Lakers Salary Cap / CBA Q&A (please see pg 18 for NEW Updated 2024 Version)
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hydrohead
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2023 1:28 pm    Post subject:

Props Vash for nailing it.
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gng930
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2023 9:46 pm    Post subject:

vasashi17+ wrote:
Also note, that even before CP3’s guaranteed portions were amended to make the trade matching math work, dude had 15.8m guaranteed to him no matter what. And since that amount is greater than whatever the ntpMLE will come out to this year, he would be considered a buyout candidate that triggers the 1st Apron, even if signed on a lowly vet min deal during the season. Recall that teams above the 1st Apron cannot sign these certain “buyout candidates”, so if we do end up getting CP3 on a vet min deal after waivers that 172m in team salary becomes our hard cap! That being said, I'm not certain if the hard cap would be triggered if he is bought out during the offseason, but I'm sure we'll soon find out.


I doubt it....wouldn't that take the Clips out of the running?
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2023 9:32 am    Post subject:

Haha, thx @HH…but it was just an educated guess. There’s way too much money in the game to have not reached the max allowed, especially with cap smoothing / COVID correction looming in the backdrop.

@G: yeah I’m not sure the 1st Apron gets triggered in that scenario either. But it’s something to keep an eye out on.

Also it’s possible that is the reason the cLips are even entertaining a cp3 trade to begin with. They probably do t want to take any chances seeing how the definite the new CBA terms are still ambiguous to most.

Quote:
Jake Fischer @JakeLFischer
Another early hours of NBA Draft day note: Teams have still yet to receive the full Collective Bargaining Agreement set to take effect when the league calendar flips to 2023-24 next week. It’s coming, but cap strategists want to read this document sooner rather than later.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2023 12:18 am    Post subject:

With deadline day approaching on Beas & Mo and with the old 125%+100k trade rules expiring with the start of the FA moratorium, nows a good time as any to BUMP the “need to know” material for the offSZN! Made some slight revisions to it as well…

2023 OFFSZN PRIMER

Please present in this thread any questions, inquiries, corrections, requests (like examples to illustrate a point) that are not addressed below and either I or a fellow caphead will get to it. Thx!

So what are the numbers that we looking at for the 2023/24 season?

Note: we don’t know the official numbers yet, but the most current salary cap projections reflect an 8.4% increase from this season; it could go as high as 10% and imho is likely to; therefore that max 10% projection is displayed below & individual player amounts are also found further below within the sample cap sheets

Key resources
Cap: 136m
Tax: 165m
1st Apron: 172m
2nd Apron: 182.5m
tpMLE: 5m for up to 2yrs
-using it triggers 2nd Apron, which effectively hardcaps a team at 182.5m
ntpMLE: 12.4m for up to 4yrs
-using it triggers 1st Apron, which effectively hardcaps a team at 172m
BAE: 4.5m for up to 2yrs
-using it triggers 1st Apron & can’t be used in consecutive seasons
roomMLE: 7.7m for up to 3 years
2nd Round exception: 1.8m - 2m based respectively on either an up to 3 or 4 year deal with final year being team option
35% max (10+ seasoned player): 47.6m
30% max (7-9 seasoned player): 40.8m
25% max (0-6 seasoned player): 34m
Vet min: 2m (only 2 seasoned player cap hit applies w/ difference paid by the league)

What triggers the aprons?

1st Apron Triggers:
•Acquiring a S&t’d player
•Using ntpMLE
•Using BAE
•Aggregation of player(s) in trade using 125% multiplier
•Signing “buyout” player during the season that had a previous contract salary greater than the given ntpMLE value for that season
•Using TPE to trade for player in a non-simultaneous trade (does not apply till ‘24 offseason)

2nd Apron Triggers:
•Using tpMLE
•Aggregation of players in trade (using 110% multiplier towards the 2023/24 season only, otherwise nothing in excess of an 100% multiplier)
•Sending out a S&t’d player and/or trading for a player that was previously used as an outgoing S&t’d player (does not apply till ‘24 offseason)
•Use of cash in a trade (does not apply till ‘24 offseason)
•Use of a FRP 7 years out in a trade (does not apply till ‘24 offseason)

Would trading for Trae or any other max star player already on an established deal hardcap us at any of the aprons?

No; but it will cost ownership a pretty penny in taxes due to us potentially being a repeat tax offender due to having 3max players on our books

When do the new tax laws come into effect?

The new more punitive tax laws will begin to apply towards the 2025/26 season. This means teams will have 2 seasons (the 2023/24 & 2024/25 seasons) to get their cap affairs in order. New tax bands are displayed below and note that 10m above the tax line (ie the 3rd tax band) reflects far more punitive tax rates

Quote:
Non-repeater Tax / Repeater Tax rates are as follows (total tax amounts for each band are within parentheses) :

$0 - 4.99m ———> 1.00 (5m) / 3.00 (15m)
$5m - 9.99m ——> 1.25 (6.25m) / 3.25 (16.25m)
$10m - 14.99m —> 3.50 (17.5m) / 5.50 (27.5m)
$15m - 19.99m —> 4.75 (23.75m) / 6.75 (33.75m)
$20m - 24.99m —> 5.25 (26.25m) / 7.25 (36.25m)
$25m - 29.99m —> 5.75 (28.75m) / 7.75 (38.75m)
$30m - 34.99m —> 6.25 (31.25m) / 8.25 (41.25m)
$35m - 39.99m —> 6.75 (33.75m) / 8.75 (43.75m)
$40m - 44.99m —> 7.25 (36.25m) / 9.25 (46.25m)
$45m - 49.99m —> 7.75 (38.75m) / 9.75 (48.75m)


What are the details of our draft capital & what can we still trade?

