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Mamba Mentality
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Joined: 04 May 2017
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Location: The Left Coast
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 Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 10:08 am Post subject: |
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It's amazing how real this Lakers 3pt curse is. I don't believe in that kind of stuff, but man, hard to ignore.
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Megaton
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Joined: 18 Feb 2015
Posts: 25653
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 10:18 am Post subject: |
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| Mamba Mentality wrote: | | It's amazing how real this Lakers 3pt curse is. I don't believe in that kind of stuff, but man, hard to ignore. |
It mostly applies to players who have made their career being just pure shooters. Danny Green, Wes Matthews, Kent Bazemore, Ben McLemore, etc.
Yet ironically, it’s guys who can do more than just shoot, who turn out to be better at shooting than those 3 point specialists here like Reaves, Lebron, Avery Bradley in 2020, DLO, etc.
Which goes to show: don’t just get players who are only known for literally ONE thing. Because chances are, they are just going to suck hard here, and will be unplayable in the playoffs like Duncan Robinson, Joe Harris, Seth Curry, now Malik Beasley, etc. You need players who can do more out there.
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miggz23
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Joined: 29 Nov 2018
Posts: 6849
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 10:25 am Post subject: |
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| Megaton wrote: | | Mamba Mentality wrote: | | It's amazing how real this Lakers 3pt curse is. I don't believe in that kind of stuff, but man, hard to ignore. |
It mostly applies to players who have made their career being just pure shooters. Danny Green, Wes Matthews, Kent Bazemore, Ben McLemore, etc.
Yet ironically, it’s guys who can do more than just shoot, who turn out to be better at shooting than those 3 point specialists here like Reaves, Lebron, Avery Bradley in 2020, DLO, etc.
Which goes to show: don’t just get players who are only known for literally ONE thing. Because chances are, they are just going to suck hard here, and will be unplayable in the playoffs like Duncan Robinson, Joe Harris, Seth Curry, now Malik Beasley, etc. You need players who can do more out there. |
Besides Bazemore. The rest of the guys pretty much settled down and shot decently as a Laker. Wes was already trending down in his career. |
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Kobefied
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Joined: 17 May 2008
Posts: 559
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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From what I see of him he is either extremely hot - or extremely cold.
When he is cold with his shot, it also leads to turnovers so then its a double whammy.
He is hot so far tonight!
So yeah keep him in the rotation.
But then when he goes out and misses a couple you know its not his night, just bench him go somewhere else - we have others who would kill for his minutes.
That is how I would play a very hot or very cold player.
He just does too much damage when he is cold.
I have yet to see a game where he starts really cold and seems to get it back - he remains cold throughout that game is what I see. |
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Nonamehero
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Joined: 31 Oct 2018
Posts: 816
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Kobefied wrote: | From what I see of him he is either extremely hot - or extremely cold.
When he is cold with his shot, it also leads to turnovers so then its a double whammy.
He is hot so far tonight!
So yeah keep him in the rotation.
But then when he goes out and misses a couple you know its not his night, just bench him go somewhere else - we have others who would kill for his minutes.
That is how I would play a very hot or very cold player.
He just does too much damage when he is cold.
I have yet to see a game where he starts really cold and seems to get it back - he remains cold throughout that game is what I see. |
We just need to create open look for him.
And let the percentage take care of itself.
Shooter needs to shoot.
But don’t ask him to shoot too many contested shots or forced shots |
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activeverb
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Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 37470
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Kobefied wrote: | From what I see of him he is either extremely hot - or extremely cold.
When he is cold with his shot, it also leads to turnovers so then its a double whammy.
He is hot so far tonight!
So yeah keep him in the rotation.
But then when he goes out and misses a couple you know its not his night, just bench him go somewhere else - we have others who would kill for his minutes.
That is how I would play a very hot or very cold player.
He just does too much damage when he is cold.
