious Ojay has lost it. Besides the fact whether or not he did it, or we think he did it or knew who did or had a clue. That’s not even relevant here.

Because in all reality. We remember that Kobe situation in eagle right.

Now let’s say 5 years go by. And Kobe wants to right a book about; "if I would've rapped her..." some people would be outraged. And that would be their right. But others who never believed that Kobe did this would write it off.

This is why this seems or maybe is so ridiculous. It’s because we think the man is guilty. Now granted the way our judicial system is supposed to work, is that you're innocent until proven guilty. So, if you're actually never proven to be guilty enough for jurors to convict you. Then basically, you technically are innocent still. And therefore did not do this.

Okay now, as hard as it is to do. Just imagine if you will. That ojay is truly innocent, didn't do it, and didn’t know who did it or maybe who might have. Totally innocent just like he said he was. Then would you be so appalled by this book? Probably not.

And the reason being you would look at it as if Ojay is mocking those people that keep trying to make him guilty when he is not. And doing so ruined the rest of his life. Sure, he has more money then a lot of 9 to 5ers. But he's not Ojay aka Hertz Simpson. And that is probably thee most important to him.

I and my brother were just talking about this. How is ojay making money in general? NO more hertz. He can't show his face on TV without people boycotting like its 60's civil rights movement.

He can't have his voice on the radio. Perhaps he's a handy man or something. But besides that, what is ojay going to do to make money? Nothing really. Because people made him guilty because everything we saw was good evidence pointed either at Ojay or at Ojay knowing something he wasn't telling. So for that he lost his life. Now remember we're assuming at this point that we some how found out he was 100% innocent. But now, could you understand how he could reach this low?

It’s not like he can come to your local kid’s high school and speak for 10grand or so. Or speak at a USC school graduation for 100grand a pop.

This is what these old, superstar/hall of famers/legends do. They go around writing motivation books, and doing motivational speeches. Coaching, or leaning more into the entertainment business. Those things are something okay can't do. Because we ASSUME that he's guilty.

^^now even after all that siding with Crazy Simpson. The moment I heard that, I was half asleep. I was dreaming to my self, "I hope Ojay and that stupid and crazy to do something like this". Low and behold I wake up and it’s all over the news. I just shook my head as to say, this world is a mess and it’s our fault.

If it wasn't a mess, that book wouldn't sell more then 1 copy. 1 that ojay purchases himself. But don’t worry it may end up becoming a best seller if it was written well. And that’s just because we as people just can't say no to the newest latest gossip, negative news/info. We just can’t say no. and that my dear friends. is what makes us just as bad as crazy Ojay.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2006 11:26 pm    Post subject:

OJ has a phat pension from the NFL, and a retirement fund (something like $25 million) which is off-limits in regards to the civil damages
Quote:
California law protects pensions from being used to satisfy judgments, so Simpson was able to continue much of his lifestyle based on his NFL pension. A 2000 Rolling Stone article reported that Simpson also still makes a significant income by signing autographs. He subsequently moved from California to Miami, Florida. In Florida, a person's residence cannot be seized to collect a debt under most circumstances.
Hell, he probably made a nice chuck of change this year with the way the market has been going. OJ is fine in the money department.

Hard to believe people still want his autograph...
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2006 11:44 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
TACH wrote:
So who's going to watch the interview? And who's going to boycott Fox?


in my opinion fox broadcasted nothing but garbage mtv-inspired action shows anyway. i don't watch a single show on that network ever since they cancelled the best show they've had on there in years (arrested development).

i would never watch that interview. anyone who does is horrible.


I don't have the link to the LA TImes piece on this, but guess what?

Fox News AND the publishing company putting out the "IF" book? Both of them are owned by Rupert Murdoch.

Fox News commentators are blasting the very book that ultimately their own boss is publishing, and the head of the publishing company (Judith Regan) is going to "interview" OJ in a Fox News exclusive next week -- all as part of November sweeps.

Forget whatever you think Fox's political biases are / are not.

OJ just secured a 12-bedroom, 8-bath, beach house in Hell for this.