Draft inventory
2023: #17 JHS & #40 MLewis
2024: our 1st round pick if NO defers to next year; cLip 2nd round pick
2025: our 1st round pick if NO keeps our pick last year; our 2nd round pick & clips 2nd round pick
2026: our 1st round pick
2027: our 1st round pick if it falls within top 4; our 2nd round pick if our 1st conveys to Utah by falling within #5-30
2028: our 1st round pick
2029: our 1st round pick
2030: our 1st round pick; our 2nd round pick

Tradeable draft capital
2023 player rights to #17 JHS & #40 MLewis (counts as $0 in trade aggregation, but JHS counts as 3.7m in aggregation 30 days after putting pen to paper on 1st round rookie deal; cannot aggregate MLewis in trade till Dec 15th)
2024 cLip 2nd rounder
2025 our & cLip 2nd rounders
2029 or 2030 1st rounder; but not both
1st round pick swaps on either 2024 or 2025 (depending on which pick conveys to NO), 2026, 2028 & either 2029, 2030 or both (depending on which 1st gets outright traded between the two)

Note: trading the #17 pick on draft night or shortly thereafter counts as $0 in trade aggregation; however it does count as 3.7m in trade aggregation if the draft pick is signed & traded after 1 month; however note that the new trade rules (ie 125% + 250k applicable up to the 1st Apron) will begin to apply after July 1st.

What dates do we have to pay attention to as we head past the NBA Finals?

Key Dates
June 22nd: NBA Draft; #17 can officially be traded on this day
June 29th: Beas team option deadline, Vando partial guarantee (4.4m) & Mo’s full guarantee (10.3m) trigger date
June 30th 3:00pm PT (aka official last day of the 2022/23 season): Qualifying offers (QO) must be offered by this time to make Reaves (2.3m) & Rui (8.5m) restricted free agents (RFA); deadline to offer extensions to DLo (for an additional 2yrs/67.6m via an extend-&-trade rules) & Beas (for an additional 2yrs/33.8m via team option exercised and an extend-&-trade rules); last day to trade roughly 100k in cash that remains in our trade purse for the 2022/23 season (ie recall we included 2m in the trade with PatBev that sent him to Orlando for Mo & 4.3m in the trade with #47 that was sent to Indy for #40 in the 2023 draft)
June 30th 3:01pm PT: first day of new season (2023/24) officially begins with FA moratorium
-new trade rules go into effect (125% trade multiplier goes down to 110% for 1st apron breachers)
-our 2030 FRP/SRP gets unlocked for trades
-cash trade purse gets renewed to 7m
July 6th 9:00am PT: Free agency (FA) moratorium ends and FA contracts officially hit teams’ cap sheets; signed offersheets for RFAs go live and home team has 24hrs to match; AD is now extension eligible and can add 3 additional years taking him thru the 2027/28 season at the max (potentially up to 187m total) to his remaining 2yr deal, which includes a player option for the 2024/25 season; Vando is also now extension eligible for up to 4yrs/55m
July 13th: last day for teams with outstanding QOs towards their RFAs to withdraw this contract making the RFAs unrestricted free agents (UFA), free to sign with any team with available cap space and/or exceptions
Dec 15th: FAs signed during the 2023 offseason free agency period are now eligible to be traded and aggregated with other salaried players
Jan 10th 2024 (league cutdown date): ShaqH’s full guarantee trigger date
Jan 15th 2024: all bird right FA players that were signed using the bird exception during the 2023 offseason free agency period is now eligible to be traded (ie BYC players)
Feb 8th 2024 12pm PT: 2023/24 season trade deadline

What are the differences between the current & new trade rules & when does it come into effect?

Any team eliminated from the playoffs from now to June 30th, can make a trade with contracts that still have guaranteed money remaining for the 2023/24 season (ie non expiring contracts) & can use a 125% multiplier towards outgoing salary + 100k for salary matching

After June 30th, trades for teams below 1st Apron can be made using:
•200% multiplier towards outgoing salary up to 7.5m + 250k for salary matching
•outgoing salary between 7.5m and 29m + 7.5m for salary matching
•125% multiplier towards outgoing salary greater than 29m + 250k for salary matching

For teams above 1st Apron, an 110% multiplier is used towards all outgoing salary

Which exceptions (MLE, BAE, etc) can we use?

If you use the ntpMLE, you cannot use the tpMLE or the roomMLE. If you use the BAE, you cannot use it again the following season, since as the name suggests, the availability of this particular exception is Bi-Annually.

If you use cap space, you can use the roomMLE only.

If you are a non tax-payer or only breached the tax line by up to 7m (ie before hitting the 1st Apron), then you can use the ntpMLE & BAE as long as the use of them does not directly lead to breaching the 1st Apron immediately afterwards.

If team salary is already above the 1st Apron & within the 10.5m threshold of the 2nd Apron, then a team can use the tpMLE, as long as after using it, a team is not in breach of the 2nd Apron.

If team salary is already higher than the 2nd Apron, no exceptions can be used by that team. As of now, only the cLips, Dubs & Suns are without the use of any exceptions since they all project team salaries higher than the 2nd Apron.

How do the Lakers choose which exceptions & trade rules they can use? Do they even have a choice in how they can operate this offseason?