I have yet to see a game where he starts really cold and seems to get it back - he remains cold throughout that game is what I see. |
A few games ago, he shot 1 for 3 for threes the first half and five for 11 for threes in the second half. So if we had gone by your formula, we would have been deprived of 15 points in the second half because you would have glued him to the bench after his slow start. There have been plenty of times where he started slow and then got hot. Just like there are times when he started hot and got cold and all variations in between.
Beasley and other players really don't follow such a simple, predictable pattern. If you could tell that a player was going to have an off night because he missed his first two shots, the algorithm folks would have determined that years ago. There are countless people, from teams to bettors, who are crunching the numbers continuously |
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Theseus
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Joined: 15 Dec 2007
Posts: 14228
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 7:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Beas kept us in it early. We started out poorly but he wasn't having it. He was making it rain. Stay ready Beas, we'll need you again. |
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mhan00
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Theseus wrote: | | Beas kept us in it early. We started out poorly but he wasn't having it. He was making it rain. Stay ready Beas, we'll need you again. |
Very happy Beasley helped us out big time in the first quarter. Even happier Ham still limited his minutes. |
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Vancouver Fan
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Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Posts: 17740
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Theseus wrote: | | Beas kept us in it early. We started out poorly but he wasn't having it. He was making it rain. Stay ready Beas, we'll need you again. |
We will definitely need him.
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gng930
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | GOODRICH25 wrote: | Whats the best course of action with him? I dont really want him to stay next season
1. Let walk? We lose a salary we can use in (sign&)trades
2. Pick up option then trade? Not sure he got much value all by himself
3. Try to negotiate a smaller salary? Not sure hed take it |
The most ideal option is just trade him for a draft pick. A 2nd round pick would be fine.
Let the scouting department do their thing and replace him with someone actually good at their job. While also being much cheaper. |
Who would give the Lakers an asset for the privilege of paying him $16 million. Would you do it? |
Trade deadline? It's basically a $16M expiring with a first rounder knowing the Lakers might (emphasis on might) be very bad in a couple of years |
My response was to potentially getting an asset for Beas. But it seems you have us attaching assets to get rid of him?
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gng930
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 11476
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 1:09 am Post subject: |
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| J.C. Smith wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | Who would give the Lakers an asset for the privilege of paying him $16 million. Would you do it? |
Someone who has a player on a multiyear deal that the Lakers want, but who the owning team wants to get rid of to free up cap space.
Nobody wanted Kendrick Nunn? Or Patrick Beverley at $13m? Or Russ at $47m, either? Having that salary on the roster gives you flexibility to make a move if one presents itself.
As bad as Malik has been, he's only two years removed from a 19.6 point on 39.9% three point shooting season. And is a career 37.8% three point shooter on high volume. He's much more likely to bounce back than he is to be who is is right now forever.
People forget, Buddy Hield shot 36.6% from three last year. He hadn't reached 40% in three seasons. And after the Pacers trade he shot 36.2%. Shooters have a better chance of correcting their shot in the offseason, when they have a lot more practice time to work out their issues. Hield bounced back this year to shoot 42.1%. Malik is more likely to return to his career numbers than not. |
I guess my post wasn't clear to a few. I asked if Beas could get us assets in return. The responses have basically been attaching assets, getting undesirable contracts in return, or citing trades we made where we actually had also to attach assets.
I agree having salary ballast is good except when you know your owner is not a big spender. What will be the opportunity cost of keeping Beas' salary? Is it worth it to lose some combination of Rui/Schro/Brown/Mo for the possibility that you can attach additional assets to Beasley later?
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gng930
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 1:12 am Post subject: |
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| Megaton wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | GOODRICH25 wrote: | Whats the best course of action with him? I dont really want him to stay next season
1. Let walk? We lose a salary we can use in (sign&)trades
2. Pick up option then trade? Not sure he got much value all by himself
3. Try to negotiate a smaller salary? Not sure hed take it |
The most ideal option is just trade him for a draft pick. A 2nd round pick would be fine.
Let the scouting department do their thing and replace him with someone actually good at their job. While also being much cheaper. |
Who would give the Lakers an asset for the privilege of paying him $16 million. Would you do it? |
Depends on the team? If they need guards, especially guards that can shoot, and if those teams have nothing better to use cap space on, then I could see them do it? Probably them banking on Beasley bouncing back.
