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Mike@LG
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 Posted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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This year's draft isn't as deep as last year.
Last year, for an "Average draft", there were 1st round type players that weren't even drafted. That's how deep it was.
This year, as far as I know, the elite players are there in the lottery, and there may be a handful of franchise players, but the good to great role players are almost all gone by the end of the 1st round. Top heavy.
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Money23
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 12:07 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | This year's draft isn't as deep as last year.
Last year, for an "Average draft", there were 1st round type players that weren't even drafted. That's how deep it was.
This year, as far as I know, the elite players are there in the lottery, and there may be a handful of franchise players, but the good to great role players are almost all gone by the end of the 1st round. Top heavy. |
what do u think of Embiid tonight? |
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Fan0Bynum17
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 12:33 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | This year's draft isn't as deep as last year.
Last year, for an "Average draft", there were 1st round type players that weren't even drafted. That's how deep it was.
This year, as far as I know, the elite players are there in the lottery, and there may be a handful of franchise players, but the good to great role players are almost all gone by the end of the 1st round. Top heavy. |
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that that's not that big of a deal, most teams don't bank of 2nd round picks becoming good to great role players anyway. They may hope for it, but they don't count on it. A draft lacking 2nd round depth (which I would think is virtually impossible to tell at this point) is not that big of a condemnation. |
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Mike@LG
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 5:49 am Post subject: |
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| Money23 wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | This year's draft isn't as deep as last year.
Last year, for an "Average draft", there were 1st round type players that weren't even drafted. That's how deep it was.
This year, as far as I know, the elite players are there in the lottery, and there may be a handful of franchise players, but the good to great role players are almost all gone by the end of the 1st round. Top heavy. |
what do u think of Embiid tonight? |
Instinctual. What is surprising is how poised and patient he is, and he has natural footwork which I doubt has been taught to him. Yet, he's able to apply spin moves and pivot work along with passing ability that D12 struggles with.
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laffeytaffey
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 12:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Keep an eye on Jordan Clarkson (Missouri). He's very impressive. Last night he put up 31 points, 5 assists, and 0 turnovers. 6'5 PG. Size. Athletic. High skill level. |
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Money23
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | Money23 wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | This year's draft isn't as deep as last year.
Last year, for an "Average draft", there were 1st round type players that weren't even drafted. That's how deep it was.
This year, as far as I know, the elite players are there in the lottery, and there may be a handful of franchise players, but the good to great role players are almost all gone by the end of the 1st round. Top heavy. |
what do u think of Embiid tonight? |
Instinctual. What is surprising is how poised and patient he is, and he has natural footwork which I doubt has been taught to him. Yet, he's able to apply spin moves and pivot work along with passing ability that D12 struggles with. |
Im glad I have comfirm ur thoughts with Embiid if he reaches his potential its almost at the level of Wiggins potential too he has the foundation of a young Hakeem Olajuwon |
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Corey78
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 3:03 pm Post subject: Re: Eyes on the Prospects |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | We know the names that are out there. I've been watching a few guys for at least two years. Quick summary.
Andrew Wiggins - Still the #1 prospect in the draft. Unless his player interviews tell otherwise, even guys who are not as driven, make franchise players. He's a cross between Vince Carter and McGrady. He is that explosive around the hoop, but definitely has better ball-handling in Iso situations, but not at a point guard/point forward level like McGrady did. All the physical tools. He may not have the strength/power of LeBron, but he's quicker to the air similar to Marion and a lesser extent, a younger Bryant.
Julius Randle - My clearcut #2. Doesn't have the obvious starpower athleticism that is otherworldly like Wiggins, or Shawn Kemp at PF, but an elite athlete with elite PF size. Mix Chris Webber and Zach Randolph together. He operates from the high post off the dribble, has a crossover, finishes with authority, and has the strength and motor to absolutely kill on the backboards like Zach Randolph. Developing 19' range. Left-handed, shifty.