Teams can choose to go two routes:
As a team with cap space by renouncing all or most of their FA bird rights & having their associated larger capholds not apply towards their books, or…

As a team cap strapped (& without cap space) by retaining their FA bird rights/capholds and using the bird exception to resign them to or execute a S&t with (Please see page 1 for details on how S&ts work)

Cap strapped route:
-ntpMLE = 12.4m; BAE = 4.5m; both trigger 1st apron @ 172m
-tpMLE = 5m; triggers 2nd apron @ 182.5m
-2nd Round exception = 1.8m - 2m
-vet mins (w/ cap hit of 2yr seasoned vet) = 2m
-S&t contract has to be at least 3yrs in length with only year 1 of the deal having to be fully guaranteed; S&t’d players CAN be aggregated with other salaried players; please refer to page 1 as to how much a S&t’d player can aggregate to as a BYC player; note 3yr+ deals can also be extension eligible as soon as the 2nd anniversary after the signing
-FA Capholds (ie the amount that is temporarily held on our books till new contract is signed and amount of 1st year of new contract replaces the temporary caphold; vet min FA capholds represent the max they coujd get on a new deal)
•DLo = 40.8m full bird max
•Rui = 18.8m
•Reaves = 12.4m early bird max (not really a caphold, but will be the amount of cap put on hold since he’s maxed out at that amount via Arenas provision; this will be the amount he can max out with us on in yr1 of his contract, if we go the cap strapped route)
•SkyWalker = 7.8m nonbird max
•#17 pick = 3.7m rookie 120% max scale
•#47 pick = 1.8m - 2m
•Schro = 3.2m nonbird max
•TT = 3.2m nonbird max
•TBJr = 2.3m nonbird max
•Gabriel = 1.9m early bird caphold (could make as much as Austin in yr1 of early bird max deal)

Cap space route:
-roomMLE = 7.7m; used once cap space has been exhausted
-Capholds for our RFAs (ignoring UFA DLo cause his full bird caphold alone would cap us out)
•Reaves caphold = 2.3m
•Rui caphold = 18.8m
•incomplete roster (IR) charge / rookie vet min = 1.12m
•JHS #17 pick = 3.7m
•MLewis #40 pick = 1.12m, before that caphold amount is replaced with the starting salary of 1st-2nd yr player (based on length of contract) with the use of the new 2nd round exception
•300k remaining in dead cap if we waive & renounce all our partial/nonguaranteed contracts (ie Vando, Mo & ShaqH)

Where do our books stand as of now (6/28/23)?

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. Rui QO caphold 18.8m
4. Reaves QO caphold 2.2m
5. Vando 4.7m
6. MaxC 1.7m
7. JHS #17 pick caphold 3.7m
5 IR charges (ie 1.12m per) 5.6m
= 11m in cap space + 7.7m roomMLE

I highly doubt we operate with cap space, but if we can immediately get Rui’s deal done closer to 10m than the 20mish his caphold currently stands at, then we can double up our cap potential and offer about 20m in cap space to potential FAs.

How would each route (cap strapped & cap spaced) look with Ky or any other max type FA?

Keep Rui option & have roomMLE amount, without really creating cap space:

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. Ky 35m (via 1st apron hardcap triggering S&t)
4. Rui 13m (via full bird for up to a 5yr deal)
5. Reaves 12.4m (via early bird max for up to a 4yr deal)
6. ntpMLE player 7.7m (via partial ntpMLE for essentially the roomMLE amount on up to a 4yr deal)
7. MaxC 1.7m
8. 2023 47th overall pick 2m (via new 2nd round rookie exception)
9. Vet min 2m
10. Vet min 2m
11. Vet min 2m
12. Vet min 2m
13. Vet min 2m
14. Vet min 2m (or ShaqH on a nonguaranteed 2.4m)
= 172m team salary; right at 1st apron

Essentially you can not use the 4.5m BAE and we could use the full 12.4m ntpMLE, but divvy it up where one player gets 7.7m (which is the roomMLE amount), while we hang onto the 4.7m remainder of it to sign prorated RoS deals to buyout candidate(s) after the trade deadline or to convert our two-way guys for further development. FYI: teams now have 3 two-way slots & that should help a hardcapped team field enough depth while not rostering a full 15 for the season; also you have to assume some combo of DLo, Beas, Mo, Vando, #17 pick, our 2029 or 2030 1st, future pick swaps and our 4-5 SRPs are in play to carry out this Ky S&t; btw you need 27.8m in outgoing salary to match due Ky at that 35m starting number & Beas/Mo aggregated is 26.8m

Something to also note: a S&t contract has to be a minimum of 3yrs in length, with only yr1 of the deal having to be fully guaranteed. And you can only have a max of 5% annual raises from each yr in that contract Ky in effect could play yr1 out on that S&t contract before getting “waived”, then becoming a nonbird FA for the 2024 season where he can get a 20% raise on his 35m deal this year (= a new starting salary of 42m on a 1+1 player option contract w/5% raise on 2nd yr). He then opts out of yr 2 of that deal and now has early bird rights in the summer of ‘25 to get him on at least a 2yr deal with 8% annual raises and a starting salary reflective of a 75% raise on his previous annual of 42m (= a new starting salary of his true 35% max for that season). In taking this route, he and the team trading for him need to be in good standing with each other, but he would give up a max bag for these next couple seasons to then hit his true max in 2025 at age 33. And what would this type if haircut cost him over these 2 years? About 20.5m, since as a 35% max player this summer could lead to a 2yr deal of 97.6m, but in our scenario he essentially got a 2yr/77m deal instead.