And the Fox media empire just got a whole row of cabanas next door.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2006 12:26 am    Post subject:

MIMLaker wrote:
ocho wrote:
TACH wrote:
So who's going to watch the interview? And who's going to boycott Fox?


in my opinion fox broadcasted nothing but garbage mtv-inspired action shows anyway. i don't watch a single show on that network ever since they cancelled the best show they've had on there in years (arrested development).

i would never watch that interview. anyone who does is horrible.


I don't have the link to the LA TImes piece on this, but guess what?

Fox News AND the publishing company putting out the "IF" book? Both of them are owned by Rupert Murdoch.

Fox News commentators are blasting the very book that ultimately their own boss is publishing, and the head of the publishing company (Judith Regan) is going to "interview" OJ in a Fox News exclusive next week -- all as part of November sweeps.

Forget whatever you think Fox's political biases are / are not.

OJ just secured a 12-bedroom, 8-bath, beach house in Hell for this.

And the Fox media empire just got a whole row of cabanas next door.

MIM


^^^I knew i smelled a rat. thats terrible.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 12:52 pm    Post subject:

NEWS CORP. CANCELS O.J. SIMPSON BOOK AND TV SPECIAL...
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 12:54 pm    Post subject:

TACH wrote:
NEWS CORP. CANCELS O.J. SIMPSON BOOK AND TV SPECIAL...


wow. integrity in the media. never would have guessed.

thing that irks me is that simpson probably still gets the money without having to deal with the public outcry now. and the newscorp should have never even pursued this venture and only cancelled it when people got pissed but at least it'll never see the light of day.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 1:08 pm    Post subject:

The book is written... I'm sure some publishing house will put it out....
I also wonder if the interview is already recorded?
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 1:34 pm    Post subject:

i wanted to see it because the publisher is a hot piece of ass


F OJ... the guy is a idiot for not staying out of the light


also.. IMO... i dont think he did it.... Ron and Nicole were into drugs in which the media didnt emphasize enough on. both were drug users and i really think both of them got killed by drug dealers
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 1:36 pm    Post subject:

LINK

Here is a link to the cancellation story. Some tidbits:

Quote:
Sales had been strong, but not sensational. "If I Did It" cracked the top 20 of Amazon.com last weekend, but by Monday afternoon, at the time its cancellation had been announced, the book had fallen to No. 51.


So some people actually spent money on it.

Quote:
The industry trade publication Broadcasting & Cable editorialized against the show Monday, saying "Fox should cancel this evil sweeps stunt."

One of the nation's largest superstore chains, Borders Group Inc., said last week it would donate any profits on the book to charity.


Which charity?
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LarryCoon
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 1:37 pm    Post subject:

LakerFanAlways wrote:
I mean seriously, is there anyone out there that still thinks this fool is innocent?

Yes. I had an argument on Usenet with one of 'em last week:

LINK
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angel
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 2:38 pm    Post subject:

The entire matter is sickening. I don't know how they could have even considered the projects.
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Kobe>Lebron
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:20 pm    Post subject:

LarryCoon wrote:
LakerFanAlways wrote:
I mean seriously, is there anyone out there that still thinks this fool is innocent?

Yes. I had an argument on Usenet with one of 'em last week:

LINK



Larry Coon I didnt read your argument but I have always had my suspicions about the whole thing. I watched the trial and heard the evidence. IMHO I beleive OJ was there he probably even participated in the killings or had it done and watched but I do not think he murdered those two people alone. If you look back at the case the timeline and the ease in which he would have killed two people (one a very athletic man) without being seen in a crowded condo complex, give me some doubts about him being fully responsible for the actual murders. All the DNA evidence however points to him being the guy that pushed the buttons. So in a sense yes he is guilty but I dont think he did the whole thing by himself.

It is hard to say this because everyone looks at you like your crazy, but I am being honest. I dislike OJ he is an SOB but I am not sure it is as cut and dry as him committing 2 murders alone.
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TACH
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:30 pm    Post subject:

LarryCoon wrote:
LakerFanAlways wrote:
I mean seriously, is there anyone out there that still thinks this fool is innocent?

Yes. I had an argument on Usenet with one of 'em last week:

LINK
WOW
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