We literally got assets for Westbrick and Pat Bev. Anything can happen. |
Holy crap are we re-writing history? We had to attach a picks in both this deals. We didn't get assets for those two, we simply exchanged our future assets for immediate assets. Utah did not trade for Westbrook's floor value nor did Orlando trade for Pat Bev's floor value.
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tox
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Joined: 16 Nov 2015
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 3:05 am Post subject: |
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| gng930 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | GOODRICH25 wrote: | Whats the best course of action with him? I dont really want him to stay next season
1. Let walk? We lose a salary we can use in (sign&)trades
2. Pick up option then trade? Not sure he got much value all by himself
3. Try to negotiate a smaller salary? Not sure hed take it |
The most ideal option is just trade him for a draft pick. A 2nd round pick would be fine.
Let the scouting department do their thing and replace him with someone actually good at their job. While also being much cheaper. |
Who would give the Lakers an asset for the privilege of paying him $16 million. Would you do it? |
Trade deadline? It's basically a $16M expiring with a first rounder knowing the Lakers might (emphasis on might) be very bad in a couple of years |
My response was to potentially getting an asset for Beas. But it seems you have us attaching assets to get rid of him? |
The argument is that if you waive Beasley, you lose his $16M salary. But if you keep him as an expiring contract, you can use his $16M expiring as salary ballast to improve the roster towards the trade deadline (i.e., some tanking team will give up a useful player for Beasley's expiring, if incentivized by a FRP)
Now I don't think Jeanie actually wants to pay that much in luxury tax so it's a purely hypothetical line of thought.
edit: just saw you addressed this above. Yeah I misunderstood your question (or, rather, I answered the wrong one) |
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Lonzo-Lite
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Joined: 17 May 2011
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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This is what Beasley should always be doing! If his shot is not falling, cut to the basket for easy layups! Not trying to create off the dribble or force a drive, just cut! Nice job so far today!
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pio2u
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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Beasley made a few nice treys tonight and played well defensively (+16).
He is more effective & less of a liability coming off the bench.
When his shot is on it's a beautiful thing.
We will need his 3 point scoring in the play-offs. |
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mad55557777
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Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 23368
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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| pio2u wrote: | Beasley made a few nice treys tonight and played well defensively (+16).
He is more effective & less of a liability coming off the bench.
When his shot is on it's a beautiful thing.
We will need his 3 point scoring in the play-offs. |
Play him with lebron, simple as that |
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CervantesRises
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Joined: 18 Jun 2016
Posts: 3918
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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| mad55557777 wrote: | | pio2u wrote: | Beasley made a few nice treys tonight and played well defensively (+16).
He is more effective & less of a liability coming off the bench.
When his shot is on it's a beautiful thing.
We will need his 3 point scoring in the play-offs. |
Play him with lebron, simple as that |
THIS!
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aiel
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| mad55557777 wrote: | | pio2u wrote: | Beasley made a few nice treys tonight and played well defensively (+16).
He is more effective & less of a liability coming off the bench.
When his shot is on it's a beautiful thing.
We will need his 3 point scoring in the play-offs. |
Play him with lebron, simple as that |
Really can't depend on his 3pt shooting in high-leverage situations in the playoffs and or close games. At this stage of his career, he is better at helping keep large leads or bombing away when we are down a lot. |
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BandwagonLBJhopper
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Joined: 07 Feb 2020
Posts: 3587
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Someone said it well - he is an asset because when he gets hot it's pretty much game over and automatic W. And teams know it. |
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mad55557777
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Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 23368
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 8:49 pm Post subject: |
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| aiel wrote: | | mad55557777 wrote: | | pio2u wrote: | Beasley made a few nice treys tonight and played well defensively (+16).
He is more effective & less of a liability coming off the bench.
When his shot is on it's a beautiful thing.
