There is a bit of hypersensitivity in defending BI though.
Bingo.
People said the same thing in the DLO thread. Time is a flat circle. Who the young Laker is doesn't matter to a certain degree. It's the fans that repeat the same thing over and over again. I'm not above it either. After everyone piled on DLO after the Swaggy incident. I realized how harsh I had been before.
DLO was DONE after that incident. There was no way to have a rational conversation about the kid after that.
But the BI thread, I see a few trolls here and there, but I also see people taking their time to explain their critiques of BI too. We should be able to do so without getting accusatory and personal.
from my understanding he was done but it had nothing to do with the locker room incident
See this proves the point. Folks were piling on him BEFORE he played his first SPL game. And it's pure ignorance to say that the snitch thing only added fuel to the fire that they had started.
Oh I remember.
my reference/understanding come from the coaching staff not the fans
After he liked the tweet that said his boss would be stupid, I knew he was out of here. He brought a lot of the hate he got on himself. I’m happy he’s doing well in Brooklyn no off court dramas so far, good for him.
I missed that one...all I know is I was a fan and supported him during Swaggy stuff but was told that he was already gone...when asked why the sauce said 'don't ask' and I didn't
DLO was DONE after that incident. There was no way to have a rational conversation about the kid after that.
But the BI thread, I see a few trolls here and there, but I also see people taking their time to explain their critiques of BI too. We should be able to do so without getting accusatory and personal.
I think that incident may end up being a good thing for DLO in the long run. He's matured a lot since then, on and off the court. Rooting for the kid.
I think the critics are mostly fine.
When it jumps to the level of "we're better off without Ingram", or "we're winning despite Ingram", or "any game Ingram doesn't shoot above 50% is a bad game". That's when it gets a little ridiculous.
Worse than what DLO got? Of course not. But ridiculous nonetheless.
Honestly, the DLO defenders made the DLO thread worse. You couldn’t point out if he had a bad game or not without his defenders getting up in arms about any minor criticisms. I was a DLO supporter and had to avoid that thread all together.
I haven’t seen any hypersensitive Ingram defender in this thread. Most of his supporters have been astute in their assessment of his game in my opinion
Oh my.
B/c so much in that thread was on-court related.
I wouldn’t know, I avoided that thread like a plague ever since the snitching incident _________________ My Dream Starting 5 next Season
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 2:58 pm Post subject:
Luminous8 wrote:
He was standing up for his teammate and saw several red jerseys surrounding Rondo. If you’re someone who actually has been in fights in your youth over your friends at a bar, school, wherever,... then you will understand the logic here. It wasn’t a selfish act. I’ve been in many fights over my friends when I was younger.
some grew up different....but growing up in them hills will teach most how to give and take an ass whoopin be careful when you are in someone else's coal camp running your mouth
Let's not turn this into another thread like that please.
For everyone's sake!
Especially now that we are the best we've been since 2013 and trending upwards. Some of these comments in these threads (mainly regarding trades, and young players) just kill the joy of watching this team to me.
But I get that people enjoy analyzing players, being critical and being right on their takes. Otherwise they wouldn't continue doing it.
I for one am rooting for BI. Hope everyone else does for our players.
I mean we still need him unless we plan on running Lebron and Kuzma into the ground. Also pretty obvious the team needs his minutes and his length on defense.
Joined: 29 Aug 2004 Posts: 11197 Location: The Other Perspective
Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:17 pm Post subject:
I think the team would be better with BI solidifying our bench, but I don't think Luke and Magic would do it. They love him too much. _________________ "Chick lived and breathed Lakers basketball…but he was also fair and objective and called every game the way it was played."
-from Chick: His Unpublished Memoirs and the Memories of Those Who Knew Him
I think the team would be better with BI solidifying our bench, but I don't think Luke and Magic would do it. They love him too much.
I think it depends on matchups to be honest. Hart has really been knocking down those 3’s which is required with our offense for this team to really shine.