Dante Exum - The closest to Penny Hardaway in a long time. Hardaway was a purer shooter, but Exum has slightly more refined PG skills by age. Good first step. 2nd and 3rd gear slowly acclerates. Top gear is FAST. Improving shooter who needs to work better off the dribble and in Iso situations. Unselfish playmaker. Forces TOs. Solid rebounder. Concerned about his light frame. More Penny Hardaway than Shaun Livingston in terms of PG skills. Interpret as you wish.
Jabari Parker - SF/PF type. All of the Carmelo Anthony iso skills but a winning attitude and demeanor. Good athlete. 6'7" w/o shoes, but 7' wingspan allows him to bulk up into a stretch 4 type. Considered a tweener, but in a good way. He has the guard skills between both forward spots, not center skills in a PF body (like Jordan Hill). Doesn't play out of the context of his game, but doesn't have the stride or ball-handling in the way that Kevin Durant has (nor the 7'5" wingspan). But still a killer scorer.
Aaron Gordon - PF - Late blooming power forward in the Blake Griffin mold. Not as refined from the perimeter like Randle, but his upside is high considering his explosiveness around the hoop, ability to run the floor, developing midrange game. Does not have advanced ball-handling, and could really utilize more of a back to the basket game instead of face up game (hence the Blake Griffin comparisons), but could just as easily be the top of the 2nd tier uprate draft prospects and franchise player.
Andrew Harrison - PG - Seen only in limited minutes at the previous Kentucky game. Could not control the game like Dennis Schroder at the Nike Summit. Strong, big PG, reliant on a strong first step and a strong upper body to get to the hoop. Not outright explosive and quick like Rose or Wall, but could be a bigger version of Andre Miller; shifty, able to get his shot at will, set up his teammates well, efficient. The last game, in the 2nd half, he didn't set up an offense, but rather, went Iso at will against his defender to keep drawing And 1s. But, there was Iso almost every possession; the game was such a blow out.
Marcus Smart - PG - The Captain (I call him) has the intangibles, speed, quickness, and intensity on both ends of the floor. He is a man child at the PG spot and even has a post game to compliment his strengths. Needs to improve his overall jumpshooting as a whole, but the he's the IQ version of what Marcus Banks was supposed to be, but could never figure out. An absolute thief. Draws contact in the paint. Fair finisher.
Isaac Austin - C - Anthony Davis light. Doesn't have as much strength, shorter wingspan by 2", but definitely has the ball-handling, refined perimeter touch to 20', and motor/quickness/explosiveness in a similar manner.
Semaj Christon - PG - My PG. A lesser John Wall. Strong shooter from 17' and in. Aggressive to the basket. Finishes through contact. Great PG size and length. Quick. Fast. A notch below elite. Wingspan. Lateral quickness. Intense defender when he wants to be. Good not elite playmaker. Unselfish. Really needs to develop his jumpshot to 20' first, then 3pt range 2nd. Right hand dominant. Has Van Exel like shot discipline. |
Agree with most of this.
Andrew is #1 in my book. Even while raw and skinny, he scored 22 and had 10 boards. Additionally, unlike Randle and Parker, he possesses great tools to be a defender. I think he has better lateral quickness than Vince and T-Mac. His ball handling will improve, and he will be much more lethal in the NBA with more spacing. Lebron couldn't shoot in highschool, D-wade and Jordan couldn't shoot in their first year of college. He has the most potential of all the prospects (save maybe embiid).
Julius Randle- this guy has a relentless motor and is just tenacious. I have a few quips with him. He's listed as 6'9...if he measures 6'8 barefoot or 6'7, then that may be a problem. Also, his wingspan at 6'11 is smaller than Blake Griffin's. He may bully at the college level now, but how will he be against taller defenders with significantly longer wingspans? Also, he had some turnover problems which may stem from him being kind of a 'black hole.' He's a monster....once he gets the ball, he wants to go to the basket. I'm not sure attacking triple teams will work at the next level. He likely will never be a great defender, but it did not look like he gave much effort on defense yesterday. I like him...He reminds me of z-bo as well except more athletic and with shorter arms. I fear his size and lack of wingspan may render him a tweener ala beasley. Still, he does not have the motor and motivation problems like Beasley. I will see how he measures out at the NBA combine.