Renouncing Rui and opening up cap space route:

Bron 47.6m
AD 40.6m
Reaves QO caphold 2.2m
MaxC 1.7m
JHS #17 pick caphold 3.7m
Vando 4.7m
MLewis #40 pick caphold 1.12m
5 IR charges (ie 1.12m per) 5.6m
= 28.8m in cap space; if you want to keep Vando on the books, cap space then becomes 28.7m; if we move off the #17 pick for a future pick instead, cap space then becomes 34.6m; in this scenario you can outright sign Ky without the S&t restrictions of making it a 3yr deal and operating under the hard cap at the 1st apron + have access to the use of the actual roomMLE

How much cap space can we get at the very most with just Bron/AD on our books?

Bron 47.6m
AD 40.6m
Dead cap 300k
10 IR charges 11.2m
= 36.3m in max potential cap space

How would running it back look where we could still use the MLEs and BAE to add an outside FA to our squad?

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. DLo 23m (via full bird for up to a 5yr deal)
4. Rui 13m (via full bird for up to a 5yr deal)
5. Reaves 12.4m (via early bird max for up to a 4yr deal)
6. ??? 12.4m (via full ntpMLE on up to a 4yr deal)
7. Vando 4.7m
8. MaxC 1.7m
9. 2023 17th overall pick 3.7m
10. 2023 47th overall pick 2.1m (via new 2nd round rookie exception)
11. BAE (Schro? for up to a 2yr deal) 4.5m
12. Vet min (Gabriel?) 2m
13. Vet min (Mo?) 2m
14. Vet min 2m (or ShaqH on a nonguaranteed 2.4m)
= 171.7m team salary; just about right at the 1st apron hard cap of 172m…meaning we can’t even add a prorated 15th later in the year unless DLo/Rui/Reaves give back a couple million collectively on those projections above or we sign that 15th rostered player close to the final days of the regular season. Remember tho, we can rely on 3 two-way contracts now to help with the regular season load.

Or….

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. DLo 25m (via full bird for up to a 5yr deal)
4. Rui 15m (via full bird for up to a 5yr deal)
5. Reaves 12.4m (via early bird max for up to a 4yr deal)
6. Beas 16.5m (ie trade fodder)
7. Schro? 5m (via full tpMLE on up to a 2yr deal)
8. Vando 4.7m
9. MaxC 1.7m
10. 2023 17th overall pick 3.7m
11. 2023 47th overall pick 2.1m (via new 2nd round rookie exception)
12. Vet min (Gabriel?) 2m
13. Vet min (Mo?) 2m
14. Vet min 2m (or ShaqH on a nonguaranteed 2.4m)
= 180.3m team salary; just about right at the 2nd apron hard cap of 182.5m…and we can add a prorated 15th later in the year even with ShaqH replacing one of those vet min spots… also Beas’s 16.5m is there as trade fodder which could bring back as much as 18.25m in inbound salary using the new 110% trade multiplier….and as you can see with that additional inbound salary difference of 1.75m, we’d be pretty much at the doorstep of the 2nd Apron.

How much at the max can we offer Austin vs what other teams can offer at the max?

Max we can outright offer without dude looking elsewhere for an offer sheet is:

Yr1: 11.4m
Yr2: 12.4m
Yr3: 13.3m
Yr4: 14.4m
=51.5m (w/annual raises of 8% via early bird rights)

Max another team can offer via offersheet that he has to agree on and we have 24hrs to match past the end of FA moratorium of 9am PT on July 6th:

Yr1: 11.4m
Yr2: 12m (5% raise)
Yr3: 37.5m (max poison pill (PP))
Yr4: 39.2m (4.5% raise)
=100m (w/team that offers that 25% max PP needing at least 25.5m in cap space to offer it)

Note: once matched, that PP backloaded contract structure not only hits our books, but also any other team looking to trade for him afterwards; however if we do not match, the team that gave Austin that offer sheet will see a more traditional (ie non PP) contract structure reflective of the 25m AAV w/5% annual raises; please also see page 1 for details about RFAs, such as the timing in matching & how the Arenas provision works.
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vasashi17+
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2023 12:33 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
Adrian Wojnarowski @wojespn

The new Collective Bargaining Agreement has been signed and shared with the 30 NBA teams, sources tell ESPN. The 676-page agreement goes into effect on July 1 and runs through the 2029-2030 season.

In letter to players, NBPA says new CBA will "provide a projected $250M collective increase in salaries and benefits next season," and with new TV deal looming in 2025 and other revenue streams, "a very real hope that we might earn $50B in salaries and benefits over 7-year term."


Better get a copy of the abridged version, unless someone wants to break down all 676 pages of it in the next couple days before the moratorium starts up!

https://nbpa.com/cba
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2023 3:55 pm    Post subject:

Abridged version with key summary points found here:

https://ak-static.cms.nba.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/2023/06/2023-CBA-Summary.pdf
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 9:07 pm    Post subject:

With news leaks that the Lakers prioritize Reeves and Huchimura, and want to pursue Brook Lopze or Bruce Brown, I guess their plan assumes 1. no tax, i.e. 165m threshold ; 2. no DLo; 3. Huchimura will not get outrageous offers.

In this case, Vanderbilt will be the only one left for the 2027 pick. Is he worth it? No. But in the full context, the team made a playoffs run because of this trade and it might have helped to keep LBJ. I can't imagine how James would have reacted if the Lakers had missed the playoffs for the third time in his five years here. Vanderbilt and LBJ are definitely worth a FRP.