BI brings a stronger perimeter defense element that can’t be ignored however. BI would have been able to lock down some guys that have burned us these past games.
It’s going to depend on matchups I suspect. Hart just doesn’t have the same length BI does to impact shots on the perimeter.
I think the team would be better with BI solidifying our bench, but I don't think Luke and Magic would do it. They love him too much.
I think it depends on matchups to be honest. Hart has really been knocking down those 3’s which is required with our offense for this team to really shine.
BI brings a stronger perimeter defense element that can’t be ignored however. BI would have been able to lock down some guys that have burned us these past games.
It’s going to depend on matchups I suspect. Hart just doesn’t have the same length BI does to impact shots on the perimeter.
But Hart is much quicker plus Hart's the best 3-pt shooter for the Lakers. That makes him the perfect complimentary player for Lebron. When you have BI and Lonzo who both can't spread floor playing alongside Lebron, it makes Lebron a lot less effective. BI is ball dominant like Lebron so he should be the ball handler when Lebron is sitting. Hence, BI makes the perfect bench player.
I hope BI sits out a few weeks so we could get a larger sample of games without him but early indications show that the team is playing better without BI. _________________ #SellTheLakers
Kuz benefits from getting the lineup BI should have been a part of since the beginning of the season. and Kuz gets a lot of the looks BI would be getting in the same scenario.
Again, people bash on BI as if he's been playing the 3 at all this year. When they say stuff like "Oh Ingram needs to come off the bench cause Kuzma is playing too well" they neglect to remember that BI hasn't played the 3 all year, he's been forced to play the 2 which is not his position nor where he can be maximized nor is it where you can get the best out of him. So it hasn't even been a minutes competition between him and Kuzma. But people saying stuff like that shows they really see BI as a 3 and know he's playing out of position. Otherwise you'd hear "Hart" and not "Kuzma".
Kuzma is a 3/4 we know this by now, he gets to benefit now from being in the Lonzo/Hart/LeBron/McGee lineup that we'd been saying for months we wanted BI to be a part of.
Luke hasn't played BI at the 3 all year so "Kuzma" is not the question, it's Hart because Luke refuses to acknowledge BI is a SF he's forcing to play the 2 which is where Hart should be.
A shame though to see people diminishing what Ingram can do, and again taking him for granted.
When the Lakers get rid of him and he's balling out on another team at the position he should have been playing this season and people wonder where it came from, they can look at Luke again and wonder https://vine.co/v/OEZ6mg32MQt _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
Last edited by MJST on Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:57 am; edited 1 time in total
Kuz benefits from getting the lineup BI should have been a part of since the beginning of the season. and Kuz gets a lot of the looks BI would be getting in the same scenario.
Again, people bash on BI as if he's been playing the 3 at all this year. When they say stuff like "Oh Ingram needs to come off the bench cause Kuzma is playing too well" they neglect to remember that BI hasn't played the 3 all year, he's been forced to play the 2 which is not his position nor where he can be maximized nor is it where you can get the best out of him. So it hasn't even been a minutes competition between him and Kuzma. But people saying stuff like that shows they really see BI as a 3 and know he's playing out of position. Otherwise you'd hear "Hart" and not "Kuzma".
Kuzma is a 3/4 we know this by now, he gets to benefit now from being in the Lonzo/Hart/LeBron/McGee lineup that we'd been saying for months we wanted BI to be a part of.
Luke hasn't played BI at the 3 all year so "Kuzma" is not the question, it's Hart because Luke refuses to acknowledge BI is a SF he's forcing to play the 2 which is where Hart should be.
So you want your best player to play out of position just to please Ingram?... Don't make sense. Lebron will not play PF all season long, he only does if there is no other options.
Kuz benefits from getting the lineup BI should have been a part of since the beginning of the season. and Kuz gets a lot of the looks BI would be getting in the same scenario.