Dante Exum- haven't followed him much at all. Doesn't seem to be an otherworldly athlete, but has great size. He's rated very high by most.
Aaron Gordon- Yup, Blake Griffin 2.0. With him, similar to Randle, I worry about height and length. I think he may be closer to 6'7. I'm not sure he's as quick as Blake yet, but Blake benefited alot from workouts between his freshman and sophomore year. No defined post game yet... He does not strike me as a great defensive player, but that may change as he gets older.
Andrew Harrison- Have not followed him much.
Marcus Smart- Have not followed him much
Isaac Austin (Isaiah Austin??)- If this refers to Isaiah Austin from Baylor, then I don't see the Anthony Davis comparison. He doesn't show Davis' defensive abilites....As a 7 foot freshman, he averaged 1.7 blocks, 8 rebounds, and .3 steals. Also, he is nowhere near the Athlete Davis is. Davis runs the floor like a gazelle...is a quick 2nd jumper....has fast hands....and is very very smooth.
- Isaiah Austin is slow footed, looks a bit awkard/ uncoordinated, and wouldn't beat many in a foot race. I think he is about two notches below Davis athletically.
Offensively, he has a good shot (probably better than Davis) and neither has that great a post game. What is curious in Austin's case, whereas we know about Davis' growth spurt, Austin has always been tall. I like him, but I'm not sure who he reminds me of.
Isaiah Austin to Davis is like Durant to Austin Daye (some similarities, but gripping differences).
Joel Embiid- I don't know about this kid. He has great height, length, and athleticism, and "instinctual" footwork (he played soccer and volleyball). But, he doesn't appear to have very good hands. The game is obviously to fast for him, but right now he reminds me of "putty." We expect that he will mold into something great based off his instincts and physical tools.
- Still, Hakeem Olajuwon? I never saw Olajuwon in his early stages, but was he this raw? With Hasheem Thabeet, Bismack Biyombo, and Desagana Diop, its a risk taking players based off pure potential. Bismack also has bad hands.
Still, I'm excited for this year and draft class.
Wiggins, Randle, and Parker all have the potential to change a franchise. And, there are many other great players. |
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Corey78
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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Also, for Jabari being Carmelo iso type but a winner....I dunno. I fear the Carmelo type of player is destined to be a loser in the NBA. Carmelo won on the high school level and he won an NCAA champion his freshman year. Carmelo was a winner UNTIL he got to the pros. Carmelo had great offense, worked well in iso, and was similar athletically to Jabari. Indeed, Wilbon and many scouts were saying to take Carmelo above Lebron.
The fact is that college ball doesn't mean all that much when projecting to the NBA as compared to physical tools and intangibles. For example, Jimmer Fredette and Durant scored great in college. However, Durant is 6'10 with a 7'5 wingspan. People get caught up in the actual games, and fail to project how the actual physical tools will manifest on the next level.
Lebron couldn't shoot out of high school, had suspect half court ability, and was "raw." He had great size, vision, and could contribute in many ways, but he was raw on offense (still is in some ways). Still, a gm would be crazy to take Melo over Bron.
Parker isn't going to be the transition player Wiggins is. He isn't going to be handling the ball like he does at Duke. He is only going to be an average or slightly above average athlete when he gets to the NBA whereas Wiggins will be one of the top 3 athletes the first day he sets his foot on the court.
What exactly is Parker's ceiling? He's Carmelo athletically and doesn't have particularly great court version imo. What will make Parker better than Carmelo? Paul Pierce? Parker is also has the body type that will gain weight easy...he has that melo body type.
