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Aeneas Hunter
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 Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:05 am Post subject: |
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| JUST-MING wrote: | | In red are training camp invites. |
It would be nice if one of these long shots came through.
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gng930
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:19 am Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | I just do not understand this roster at all if they keep Russ. Teams will be packing the paint again and we are back to a lot of the same spacing issues again. |
You can't sign quality shooters with the vet min. It's really that simple. Basically, there's nothing for you to understand. This is just what you get when you're scraping the bottom of the barrel.
People want 3 and D wings. You can't get the 3 for the vet min unless you're willing to take someone like Carmelo or Ellington. You can get the D for the vet min, but it's going to be someone like Stanley Johnson.
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You can't get it for the min but they had the TMLE available. Otto, Brown, House, Divincenzo and TJ all would have been better than the guy we got who doesn't 3 or D and is hugely redundant with our current pieces. |
Were those guys really options? We were offering only a one-year contract, and the team was a dumpster fire last year. We might have been able to sign TJ Warren, but he just missed two straight seasons. We could never have afforded the pre-injury version of Warren. The post-injury version couldn't get much more than the vet min. This tells me that the market assesses him as damaged goods. I hope for his sake that he proves the market wrong.
For sure, I question the Lonnie Walker signing for a lot of reasons. Just the same, we're scraping the bottom of the barrel. Once we decided to offer only one year with the taxpayer MLE, I'm not sure that it was significantly more attractive than the vet min from the perspective of a quality player. |
Which goes back to his original point, that it's more due to overall FO incompetence than lack of resources.
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gng930
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:22 am Post subject: |
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| activeverb wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | I just don't like the trend I'm seeing nor do I like that the Spurs while rebuilding didn't even deem a 23 year old worthy of a QO. |
The Spurs did give Walker a QO. However, after the Spurs drafted two guards in the first round this year, Walker saw he had a limited future with the team and asked them to remove the QO so he could become an unrestricted free agent. The Spurs agreed, since neither they didn't see Walker as a big part of their future plans either. |
It doesn't change my opinion of him but that is an important distinction to make. Either way, the fact that they drafted two guards and were willing to lose him for nothing is not a ringing endorsement.
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RI Laker
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7188
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:22 am Post subject: |
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| pjiddy wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | krisobe wrote: | Closing death lineup. Switch everything. Everyone can shoot/defend.
PG: Kyrie
SG: Walker
SF: Stanley
PF: Bron
C: AD |
What? Johnson is a poor shooter. Walker is one of the worst defenders in the league, and he was a poor shooter last year, too. |
Lmao you’re not switching with even one of Kyrie/Walker let alone both. Those dudes can never see the floor together or we’ll give up 2.5 points per possession. |
This! |
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Inspector Gadget
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pjiddy
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:20 am Post subject: |
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| JUST-MING wrote: | | Kevin opting to hold out. Kyrie without an extension. Houston has their pick. Why isn't Sean Marks fired? |
Says the guy who blames Lebron for Westbrook instead of Pelinka. |
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JUST-MING
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:26 am Post subject: |
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Lebron isn't demanding a trade/holding out. Russell isn't demanding a max contract.
If Lebron demanded a trade or for Darvin Ham and Rob Pelinka to be fired, I'm sure both Darvin and Rob would offer their letters of resignation. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:33 am Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/268283/Kevin-Durant-Headed-Towards-Holdout
They have no choice but to trade him. |
First, we'll see if he actually holds out.
Even then, the Nets can still wait for a deal they like. Never forget he's under contract for four years. The Nets haven't shown any indication to be intimated by Durant. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:41 am Post subject: |
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| JUST-MING wrote: | | Kevin opting to hold out. Kyrie without an extension. Houston has their pick. Why isn't Sean Marks fired? |
1. I believe Houston has the option to exchange picks with Brooklyn. Since Houston will probably be pretty bad, if Brooklyn is terrible this year, they'll still probably end up with a good pick.
2. We'll see if Durant actually holds out, and if so, for how long. He has limited ability to intimidate the Nets. I could see Tsai shrugging if he holds out and basically saying, "We'll still wait for a deal we like. And in the meantime, we'll sue to recover your salary. It will be nice to save on the luxury tax."
3. Since Tsai publically supported Marks, his job is safe. |
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:41 am Post subject: |
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| activeverb wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/268283/Kevin-Durant-Headed-Towards-Holdout
They have no choice but to trade him. |
First, we'll see if he actually holds out.