Again, people bash on BI as if he's been playing the 3 at all this year. When they say stuff like "Oh Ingram needs to come off the bench cause Kuzma is playing too well" they neglect to remember that BI hasn't played the 3 all year, he's been forced to play the 2 which is not his position nor where he can be maximized nor is it where you can get the best out of him. So it hasn't even been a minutes competition between him and Kuzma. But people saying stuff like that shows they really see BI as a 3 and know he's playing out of position. Otherwise you'd hear "Hart" and not "Kuzma".
Kuzma is a 3/4 we know this by now, he gets to benefit now from being in the Lonzo/Hart/LeBron/McGee lineup that we'd been saying for months we wanted BI to be a part of.
Luke hasn't played BI at the 3 all year so "Kuzma" is not the question, it's Hart because Luke refuses to acknowledge BI is a SF he's forcing to play the 2 which is where Hart should be.
So you want your best player to play out of position just to please Ingram?... Don't make sense. Lebron will not play PF all season long, he only does if there is no other options.
LeBron would be playing the 4 anyway if the Lakers got Durant or Kawhi which was their "master plan" so that argument doesn't hold.
It also doesn't hold when LeBron is fully capable of playing the 4, has shown himself to be very effective at the 4, and can play the 1,3,4 without any trouble.
Be really honest. the 3 and the 4 aren't very different for LeBron. And definitely not as different as the 2 and the 3 are for BI.
if LeBron had to make a 2% adjustment to play the 4 and BI has to make a 30-40% adjustment to play the 2, you have LeBron play the 4 and BI play the 3.
That's essentially what we're seeing with Kuzma.
So you can't really argue that if Lonzo/Hart/Kuzma/LeBron/McGee can work that Lonzo/Hart/Ingram/LeBron/McGee can't.
Playing the 4 isn't gonna destroy and wear down LeBron's body. His offense is predicated on getting to the basket, and even then he's taken his game more to the perimeter this season thus far.
So again, if LeBron was playing the 4, you likely wouldn't even notice.
BI would be getting essentially the same looks he got off ball and cutting that Kuzma gets now, that BI got last year with Randle and excelled at.
Remember 'off ball Ingram is the best Ingram' and GT's 'Off the Ball' video? That's how we expected BI to be used this year because it was the most obvious, effectively replacing Randle with LeBron in those scenarios.
But of course Luke didn't do what was obvious to the rest of us. As usual. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
Kuz benefits from getting the lineup BI should have been a part of since the beginning of the season. and Kuz gets a lot of the looks BI would be getting in the same scenario.
Again, people bash on BI as if he's been playing the 3 at all this year. When they say stuff like "Oh Ingram needs to come off the bench cause Kuzma is playing too well" they neglect to remember that BI hasn't played the 3 all year, he's been forced to play the 2 which is not his position nor where he can be maximized nor is it where you can get the best out of him. So it hasn't even been a minutes competition between him and Kuzma. But people saying stuff like that shows they really see BI as a 3 and know he's playing out of position. Otherwise you'd hear "Hart" and not "Kuzma".
Kuzma is a 3/4 we know this by now, he gets to benefit now from being in the Lonzo/Hart/LeBron/McGee lineup that we'd been saying for months we wanted BI to be a part of.
Luke hasn't played BI at the 3 all year so "Kuzma" is not the question, it's Hart because Luke refuses to acknowledge BI is a SF he's forcing to play the 2 which is where Hart should be.
A shame though to see people diminishing what Ingram can do, and again taking him for granted.
When the Lakers get rid of him and he's balling out on another team at the position he should have been playing this season and people wonder where it came from, they can look at Luke again and wonder
Luke Walton here, I promise to play BI at the 3 if he promises in return to play off the ball more, shoot more 3s, pound the ball less, shoot mid rangers if it pleases but shoot over 50% on his 2 pointers overall..deal?
Not throwing shade at BI but he's not going to change the way he plays because of some arbitrary number assigned to him.
Kuz benefits from getting the lineup BI should have been a part of since the beginning of the season. and Kuz gets a lot of the looks BI would be getting in the same scenario.
