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Lonzo-Lite
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 Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:09 am Post subject: |
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Didn’t Lakers hire Vogel because their first 2 choices, Lue and Monty, declined to coach the Lakers?
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:16 am Post subject: |
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| Bron2AD wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Bamba/Beasley/17th pick/ for Jarrett Allen/Ricky Rubio |
i was thinking about this but I dont know if Cavs will do it.
they already lost Lauri last year and now JA. who plays the PF position? |
Maybe a 3 way
Lakers get Jarrett Allen / Ricky Rubio
Cavs get there PF
And the 3rd team gets assets |
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hydrohead
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:20 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | John Gambadoro
@Gambo987
Vogel has been my choice the last week. The Suns liked that he is a Championship Coach and Defensive guru. There is a good chance Kevin Young will stay on as a top assistant - seems like it is his choice from what I have heard. |
This is same as when Kidd was slotted for Vogel in LA
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Bron2AD
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Joined: 01 Jun 2021
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:27 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | Need Westbrook to sign with the Suns to continue Vogel's nightmare.  |
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levon
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Joined: 11 Oct 2016
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:00 am Post subject: |
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| hydrohead wrote: | | Quote: | John Gambadoro
@Gambo987
Vogel has been my choice the last week. The Suns liked that he is a Championship Coach and Defensive guru. There is a good chance Kevin Young will stay on as a top assistant - seems like it is his choice from what I have heard. |
This is same as when Kidd was slotted for Vogel in LA |
Side note: This Gambo guy seems like such a tool. |
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Megaton
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Lamar's Bud
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Joined: 24 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:22 am Post subject: |
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| Lonzo-Lite wrote: | | Didn’t Lakers hire Vogel because their first 2 choices, Lue and Monty, declined to coach the Lakers? |
Lue wanted to be the Lakers coach, but he ended up saying no when he got lowballed on the contract offer (both in years and AAV) - something like $18M/3 years. Ultimately he got $35M/5 years from the Clips.
I can't fault Lue for saying no to that crap offer. We've seen rookie head coaches be given better deals than that....and Lue was already an experienced head coach with a championship! |
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Luis5150
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Joined: 27 May 2021
Posts: 478
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:22 am Post subject: |
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| levon wrote: | | hydrohead wrote: | | Quote: | John Gambadoro
@Gambo987
Vogel has been my choice the last week. The Suns liked that he is a Championship Coach and Defensive guru. There is a good chance Kevin Young will stay on as a top assistant - seems like it is his choice from what I have heard. |
This is same as when Kidd was slotted for Vogel in LA |
Side note: This Gambo guy seems like such a tool. |
He is one of the biggest Suns homers you'll ever encounter. Dan Bickley is just as bad if not worst. They all work for 98.7 FM AZ Sports.. all the talking heads in that sports station are homer hacks |
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32
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Joined: 04 Nov 2009
Posts: 73120
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:58 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Part 2 of my Lakers offseason mailbag:
— Chances LA pursues Kyrie Irving
— Their plans for the No. 17 pick
— The players more and least likely to return
— The three-guard lineups
— Max Christie’s development and more |
https://twitter.com/jovanbuha/status/1664696983569965058
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Last edited by 32 on Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Itsowheeze
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:00 am Post subject: |
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| 1995Lakers wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | tox wrote: | DDV is a good call out. If a series is too physical and Russell is being targeted, start DDV instead and have LeBron/AR play point. We probably need a fourth guard (Christie?) especially in the regular season (assuming Schro is gone) but finding someone off the bargain bin should be doable.
If the rest of the ntMLE can go towards a passable center (Plumlee?), then that just leaves a wing with length as the weak link in the roster. Which... well we pray Vando learns to hit 3s or Christie has a breakout season (as 3&D) |
so how much are we paying for DLO to come off the bench when it really matters? |
"When it really matters" -- he played and was effective in two playoff series. Rui also basically was a bench player against the Warriors with limited minutes and responsibility. I see DLO making more but I think $14M for Rui and $18-20M for Russell seems reasonable. |
https://uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/Screenshot-2023-04-09-at-11.40.46-PM.jpg?resize=1536,1177
18-20m for a guy to sit on bench when he is targeted 😂 |
Rui was targeted by the Warriors, he played 17 mpg. Fewer minutes than LW4 who by the way only played 5 games. But you don't talk about Rui the same way. Is it because he's only going to get paid $14M (does the $4M per year matter that much?). Or are you just discounting that series?
You run the risk of overcorrecting after one poor series. Russell, with more confidence on offense, is absolutely playable against the Nuggets. Maybe as a 6th man and you want a more physical defender to try to disrupt Murray's rhythm. But the 82 game regular season, and facing other teams, matters too. It's very much possible Denver loses to another team, or someone gets injured etc.