We will need his 3 point scoring in the play-offs. |
Play him with lebron, simple as that |
Really can't depend on his 3pt shooting in high-leverage situations in the playoffs and or close games. At this stage of his career, he is better at helping keep large leads or bombing away when we are down a lot. |
You write him off before the playoffs even starts? His stroke is there and defense won’t give him open shots which gives our other players more spacing to operate.
Also he won’t be playing in high leverage situations like end of games, but I would certainly use him in the first 3 quarters |
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Megaton
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lakerican
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Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 3793
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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| mad55557777 wrote: | | aiel wrote: | | mad55557777 wrote: | | pio2u wrote: | Beasley made a few nice treys tonight and played well defensively (+16).
He is more effective & less of a liability coming off the bench.
When his shot is on it's a beautiful thing.
We will need his 3 point scoring in the play-offs. |
Play him with lebron, simple as that |
Really can't depend on his 3pt shooting in high-leverage situations in the playoffs and or close games. At this stage of his career, he is better at helping keep large leads or bombing away when we are down a lot. |
You write him off before the playoffs even starts? His stroke is there and defense won’t give him open shots which gives our other players more spacing to operate.
Also he won’t be playing in high leverage situations like end of games, but I would certainly use him in the first 3 quarters |
Today he went 11-3. That's 27% He is 35% for the year. That's exactly what you don't want in the playoffs. |
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hype
Star Player
Joined: 19 Nov 2007
Posts: 4378
Location: Lake Nacimiento
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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| lakerican wrote: | | mad55557777 wrote: | | aiel wrote: | | mad55557777 wrote: | | pio2u wrote: | Beasley made a few nice treys tonight and played well defensively (+16).
He is more effective & less of a liability coming off the bench.
When his shot is on it's a beautiful thing.
We will need his 3 point scoring in the play-offs. |
Play him with lebron, simple as that |
Really can't depend on his 3pt shooting in high-leverage situations in the playoffs and or close games. At this stage of his career, he is better at helping keep large leads or bombing away when we are down a lot. |
You write him off before the playoffs even starts? His stroke is there and defense won’t give him open shots which gives our other players more spacing to operate.
Also he won’t be playing in high leverage situations like end of games, but I would certainly use him in the first 3 quarters |
Today he went 11-3. That's 27% He is 35% for the year. That's exactly what you don't want in the playoffs. |
Opposing teams still look to clearly fear him since he's rarely left wide open.. That space he creates is extremely valuable in it's own right since most of our roster does it's best damage inside. He should and absolutely will continue getting a decent amount of minutes going into the Playoffs.. idc what his percentage is as a Laker honestly especially if he continues cutting to the basket at times and putting the effort in defensively. |
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mad55557777
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Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 23368
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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| lakerican wrote: | | mad55557777 wrote: | | aiel wrote: | | mad55557777 wrote: | | pio2u wrote: | Beasley made a few nice treys tonight and played well defensively (+16).
He is more effective & less of a liability coming off the bench.
When his shot is on it's a beautiful thing.
We will need his 3 point scoring in the play-offs. |
Play him with lebron, simple as that |
Really can't depend on his 3pt shooting in high-leverage situations in the playoffs and or close games. At this stage of his career, he is better at helping keep large leads or bombing away when we are down a lot. |
You write him off before the playoffs even starts? His stroke is there and defense won’t give him open shots which gives our other players more spacing to operate.
Also he won’t be playing in high leverage situations like end of games, but I would certainly use him in the first 3 quarters |
Today he went 11-3. That's 27% He is 35% for the year. That's exactly what you don't want in the playoffs. |
Shooters go up and down, even curry has bad games. The 11 he got today were much better looks compare to 2-3 weeks ago, and with a shooter like Beasley, they will fall. The man can change a game or 2 by being hot from the 3. More importantly, teams will never leave him open. |
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gng930
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 11476
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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He can certainly raise our ceiling in the playoffs. Hopefully we build a bit of a cushion so that he gets some good run against Utah to regain his confidence. We might need to keep a short leash on him if we're serious about winning the LAC/PHX games.
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