Even then, the Nets can still wait for a deal they like. Never forget he's under contract for four years. The Nets haven't shown any indication to be intimated by Durant. |
This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:43 am Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | activeverb wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/268283/Kevin-Durant-Headed-Towards-Holdout
They have no choice but to trade him. |
First, we'll see if he actually holds out.
Even then, the Nets can still wait for a deal they like. Never forget he's under contract for four years. The Nets haven't shown any indication to be intimated by Durant. |
This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
Or maybe the Nets aren't going to be blackmailed by a holdout into doing a trade they don't like.
It's all up to Tsai. He's the wild card in all this. |
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:55 am Post subject: |
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| With the NBA schedule ready to be released next week and some of the big match ups not being leaked yet because they wanna see were KD and Mitchell end up, actually I’m shocked that the NBA was so fast to release the Christmas Day match up when the Irving situation hasn’t been resolved, a Lakers match up against wherever KD ended up would have made the ratings fly if the Irving deal ends up happening. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | With the NBA schedule ready to be released next week and some of the big match ups not being leaked yet because they wanna see were KD and Mitchell end up, actually I’m shocked that the NBA was so fast to release the Christmas Day match up when the Irving situation hasn’t been resolved, a Lakers match up against wherever KD ended up would have made the ratings fly if the Irving deal ends up happening. |
This is traditionally when the NBA releases its schedule. I didn't think they would delay the release waiting for trades that may never happen. |
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Aeneas Hunter
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| gng930 wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | I just do not understand this roster at all if they keep Russ. Teams will be packing the paint again and we are back to a lot of the same spacing issues again. |
You can't sign quality shooters with the vet min. It's really that simple. Basically, there's nothing for you to understand. This is just what you get when you're scraping the bottom of the barrel.
People want 3 and D wings. You can't get the 3 for the vet min unless you're willing to take someone like Carmelo or Ellington. You can get the D for the vet min, but it's going to be someone like Stanley Johnson.
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You can't get it for the min but they had the TMLE available. Otto, Brown, House, Divincenzo and TJ all would have been better than the guy we got who doesn't 3 or D and is hugely redundant with our current pieces. |
Were those guys really options? We were offering only a one-year contract, and the team was a dumpster fire last year. We might have been able to sign TJ Warren, but he just missed two straight seasons. We could never have afforded the pre-injury version of Warren. The post-injury version couldn't get much more than the vet min. This tells me that the market assesses him as damaged goods. I hope for his sake that he proves the market wrong.
For sure, I question the Lonnie Walker signing for a lot of reasons. Just the same, we're scraping the bottom of the barrel. Once we decided to offer only one year with the taxpayer MLE, I'm not sure that it was significantly more attractive than the vet min from the perspective of a quality player. |
Which goes back to his original point, that it's more due to overall FO incompetence than lack of resources. |
That gets into the blame game. I've made my feelings about the front office clear, and I did it long before it became fashionable. Regardless of all the spilled milk and water under the bridge, here we are. So if the question is why our roster lacks legitimate 3 and D players, it's primarily because we can't afford them and secondarily because Jeanie isn't willing to start paying repeater tax to finance this dumpster fire of a roster.
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Aeneas Hunter
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/268283/Kevin-Durant-Headed-Towards-Holdout
They have no choice but to trade him. |
That's just Windhorst speculating. Anyway, Ben Simmons probably thought the Sixers had no choice but to trade him.
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Aeneas Hunter
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
We get it. You're desperate for the Nets to trade Durant because you think that the Nets will then send us Irving. The Nets are going to follow their own timetable and may not trade Irving to us in any event. They aren't under any time pressure at all.
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Dr. Laker
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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| activeverb wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | activeverb wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/268283/Kevin-Durant-Headed-Towards-Holdout
They have no choice but to trade him. |
First, we'll see if he actually holds out.
Even then, the Nets can still wait for a deal they like. Never forget he's under contract for four years. The Nets haven't shown any indication to be intimated by Durant. |
This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
Or maybe the Nets aren't going to be blackmailed by a holdout into doing a trade they don't like.
It's all up to Tsai. He's the wild card in all this. |
See: O'Neal, Shaquille
Shaq demanded a trade in January 2001 (which the team ignored), then threatened to have surgery and miss the season if they didn't trade him in the summer of 2004. They might have called his bluff, but with the Kobe uncertainty, they decided to make whatever deal they could and move on.