Of course if you can upgrade on Russell you do it, no one is suggesting otherwise. But to scoff at paying him $18-20M is short-sighted. |
A D'Lo with an attitude adjustment of really wanting/craving to win a chip is a D'Lo I would invest in. But the D'Lo that I saw in the exit interview made me know why he underperformed in the playoffs again. This playoffs run was essentially a test trial for him to gain fun experience but not one where he really felt he had to win - other words, he didnt really crave the chip. None of these things happen by fluke. Hypothetically, lets say D'Lo gets in the lab and says to himself, "Im going to improve my game so the offense runs through me more and this (bleep) will never happen again." That D'Lo is our starting point guard for the next 5 years.
Im just skeptical its going to happen. And if the me-me-me Im cool with everything that happened this season D'Lo you saw in the exit interview shows up again next season, you will get this same result at some point in the playoffs next season where he doesnt truly grind and he mentally falls apart, except Bron will now be even more pissed because its a recurring pattern under his watch. |
I agree with this. From that exit interview it gave off the vibes that D-LO was just happy for the ride and he really doesn't have a desire to get better. He needs a wake up call |
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gng930
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:13 am Post subject: |
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| Bron2AD wrote: | | hydrohead wrote: | | Phil Handy as a lead assistant to Frank would be a killer move. |
I doubt handy is leaving lebron and LA to be an assistant with suns |
Money talks. A lot. And they have an owner looking to make a splash, seems to be a bit of a blank check kind of guy.
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Megaton
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:28 am Post subject: |
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| gng930 wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | hydrohead wrote: | | Phil Handy as a lead assistant to Frank would be a killer move. |
I doubt handy is leaving lebron and LA to be an assistant with suns |
Money talks. A lot. And they have an owner looking to make a splash, seems to be a bit of a blank check kind of guy. |
Pistons owner looks more like a blank check guy considering what contract he gave Monty Williams.
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Thugnomoe
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Joined: 19 Jul 2005
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Location: unfortunately not Los Angeles anymore
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:29 am Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Bamba/Beasley/17th pick/ for Jarrett Allen/Ricky Rubio |
i was thinking about this but I dont know if Cavs will do it.
they already lost Lauri last year and now JA. who plays the PF position? |
Maybe a 3 way
Lakers get Jarrett Allen / Ricky Rubio
Cavs get there PF
And the 3rd team gets assets |
Jarrett allen probably doesn't get it done against Joker. 6'9. |
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lakersfan32
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 3801
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:45 am Post subject: |
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| cp3 didn't go to bat for doc rivers? lol |
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46811
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Thugnomoe wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Bamba/Beasley/17th pick/ for Jarrett Allen/Ricky Rubio |
i was thinking about this but I dont know if Cavs will do it.
they already lost Lauri last year and now JA. who plays the PF position? |
Maybe a 3 way
Lakers get Jarrett Allen / Ricky Rubio
Cavs get there PF
And the 3rd team gets assets |
Jarrett allen probably doesn't get it done against Joker. 6'9. |
Don’t look at his height as a indicator, Allen is a physical big who can help disrupt Jokic a little bit
Last edited by Inspector Gadget on Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:40 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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| 32 wrote: | | Quote: | Part 2 of my Lakers offseason mailbag:
— Chances LA pursues Kyrie Irving
— Their plans for the No. 17 pick
— The players more and least likely to return
— The three-guard lineups
— Max Christie’s development and more |
https://twitter.com/jovanbuha/status/1664696983569965058 |
Just read that the Lakers are perfectly fine keeping the 17th pick unless they see a offer they like, draft is still 3 weeks away a lot of teams still haven’t engaged in draft talks regarding draft picks yet IMO |
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Aeneas Hunter
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Joined: 12 Jul 2005
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:18 pm Post subject: |
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| 32 wrote: | | Quote: | Part 2 of my Lakers offseason mailbag:
— Chances LA pursues Kyrie Irving
— Their plans for the No. 17 pick
— The players more and least likely to return
— The three-guard lineups
— Max Christie’s development and more |
https://twitter.com/jovanbuha/status/1664696983569965058 |
It's mostly spitballing and speculation from Buha.
| Quote: | The tentative plan for the Lakers is to run it back with as much of this past season’s group as they can possibly afford under the new, stricter collective bargaining agreement. They will only pursue a third star if they deem that player of a certain caliber and believe he can fit next to James and Davis.