Again, people bash on BI as if he's been playing the 3 at all this year. When they say stuff like "Oh Ingram needs to come off the bench cause Kuzma is playing too well" they neglect to remember that BI hasn't played the 3 all year, he's been forced to play the 2 which is not his position nor where he can be maximized nor is it where you can get the best out of him. So it hasn't even been a minutes competition between him and Kuzma. But people saying stuff like that shows they really see BI as a 3 and know he's playing out of position. Otherwise you'd hear "Hart" and not "Kuzma".
Kuzma is a 3/4 we know this by now, he gets to benefit now from being in the Lonzo/Hart/LeBron/McGee lineup that we'd been saying for months we wanted BI to be a part of.
Luke hasn't played BI at the 3 all year so "Kuzma" is not the question, it's Hart because Luke refuses to acknowledge BI is a SF he's forcing to play the 2 which is where Hart should be.
A shame though to see people diminishing what Ingram can do, and again taking him for granted.
When the Lakers get rid of him and he's balling out on another team at the position he should have been playing this season and people wonder where it came from, they can look at Luke again and wonder
Luke Walton here, I promise to play BI at the 3 if he promises in return to play off the ball more, shoot more 3s, pound the ball less, shoot mid rangers if it pleases but shoot over 50% on his 2 pointers overall..deal?
Not throwing shade at BI but he's not going to change the way he plays because of some arbitrary number assigned to him.
BI's Response: So basically everything I did last year when Randle was the 4, I was developing my off-ball skills as a 3, and I wasn't forced to play the 2? Deal. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
So you can't really argue that if Lonzo/Hart/Kuzma/LeBron/McGee can work that Lonzo/Hart/Ingram/LeBron/McGee can't.
I like BI as much as the next guy, but advocating benching Kuzma in favor of Ingram is just insane IMHO. _________________ “God knew they couldn’t be on this Earth without each other. He had to bring them home to have them together.” – Vanessa Bryant
So you can't really argue that if Lonzo/Hart/Kuzma/LeBron/McGee can work that Lonzo/Hart/Ingram/LeBron/McGee can't.
I like BI as much as the next guy, but advocating benching Kuzma in favor of Ingram is just insane IMHO.
Kuzma should start, BI should also start. They play very well together.
Best 5 man lineups (per mins played):
T. Chandler, L. James, B. Ingram, K. Kuzma, J. Hart NetRtg……………...52.9
T. Chandler, L. James, L. Ball, K. Kuzma, J. Hart NetRtg…………………....32.5
J. McGee, K. Kuzma, L. James, B. Ingram, R. Rondo NetRtg……………...29.0
K. Kuzma, L. James, B. Ingram, J. Hart, L. Ball NetRtg…………………......16.1
T. Chandler, K. Kuzma, L. James, B. Ingram, R. Rondo NetRtg…………..10.3
Hon mention:
T. Chandler, K. Kuzma, L. James, B. Ingram, L. Ball, NetRtg……………....3.1
Also I don't mind Ingram playing the 2. It provides Ingram with a constant mismatch due to height. If his midrange shot consistently falls, he just rises up over his opponent constantly 1 on 1 enabling him to create his own shot consistently. His defense is Godly.
Also DeRozan was unguardable when Ingram was out of the game. Un-freaking guardable. I think if Ingram was there he would have had the best of that match up
I think Ingram's defense keeps him in the starting line up, TBH.
I don’t understand why it’s so difficult to understand Ingram’s offensive game is limited without the threat of being a shooter and lacks athleticism. People say he has playmaking skill but this team has a ton of those already: LeBron, Zo, Rondo and even Lance. You don’t use playmaking as your only calling card when you’re freaking 6”10 with long arms and 2nd overall pick in the draft, got to bring more to the table consistently.
Last edited by SGV-Laker fan on Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:20 am; edited 3 times in total
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be careful when you are in someone else's coal camp running your mouth 