The reports are about Bamba and Beasley, and about possible full MLE offers to Bruce Brown or Brook Lopez, but it's really about DLo whose name is not mentioned at all. Either the team does not want him back, or it's negotiation tactics.

For me, the most important thing to know is the payroll threshold the FO works under. Maybe Jeanie Buss wants to get out repeater tax more than trophy #18.
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vasashi17+
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 9:55 pm    Post subject:

^I don’t think it was worth a FRP at all…whether that’s retaining DLo or not. The only way salvage that trade imho is if they turn DLo into a mainstay building block next to AD in the post-Bron era. You don’t only need a guy that is offensively capable, but you need a legit defender that can play off of AD. Vando brings the D, but no O. And OLo brings the opposite, so combined I guess you can see them as a 2-way player, but worth a FRP?…nah, I still hope they looking to retain & flip dudes for a legit perimeter 2-way presence and/or a 2-way center that can move AD to note com4ting confines!

As for not bringing back Mo, Beas & ShaqH (and more importantly their salary potential), we looking to hardcap ourselves with the full ntpMLE and possibly the BAE. Here is how our books would look and how much we could potentially offer DLo & Rui, since we know Reaves is capped at his early bird max of 11.4m, while Schro can only make as much as 12.4m with the MLE.

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. DLo ???
4. Rui ???
5. ntpMLE 12.4m
6. Reaves 11.4m (early bird max)
7. Vando 4.7m
8. BAE 4.5m
9. MaxC 1.7m
10. JHS 3.7m
11. MLewis 1.8m - 2m (depend’n on contract length via 2nd round exception)
12. Vet min 2m
13. Vet min 2m
14. Vet min 2m
Two-way: Swider, Castleton, Hodge $0
= up to 134.6m in team salary not counting DLo/Rui deals, meaning we will have roughly 37.4m to split between the two of them before hitting the 172m 1st Apron hardcap that gets triggered with even a partial use of the ntpMLE. We could also elect not to use the BAE and get those two up to a combined 42m instead.

Personally if we were to get hardcapped, I’d rather use Beas/Mo’s 26.8m aggregated to go get a 33.6m type player via S&t or otherwise instead. But in projecting to be hardcapped, we still can use the 125% + 250k trade rules instead of the new 110% trade multiplier seeing how teams can use the more lax trade rules as long as the remain below the 1st Apron after the trade. So a S&t’d DLo and/or Rui ain’t out of the realm of possibility still.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2023 4:02 am    Post subject:

vasashi17+ wrote:
^I don’t think it was worth a FRP at all…whether that’s retaining DLo or not. The only way salvage that trade imho is if they turn DLo into a mainstay building block next to AD in the post-Bron era. You don’t only need a guy that is offensively capable, but you need a legit defender that can play off of AD. Vando brings the D, but no O. And OLo brings the opposite, so combined I guess you can see them as a 2-way player, but worth a FRP?…nah, I still hope they looking to retain & flip dudes for a legit perimeter 2-way presence and/or a 2-way center that can move AD to note com4ting confines!

As for not bringing back Mo, Beas & ShaqH (and more importantly their salary potential), we looking to hardcap ourselves with the full ntpMLE and possibly the BAE. Here is how our books would look and how much we could potentially offer DLo & Rui, since we know Reaves is capped at his early bird max of 11.4m, while Schro can only make as much as 12.4m with the MLE.

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. DLo ???
4. Rui ???
5. ntpMLE 12.4m
6. Reaves 11.4m (early bird max)
7. Vando 4.7m
8. BAE 4.5m
9. MaxC 1.7m
10. JHS 3.7m
11. MLewis 1.8m - 2m (depend’n on contract length via 2nd round exception)
12. Vet min 2m
13. Vet min 2m
14. Vet min 2m
Two-way: Swider, Castleton, Hodge $0
= up to 134.6m in team salary not counting DLo/Rui deals, meaning we will have roughly 37.4m to split between the two of them before hitting the 172m 1st Apron hardcap that gets triggered with even a partial use of the ntpMLE. We could also elect not to use the BAE and get those two up to a combined 42m instead.

Personally if we were to get hardcapped, I’d rather use Beas/Mo’s 26.8m aggregated to go get a 33.6m type player via S&t or otherwise instead. But in projecting to be hardcapped, we still can use the 125% + 250k trade rules instead of the new 110% trade multiplier seeing how teams can use the more lax trade rules as long as the remain below the 1st Apron after the trade. So a S&t’d DLo and/or Rui ain’t out of the realm of possibility still.


If they are going to use ntpmle, it means they are not tax payer, right? 165M at most.

Without bae, there would be around 35M left for Russell and Hachimura. If they could squeeze those two into that amount, I am all for it.

165M will not b enough to contend, but at least some assets are kept and we could dream of a future trade.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2023 10:49 am    Post subject:

^LT: I agree that if we retain most of these players on budget contracts it is a win in terms of asset management and potential flipping them for better fitting parts later down the line. The ntpMLE is such a misnomer since teams can still pay a tax and utilize it due to the 7m in wiggle room from the 165m tax line to the 172m hardcap 1st apron. You can use the ntpMLE and still pay up to 18m in taxes (as a repeat tax offender for up to 7m above the tax line) as long as you do not breach the 1st apron after using it. Also as a repeat tax offender this year, that 18m amount is half of what we ended up paying taxes this past year as a non repeat offender. If we do duck the tax this year by fielding a team with salary less than 165m, then it wound be a soft reboot to our repeat offender clock. We would completely reset the repeat offender clock if we also ducked the tax bill for the 2024/25 season as well.