I think they run it back, or try to upgrade the point guard/lead ballhandler spot (Kyrie Irving, Fred VanVleet, Trae Young, etc.). |
| Quote: | What’s the realistic percentage that Kyrie Irving is a Laker this summer? — @iKeepGrindin
This is a difficult question to answer, but if I had to peg a percentage, I’d go low — somewhere in the 10 to 15 percent range. It’s certainly possible, but there are so many factors that have to go in the Lakers’ favor for them to land Irving. |
On $22-24M as a range for Russell:
| Quote: | | That said, I think that’s a slight overpay for Russell considering his inconsistency in the playoffs and the current free-agent market. Where is the team that’s going to swoop in and compete with the Lakers’ offer? I think Los Angeles can squeeze Russell closer to the $18 million to $20 million range annually. |
| Quote: | | The most likely outcome is the Lakers keeping the No. 17 pick, according to multiple team sources not authorized to speak publicly. But that could change if the right trade becomes available — including a team making an enticing offer for the Lakers to trade back later in the draft. I think the right trade would involve using the pick to secure a starting-level upgrade available in a trade on draft night or later this offseason — like, say, Myles Turner in Indiana, who I discussed in Part 1 of this mailbag. |
| Quote: | | The two players it’s appearing won’t be back are Mo Bamba and Malik Beasley, if only because of their contracts. With the aforementioned six names expected to return, the Lakers would be at around $120 million to $125 million — depending on the salary of Hachimura — in salary before factoring in cap holds or empty roster charges. Add Bamba’s $10.3 million non-guaranteed salary and Beasley’s $16.5 million team option, and they’re pushing $150-plus million with just eight players — and that’s before including free agents like Russell, Schröder or Walker. |
| Quote: | I think the Schröder situation is worth diving into in more detail.
The question for the Lakers is, essentially, what’s their greatest need this offseason?
Again, for them to realistically keep Schröder, they’d need to use one of their mid-level exceptions (either the non-taxpayer mid-level exception for up to a projected $12.2 million or the taxpayer mid-level exception for up to a projected $5.0 million). If they chose the former option, spending up to $12.2 million on Schröder, that would likely mean using him to replace Russell and saving meaningful salary on their cap sheet.
The downside to using an exception on Schröder is it costs the Lakers a valuable roster-building resource. They have additional needs, like another quality wing or a better backup center, and limited means to address them.
My guess would be they prefer another rotation-caliber wing — a player more reliable than Walker, Brown or Beasley. That was one of the weak spots in the rotation in the playoffs. Los Angeles isn’t oozing in wing talent the way more modernized teams like Boston, Denver, Golden State and the Clippers are. I expect the Lakers to try to address that with a trade and/or one of their exceptions. |
| Quote: | Is Darvin Ham gonna stop his three-guard lineups next season? — @DoingTheDada
It likely depends on how next season’s roster is constructed. For as much flak as Ham received from the fan base for his small lineups, the Lakers’ trio of Russell, Reaves and Schröder was quite effective together. The Lakers outscored opponents by 6.7 points per 100 possessions with those three on the floor together in the playoffs, according to Cleaning the Glass. They were even more dominant in the regular season, outscoring opponents by 46.2 points per 100 possessions over a small sample of 188 possessions, per Cleaning the Glass.
Looking at the playoffs, the true barometer, Los Angeles’ lineups with Walker as one of the three guards were also fairly successful. Replace Russell with Walker and the group is even better (plus-8.4 points per 100 possessions, per Cleaning the Glass). Walker in Reaves’ place was similarly useful (plus-3.0 points per 100 possessions). |
https://theathletic.com/4564818/2023/06/02/lakers-kyrie-irving-rumors-trade-draft-pick
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Big Shot Bob
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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If we can't orchestrate a trade of Bamba or Beasley + 17 for an impact player, the right move is to opt out of their deals. We don't need to make a decision until after the draft, so the timing works out well. We would still own their Bird rights, and could re-sign them to deals above the minimum. However, it would allow us to ensure we keep our TPMLE ($5m per), or potentially use our MLE ($12m per)... would all depend on how much D'Lo and Rui get.
So just because Bamba and/or Beasley's options get waived, it does not mean they won't be back. Beasley back on a 2/$12m total would make sense, as would Bamba on a 1/$4m. |
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nomoreshaq
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Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 5152
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Big Shot Bob wrote: | If we can't orchestrate a trade of Bamba or Beasley + 17 for an impact player, the right move is to opt out of their deals. We don't need to make a decision until after the draft, so the timing works out well. We would still own their Bird rights, and could re-sign them to deals above the minimum. However, it would allow us to ensure we keep our TPMLE ($5m per), or potentially use our MLE ($12m per)... would all depend on how much D'Lo and Rui get.