Now, look at Jordan, D-wade, T-Mac. Neither of those guys could shoot in there first year. They were all transition players initially and could play well off the ball (a skill that translates beautifully in the NBA with all its spacing.) Honestly, Wiggins reminds me more of Jordan athletically than T-Mac or Vince. Vince was more explosive than Jordan, but lacked the speed and quickness. T-Mac was longer than Jordan, but lacked Jordan's quick first step (I think T-mac's quickness was a derivative of his length) and pure explosiveness. What is the ceiling of an 18 year old with Jordan athleticism who is a slasher and possesses tools to be an otherworldly defender? Even if he doesn't have Jordan's killer instinct, he will end up better than Carmelo Anthony or Paul Pierce...which is Parker's ceiling imo. (Caveat: How much muscle can Wiggins put on his frame? He's young, but he does not have very wide shoulders).
I really like Wiggins. I don't think it will be close between who is better between him and Parker at the NBA level. I think those who fawn for Parker are placing to much stock in what they're seeking in COLLEGE rather than the physical tools it takes one to be stars in the pros. Other than Wiggins, Randle is my darkhorse. He has outrageous quickness, speed, strength, and scoring instincts, but I'm not sure what to make of his physical tools. Also, he seems like a bit of a black-hole (he's young, so that can change.)
Last edited by Corey78 on Thu Nov 14, 2013 12:22 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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JoJo Dancer
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike what do you think of Chris Walker and Noah Vonleh? I love those 2 as prospects. |
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AIRZOOMKOBE2k5
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| Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Call me crazy but Dante Exum is like the PG version of Kobe by age. They both played internationally at a young age so fundamentals and footwork are more advanced compared to US Players. I'm no expert. Just my opinion. |
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JoJo Dancer
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| Posted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:04 am Post subject: |
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| I've always been an intrigued with Kuran Iverson since seeing him a few years ago. He could legitimately play all 5 positions if he put his mind to it. |
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KobeShaqalliance
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| Posted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:29 am Post subject: |
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Watched Aaron Gordon last night against my Aztecs. He put on a show. Hit two three pointers with good form. Might be slightly less athletic than Blake but much more skilled at shooting and passing. Still plenty athletic enough. Had the game sealing alley oop dunk.
Brandon Ashley the sophomore forward also looks like a great prospect. Needs to be more aggressive offensively, but with his size and skill he can really play. He made many impressive passes using his length. Mike what do you think of Ashley? |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 9:19 am Post subject: |
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Thanks, Mike.
Looking forward to your updates and continual scouting reports throughout the year. If the draft is top heavy, I'm really hoping the Lakers can slide into the top 10 or 8.
We can really land an outstanding talent with that sort of pick. Looking at Mike's list and some other sites - some really good talent even outside of the top 5 (projected, projections can change we all know that).
Not in the top 5 right now:
Marcus Smart. Big strong PG.
Aaron Gordon. Lesser Blake Griffen?
Glen Robinson 3. Wing talent, although the easiest position to fill in the NBA, has considerable upside.
There's going to be some guys who can become all-stars who won't be drafted top 5. There always are. And in this draft, with so much hype for the top guys, a few will slip.
It seems where you don't want to be drafting (unless you get lucky and someone drops big time) is outside of the top 8-10. |
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Money23
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| Posted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 9:30 am Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | Thanks, Mike.
Looking forward to your updates and continual scouting reports throughout the year. If the draft is top heavy, I'm really hoping the Lakers can slide into the top 10 or 8.
We can really land an outstanding talent with that sort of pick. Looking at Mike's list and some other sites - some really good talent even outside of the top 5 (projected, projections can change we all know that).
Not in the top 5 right now:
Marcus Smart. Big strong PG.
Aaron Gordon. Lesser Blake Griffen?
Glen Robinson 3. Wing talent, although the easiest position to fill in the NBA, has considerable upside.
There's going to be some guys who can become all-stars who won't be drafted top 5. There always are. And in this draft, with so much hype for the top guys, a few will slip.