Btw, if we do not use the BAE this year, we will have it for next season and can open up to 42m in combined salary for DLo & Rui as long as Reaves gets his max amount. That Reaves early bird max annual figure is from this btw: 105% of average NBA salary for the 2022/23 season = 10.8m

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q31
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 12:14 am    Post subject:

Unofficial cap sheet after today’s (June 30th 2023) FA signings:

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. Rui 15.7m (via bird rights)
4. Gabe 10.5m (via partial ntpMLE; ~2m remaining)
5. Vando 4.8m
6. Prince 4.5m (via entire BAE)
7. MaxC 1.7m
8. JHS 3.7m
9. MLewis 1.8m - 2m (depend’n on contract length via 2nd round exception)
10. Cam (via vet min) 2.2m
Two-way: Swider, Castleton, Hodge $0
= 133.3m (just about capped out); about 39m away from 1st apron hardcap that was triggered with Gabe ntpMLE and Prince BAE contracts.

About 23m away, which is assumed to be the most we can offer to DLo, when accounting Reaves’ 11.4m early bird max + 2 vet min deals leading to a total roster of 14 necessary to roster during the season.

Note: Cam counts as 2.2m instead of just 2m due to having a guarantee 2yr vet min deal (via player option on 2nd year); Vando counts as 4.8m since he has 145k in unlikely bonuses that must be incorporated when calculating hardcap math; the remaining ntpMLE amount of 1.9m can be used toward offering up to a 4yr/8.2m deal.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 4:36 am    Post subject:

Thanks V you are the man. That is exactly my question. By using the MLE we hardcapped oursleves as a non tax payer. So the Lakers need to now wait on Reaves and add 2-3 vet mins, and then what's left is the most they can offer DLO.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 7:50 am    Post subject:

^Thx W…

The thing is till DLo is signed, there is the possibility that all this is happening with cap space, since most of these deals have been on the lower end and Rui was retained at a lower cap hit than his caphold (ie 15.7m vs 18.8m).

Which brings us to….

Were these moves made as a capped out or spaced out team?

There’s a joke in there somewhere with all the moves we have made, but I’ll leave that alone for now…

Whether we operated with space or not, all comes down to if DLo remains or not. If he moves on, his max caphold gets removed and that allows a lot of moves to occur with space.

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. Rui 15.7m
4. Vando 4.7m
5. JHS 3.7m
6. Reaves QO caphold 2.2m
7. MaxC 1.7m
8. IR charge (Lewis) 1.12m
9. IR charge (Cam) 1.12m
10. IR charge (Hayes) 1.12m
11. IR charge (Gabe) 1.12m
12. IR charge (Prince) 1.12m
= 14.2m in cap space & if you substitute in Gabe (10.5m) & Prince’s (4.5m) 15m aggregated with 2 of those IR charges (2.24m), then you can see we’re pretty much capped out where the vet min exceptions & 2nd round exception take care of Cam, Hayes & Lewis.

If we see a surprise signing with our next move that’s other than DLo & this surprise signing has a starting annual of 7.7m and is making up to 24.3m over 3yrs, then that folks is us operating as team with cap room that just used the roomMLE to get our DLo replacement. And unlike with the DLo route, this cap space pathway most likely does not lead to us paying any taxes and getting hardcapped.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 7:08 pm    Post subject:

Capped out team it is…

As of July 1st 2023, roster stands as:

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. DLo 17.8m (via bird rights; 1+1 deal w/player option, so NTC is included)
4. Rui 15.7m (via bird rights; 3yr deal makes him extension eligible)
5. Reaves 12.4m (via early bird max; 4yr deal makes him extension eligible)
6. Gabe 10.5m (via partial ntpMLE; 3yr deal makes him extension eligible)
7. Vando 4.7m (150k unlikely incentives; will be extension eligible)
8. Prince 4.5m (via entire BAE; 1yr deal no NTC included as nonbird)
9. JHS 3.7m (via 1st round 120% rookie scaled contract)
10. Cam 2.2m (via vet min; 1+1 deal with no NTC due to nonbird)
11. Hayes 2.2m (via vet min; 1+1 deal with no NTC due to nonbird)
12. MLewis 1.8m - 2m (depend’n on contract length via 2nd round exception)
13. MaxC 1.7m (not extension eligible)
•Two-way: Swider, Castleton, Hodge $0
•Partial MLE remaining: 1.9m (potential 4yr 8.2m deal)
•4 minimum TPEs remaining varying from 1.8m - 2.7m expiring on 2/9/24
= 165.4m in team salary; ~400k into tax territory yielding about 1m in taxes; that figure reflects a 3yr deal applied on Lewis instead of a 4yr deal and that figure only gets higher with a 14th player rostered and Vando hitting his unlikely incentives (based on meeting a dreb%); also due to using the ntpMLE (Gabe) & BAE (Prince), we will be hardcapped at the 172m 1st apron…as a result, even as a repeat tax offender, we can only pay at most 18m in taxes (ie being 7m above the 165m tax line)
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 11:04 pm    Post subject:

They're close enough to the tax line where I wouldn't be surprised if they dump Vando or Prince at the deadline; there's a bit of redundancy and potential for a minutes crunch with all the other combo forwards we have.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 02, 2023 7:34 am    Post subject:

I think that lakers are terribly resistance to buy 2.50 on the dollar for any further contract and would be quite happy to end the season below the lux tax that I just see another signing imminent. Bet they would live to have Castleton take the role as a two way that they convert eventually.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 02, 2023 6:46 pm    Post subject:

vasashi17+ wrote:
Capped out team it is…

As of July 1st 2023, roster stands as:

1. Bron 47.6m
2. AD 40.6m
3. DLo 17.8m (via bird rights; 1+1 deal w/player option, so NTC is included)
4. Rui 15.7m (via bird rights; 3yr deal makes him extension eligible)
5. Reaves 12.4m (via early bird max; 4yr deal makes him extension eligible)
6. Gabe 10.5m (via partial ntpMLE; 3yr deal makes him extension eligible)
7. Vando 4.7m (150k unlikely incentives; will be extension eligible)
8. Prince 4.5m (via entire BAE; 1yr deal no NTC included as nonbird)
9. JHS 3.7m (via 1st round 120% rookie scaled contract)
10. Cam 2.2m (via vet min; 1+1 deal with no NTC due to nonbird)
11. Hayes 2.2m (via vet min; 1+1 deal with no NTC due to nonbird)
12. MLewis 1.8m - 2m (depend’n on contract length via 2nd round exception)
13. MaxC 1.7m (not extension eligible)
•Two-way: Swider, Castleton, Hodge $0
•Partial MLE remaining: 1.9m (potential 4yr 8.2m deal)
•4 minimum TPEs remaining varying from 1.8m - 2.7m expiring on 2/9/24
= 165.4m in team salary; ~400k into tax territory yielding about 1m in taxes; that figure reflects a 3yr deal applied on Lewis instead of a 4yr deal and that figure only gets higher with a 14th player rostered and Vando hitting his unlikely incentives (based on meeting a dreb%); also due to using the ntpMLE (Gabe) & BAE (Prince), we will be hardcapped at the 172m 1st apron…as a result, even as a repeat tax offender, we can only pay at most 18m in taxes (ie being 7m above the 165m tax line)


In this case, they will do anything possible to stay under the tax. It's quite admirable to be able to resign all three of Rui, DLo, AR, and use the mle and bae, and avoid tax.

Playoffs are about match ups. The Lakers could have been the 8th seed and faced the Nuggets... first round sweep. Would fans and the front office still share the optimism? Probably not. It was the same crew and yet a very different evaluation in a different context.

Back to the question. Is the team better? It's probably not worse but does not improve against the Nuggets' length. The Lakers had two centers,Jones and Bryant, last season and both were gone before the trade deadline. Bamba never made the rotation. AD was, and is, the center backed up by Vanderbilt and Hachimura. It was not enough and will not.

Pelinka mentioned the concept of pre free agency in February. I think it worked. The Lakers, in total, used one FRP and two SRP to unload Westbrook and add, among others, Hachimura, Vanderbilt and Russell. These three passed the "audition" and were also kept. Vincent and Prince fill needs. Last but not least, the team has a good chance of avoiding repeater tax. It's a win.

Whether they will win the real trophy is another matter.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 4:09 am    Post subject:

Does getting under the tax this season reset the repeater tax timer?
How far are we from getting under tax?
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 9:07 am    Post subject:

You need two seasons under the tax to reset.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 6:13 pm    Post subject:

@Gov: to add a bit more info to VLF’s answer… it’s a soft reboot, since being classified as a repeater means a team would have to have paid taxes in 3 of any given 4yr window. We’ve already paid a tax on the last 3 seasons from 2020/21 to this past 2022/23 season. We still would be classified as repeat offenders if we still have to pay a tax for the 2024/25 season, even though we might have ducked it for the 2023/24 season. However if we duck the tax for that 2024/25 season as well, then we’d have a hard reset towards our tax offenses.

2019/20: non-taxpayer
2020/21: taxpayer
2021/22: taxpayer
2022/23: taxpayer
2023/24: repeat offender rate applies for the first time this season
2024/25: repeat offender rate applies still if tax ducked last season
2025/26: if a taxpayer, then repeat offender rate no longer applies since previous two seasons had us ducking tax

Hope that answers it for you when it comes to the repeat tax offense and fully resetting the clock on it.

As for this 2023/24 season, we appear to be about 400k into the tax (ie team salary of 165.7m in breach of a 165.3m tax line; leading to a 1m tax bill) for a roster still needing at least one more roster add to get to a league mandated 14 to start the season.

At the very most, we can only add about 7m more in salary past the 165m tax line, since we are hardcapped at the 172m 1st Apron (via use of ntpMLE/BAE on GabeVince/Prince). Even as a repeat tax offender, that would lead to at most an 18m tax bill. As a reminder, we paid 36m on a non-repeat offender rate this past season.

The Lakers potentially can get off enough salary and therefore duck the tax completely with a Vando salary swap for a true vet min contract (ie possibly 4.8m for 2m).

Something to note is that Vando has a performance based unlikely incentive that could add 150k to his 4.7m deal. Also it depends on how many years we get MLexis on using our 2nd round exception cause that would make his yr1 deal either 1.8m or 2m.

Quote:
Bobby Marks: Below is the structure for the new 2nd round exception:

3 year contract
Y1- $1.8M
Y2- $1.9M
Y3- $2.2M (Team)

4 year contract
Y1- $2M
Y2- $2.1M
Y3- $2.2M
Y4- $2.4M (Team)

The exception does not come out of the $7.7M room, $12.4M non-tax or $5M tax midlevel.