The Nets could get into a power struggle with KD, but unless they have a strong Plan B/fall back position, they'll become the biggest losers.
The Lakers could finesse Kobe in 2007 because they had ongoing talks regarding Gasol and Bynum's good start bought them some time. But they were, indeed, prepared to trade Kobe rather than let the situation fester. IIRC, Kobe had to invoke his no-trade clause or get shipped to Detroit.
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pjiddy
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| JUST-MING wrote: | Lebron isn't demanding a trade/holding out. Russell isn't demanding a max contract.
If Lebron demanded a trade or for Darvin Ham and Rob Pelinka to be fired, I'm sure both Darvin and Rob would offer their letters of resignation. |
Lol based on what?
Darvis Ham is going to quit before he's even coached and give up guaranteed millions?
Pelinka is going to quit the only front office job he'll ever have?
Fantasy world. |
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Aeneas Hunter
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Dr. Laker wrote: | | See: O'Neal, Shaquille |
He had one year left on his contract. That's a big difference.
Anyway, I think a lot of people here are so eager to see Durant traded that they're overlooking the more fundamental problem: No one appears to be offering much for Durant. Forget all the stuff about the Nets' asking price. What is anyone really offering?
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pjiddy
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
Everyone laughed at Morey thinking he could get a superstar in exchange for Simmons. And that the longer he held out, the more depressed his value would be.
He got a much better return than the ones being offered when Simmons first demanded his trade. The playbook on this has already been written. No need to rush a trade. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | See: O'Neal, Shaquille |
He had one year left on his contract. That's a big difference.
Anyway, I think a lot of people here are so eager to see Durant traded that they're overlooking the more fundamental problem: No one appears to be offering much for Durant. Forget all the stuff about the Nets' asking price. What is anyone really offering? |
I also think some people are in denial that the Nets are perfectly happy to compete with Durant, Irving & co. They aren't looking to tear down the team and rebuild. |
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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| pjiddy wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
Everyone laughed at Morey thinking he could get a superstar in exchange for Simmons. And that the longer he held out, the more depressed his value would be.
He got a much better return than the ones being offered when Simmons first demanded his trade. The playbook on this has already been written. No need to rush a trade. |
Did Simmons demand a trade? |
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
We get it. You're desperate for the Nets to trade Durant because you think that the Nets will then send us Irving. The Nets are going to follow their own timetable and may not trade Irving to us in any event. They aren't under any time pressure at all. |
We’ll see. |
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lakersfever714
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Joined: 05 Jan 2016
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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| pjiddy wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
Everyone laughed at Morey thinking he could get a superstar in exchange for Simmons. And that the longer he held out, the more depressed his value would be.
He got a much better return than the ones being offered when Simmons first demanded his trade. The playbook on this has already been written. No need to rush a trade. |
Simmons wasn't playing so it was easy for Philly to deal with him since he didn't have to get bombarded with questions from the media. KD and Kyrie will be grilled by the media every single day.
I'm not sure Philly got a good deal for Simmons though because they did give up quite a lot for Harden, who was playing terrible at the time.
Nets could hang on to KD but there's no guarantee they would get a better offer than they have now. One thing is for certain though is that it will be a distraction for them. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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| lakersfever714 wrote: | | pjiddy wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | This isn’t just a simple, if you want to hold out you will have to wait until we find a better deal.. the more he drags this out the more his value decreases, the Nets aren’t gonna put up with superstars who are holding the Organization hostage. |
Everyone laughed at Morey thinking he could get a superstar in exchange for Simmons. And that the longer he held out, the more depressed his value would be.
He got a much better return than the ones being offered when Simmons first demanded his trade. The playbook on this has already been written. No need to rush a trade. |
Simmons wasn't playing so it was easy for Philly to deal with him since he didn't have to get bombarded with questions from the media. KD and Kyrie will be grilled by the media every single day.
I'm not sure Philly got a good deal for Simmons though because they did give up quite a lot for Harden, who was playing terrible at the time.
Nets could hang on to KD but there's no guarantee they would get a better offer than they have now. One thing is for certain though is that it will be a distraction for them. |
Again, people are overlooking that the Nets could hang onto Durant and never trade him. It's not like that trading him is mandatory or inevitable. |
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