So just because Bamba and/or Beasley's options get waived, it does not mean they won't be back. Beasley back on a 2/$12m total would make sense, as would Bamba on a 1/$4m. |
do whatever the hell you can to obtain myles turner. that's the best, most reasonable play (aint no way we getting bobby portis). turner is a likely a pipe dream but its at least the most likely one |
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nomoreshaq
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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Turner
AD / Rui
LeBron / Vando
add a minimum center and a minimum wing and that's championship caliber.
on the guard side
reaves/christie
d'lo/schroder
add 1 minimum guard
then add 2 more end of bench depth pieces and we're good to go. |
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The Gr8 Lakes
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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Given the guys returning to school I had to flip this.
The Lakers made the WCF with this team. A few tweaks to be made and they are there again.
Beasley/Bamba 2024-25 2nds for Nurkic and 2nd this year (43rd)
Resign DLo, Rui, Reaves.
12 mil Exemption - Dante DiVincenzo
4.4 exemption - Shake Milton
17th pick - Jalen Hood-Schifino PG
43rd pick - Trayce Jackson-Davis PF/C
47th pick - Seth Lundy SF
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Dr. Laker
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Posts: 17134
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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| ocho wrote: | | Quote: | | The Suns and Frank Vogel are finalizing a five-year, $31 million contract to make the 2020 championship coach the new head man in Phoenix, sources tell @TheAthletic @Stadium. |
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That's a pittance compared to what Monty got in Detroit.
Happy for Frank, though. Trading for WB wasn't his fault.
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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| I would love to see most of the current roster come back and see if they can build more proper team chemistry in training camp and see if they can make a run at a championship not just as someone that ended up going on a run because every fell there way.. but because they are a damn good basketball team but the reality is everything is gonna be dark until we know what LeBron plans to do he might pull a shocker and demand a trade to a place like Cleveland or Miami he might decide to take a year off, I heard Lakers are gonna be hard pressed to keep Rui if someone offers him .. north of 20M, I wouldn’t be surprised if we some major changes to the Lakers roster, Pelinka after all is considered a opportunistic despite him learning his lesson. |
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LakerFan1987
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Joined: 30 Oct 2022
Posts: 1561
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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Someone mentioned a few pages back but Javon Carter would be a nice pick up if we lose Schroeder.
Good 3pt shooting clip in back up minutes. Everytime I see the Bucks play, he's always defending hard.
He's got a player option and made $2.5M last yr.
To fill out the roster I'd offer both Holiday brothers ... Aaron and Justin vet minimum deals to see if they want to play together. |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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| ocho wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | wolfpaclaker wrote: | | ocho wrote: | | It’s the danger of overreacting to the very last thing you saw and ignoring everything before it. Same mentality that bit us the summer of the Russ trade. |
If we play Denver in round 1, we are not even talking about playing anyone in round 2. This is not a valid argument.
The reason the Lakers traded for WB was relayed by Pelinka. He felt Lebron was at an age where he needed a 3rd star, particularly an all-star PG that can push him off the ball. Even now, this current roster, is built with the same vision. Reaves and DLO do a lot more creating than Lebron did in the championship season (led league in assists). I don't agree they overreacted to the Suns series of 2021. They (Pelinka) 1) Always wanted a 3rd star next to AD/Bron, and 2) Continue to feel Lebron should be playing next to a lot of creating guards. 3) Wouldn't shock me if they star chase a bit this summer. |
What? Overreacting to playoff performances/results is almost a tradition in sports. Russell was bad against the Nuggets, therefore he is a garbage player who we can never rely on. We crashed out against the Suns, so we needed to blow it up and get Westbrook. The Lebron window was closing, so we were absolutely in panic mode. Of course Pelinka says it was a calm, rational decision. What do you expect him to say? |
Yep. Nobody could hit a shot in that Phoenix series. Dennis had the 0 point game. Kuzma shot 17% from 3. 29% for Caruso. 21% for KCP. Drummond struggled. When the following season started they were all gone. They had a bad series. They weren’t bad players. Would have been nice to have All Defensive 1st team Caruso to throw at Murray or have Kuz’s size and versatility to throw at Porter or to have a sharpshooting defensive guard like KCP on our team instead of kicking our ass on the other team. It’s a lesson to hopefully learn from. |
So it was overeeaction to winning a championship when Pelinka traded away Danny Green (starting wing on 2 consecutive title teams), a #1 pick, and let the best defensive Center walk for a small ball Trez type C? Or when they again after winning a title with KCP/Green, went away from that to Dennis/KCP making us a lot smaller with Dennis who is easy to switch and hunt on in the playoffs (Much harder to switch and iso hunt on Green/KCP).
I don't think you guys really get Pelinka's MO. He loves change, he loves constant action. This past offseason (2022) was the first time he really showed some poise and patience and it paid off big time at trade deadline. He waited to deal WB and it paid off.
When I see roster continuity, I'll be the first to say Pelinka overreacted to a playoffs. He's been cleaning houses since he got here. This is how he operates. |
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