^ That’s just for 2nd rounders, like MaxL, tho. If we want to lock up an undrafted guy, like Castleton, then we still got about 1.9m remaining from our MLE & with it, we can offer up a deal up to 4yrs/8.2m.

Btw all these numbers are all rounded up (or down) to the nearest decimal.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2023 8:04 am    Post subject:

According to Spotrac, I'm noticing that Austin's number is coming lower than we had assumed, barely above 12M. Not sure why his contract was initially reported as 4/56...Spotrac is reporting it closer to 4/54 which lines up with Herb Jones' initial contract reports.

I have them being able to duck the tax altogether (without any follow-up deals) if they sign Max and Colin, for instance, for less than 2.7M combined. I wonder if they try to stiff JHS a bit too and ask that he take less than the usual 120%.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2023 12:49 pm    Post subject:

^Yeah bro, I was expecting the initial yr1 12.6m projection on Reaves early bird max to be a bit inflated. It’s true that this year is the first time the ntpMLE (12.4m) was projected to be greater than the 2 seasoned RFA early bird (~11.5m). I feel they wanted to correct that a bit by getting it close to, if not matching the MLE amount…but in calculating that number it should be closer to 11.5m than 12.5m…and now Spotrac has corrected the projection to be a yr1 12m cap hit, which lines up with that calculation.

Spotrac currently has us at a team salary of 159.5m for 11 players. That would be about 5.8m away from the 165.3m tax line. JHS & MaxL just signed bringing our roster to 13 in total (not counting two-ways). We know JHS is projected to make at the most the 120% 1st round rookie scale deal at a yr1 3.7m. We could negotiate that amount to as low as 80% of the rookie scale, which would make his yr1 salary 2.6m instead. That is rare however and normally 1st rounders get that 120% scale.

If JHS is set at 3.7m, we’d be about 2.1m away from the tax line. Depending on what type of deal MaxL gets (ie 3 or 4yr via 2nd round exception OR 2yr via rookie vet min contract exception OR up to 4yrs via the remainder of the ntpMLE on a rookie vet min scale), his cap hit can be anywhere from 1.1m to 2m.

So depending on how our rookie deals are structured, we’d be pretty much 2.1m away from the tax line or right up against it with still 1 more roster add necessary to meet the 14 necessary to start the season. That 14th roster spot whether it’s via vet min exception or the remainder of our 1.9m ntpMLE will lead to a 2m cap hit (prorated if nonguaranteed) no matter what, in calculating for taxes. So even if JHS is on a 80% scaled deal and MaxL is on a rookie vet min 1.1m projection, we’d still be about 400k over the tax line in adding that 14th roster spot (since we can only go up to 2weeks at a time at rostering 13 throughout the entire regular season). We’re gonna have to add a 14th player even if on a nonguaranteed deal to minimize the tax hit. I can see Castleton eventually being that guy once his two-way deal gets converted to a RoS deal (via remainder of MLE proration or vet min contract exception proration).

All that being said, I still feel when it’s all said and done with, JHS is on a 120% scale at a 3.7m cap hit. MaxL will be a 2m cap hit via the 4yr option of the 2nd round exception & our 14th roster add will lead to a 2m cap hit (prorated of nonguaranteed and/or in-season) via 2+ seasoned vet min annual scale used for tax purposes, leading to us being up to 2m above the tax line overall. We’d have to do some serious cap gymnastics to minimize the tax hit with these 3 additions (rookies + 14th roster add), but I don’t anticipate we can outright dick the tax this year, unless DLo’s deal holds a 15% max unlikely incentive bonus within it where he does not meet it.

The other means of ducking the tax outright this year is if we swap Vando (up to 4.8m cap hit via 145k unlikely incentive) out with a vet min deal (2m cap hit via 2+ seasoned vet min scale). Fyi, in regards to salaries that are greater than the vet min amount this year & that are not Bron & AD, Vando is trade eligible right now while we’d have to wait a month to offload JHS & till Dec 15th to offload GabeVince & Prince & wait one more month till Jan 15th to offload DLo, Rui & Reaves.

Btw I did catch your proration post in the free agency thread @G. You are correct that vet min exceptions begin to prorate the day the regular season begins while the 1.9m remainder of the ntpMLE won’t begin prorating downward till Jan 10th.

I’ll update all our salaries & the resulting projected tax hit once those figures are publicly released, if you haven’t done so already, my guy!
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2023 2:49 pm    Post subject:

In theory, can they trade vando to a team with cap space mid season to get under the tax line and reset the tax?
It was a shame that lebron’s extension had to include that cap clause, otherwise, we could maintain all the players while still avoid the tax
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2023 8:01 pm    Post subject:

Good stuff V+, thanks for all that! It will be really tight but it does seem they'd have to shed some salary to avoid the tax altogether.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2023 9:24 pm    Post subject:

^Yep @mad, if you offload Vando for a vet min (~2.3m), then we should be able to duck the tax and won’t experiences any surprises since Vando’s unlikely incentives would be outbound. We’d be able to trade Vando for a vet min salaried at least to that amount via the 200% +250k trade multiplier allowable for teams below the 1st Apron to make using salary structures in those smaller amounts.

I believe Utah, SA, Indy & Orlando all still have at least that amount of cap space remaining to completely offload Vando into.

Also, if Utah operates above the cap, they have numerous TPEs that they can absorb Vando completely into. In addition, ATL, Boston, BK, Dallas, Miami, Phx, Pdx and DC all have notable TPEs that could completely take in Vando, but we gotta be mindful in how eager tax paying teams wound be in adding to their bills, in order to have us duck ours.
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