It seems where you don't want to be drafting (unless you get lucky and someone drops big time) is outside of the top 8-10. |
IMO this guy will be in the top 5 maybe top 6 hes scary good |
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Corey78
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Posts: 1677
Location: Cerritos, California
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| Posted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 10:57 am Post subject: |
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| Money23 wrote: | | wolfpaclaker wrote: | Thanks, Mike.
Looking forward to your updates and continual scouting reports throughout the year. If the draft is top heavy, I'm really hoping the Lakers can slide into the top 10 or 8.
We can really land an outstanding talent with that sort of pick. Looking at Mike's list and some other sites - some really good talent even outside of the top 5 (projected, projections can change we all know that).
Not in the top 5 right now:
Marcus Smart. Big strong PG.
Aaron Gordon. Lesser Blake Griffen?
Glen Robinson 3. Wing talent, although the easiest position to fill in the NBA, has considerable upside.
There's going to be some guys who can become all-stars who won't be drafted top 5. There always are. And in this draft, with so much hype for the top guys, a few will slip.
It seems where you don't want to be drafting (unless you get lucky and someone drops big time) is outside of the top 8-10. |
IMO this guy will be in the top 5 maybe top 6 hes scary good |
I don't see it yet....
Doesn't have great point guard skills, and then doesn't have the freakish athleticism to overcome not having great point guard skills. |
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SmokeAndAshes
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| Posted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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| AIRZOOMKOBE2k5 wrote: | | Call me crazy but Dante Exum is like the PG version of Kobe by age. They both played internationally at a young age so fundamentals and footwork are more advanced compared to US Players. I'm no expert. Just my opinion. |
That was the 1st thing I thought of when I saw Exum play. There's something there that reminds me of young Kobe. |
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30
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| Posted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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| SmokeAndAshes wrote: | | AIRZOOMKOBE2k5 wrote: | | Call me crazy but Dante Exum is like the PG version of Kobe by age. They both played internationally at a young age so fundamentals and footwork are more advanced compared to US Players. I'm no expert. Just my opinion. |
That was the 1st thing I thought of when I saw Exum play. There's something there that reminds me of young Kobe. |
Hopefully he joins L.A. then. |
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The Lebrons
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| Posted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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Parker
Wiggins
Exum
I'd be pumped if we got one of them. |
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Money23
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| Posted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| The Lebrons wrote: | Parker
Wiggins
Exum
I'd be pumped if we got one of them. |
Add Embiid, have Kareem work on his game and this guy can be Hakeem Olajuwon |
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ch3cky0selff00
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| Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 10:56 am Post subject: |
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| I'm not positive a top pick is attainable. I mean, I'd love if it were.. but realistically speaking I wouldn't be disappointed if the Lakers ended up with someone like Semaj Christon. |
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30
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| Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Excluding the obvious, if the Lakers can get either James Young, Andrew Harrison or Aaron Gordon I would be extremely happy. Preferably the bolded one though... |
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Mike@LG
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| Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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James Young still has a lot to work on.
Harrison does too, in terms of halfcourt execution and implementing his scoring abilities within the offense.
Gordon, on the other hand, I think is a borderline franchise player.
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Fan0Bynum17
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| Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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| I haven't gotten a chance to watch Gordon yet, but his stats look pretty damn good so far. Ugh, I just know we're going to end up with a mediocre record this season. Lame, this draft looks so loaded. |
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AIRZOOMKOBE2k5
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| Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Fan0Bynum17 wrote: | | I haven't gotten a chance to watch Gordon yet, but his stats look pretty damn good so far. Ugh, I just know we're going to end up with a mediocre record this season. Lame, this draft looks so loaded. |
Seriously. But don't give in so soon. The target is 20 wins or fewer if we want a great draft pick. |
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30
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| Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | James Young still has a lot to work on.
Harrison does too, in terms of halfcourt execution and implementing his scoring abilities within the offense.
Gordon, on the other hand, I think is a borderline franchise player. |
What makes you say that? Also what does Young have to work on? If Gordon is the better player, I would obviously prefer the Lakers to take him. |
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