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miggz23
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Joined: 29 Nov 2018
Posts: 6963
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 Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2024 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | EZ-Ryder wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Hanging from Rafters wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | What package can we realistically get by trading LeBron? I think him and Curry have had discussions about teaming up and that’s why the Warriors FO went after him, who else is an option? |
A spot in the lottery, we can get that package by trading Lebron. |
LeBron’s value is sky high right now, he’s been amazing it’s just that it seems like him and AD just can’t get it done anymore together |
Lebron wants a big market or a team that can compete even if they trade for him? What team takes that risk that meets that criteria? |
Cleveland seems like a logical destination, they have Allen and other assets they can send while still competing for a title |
Only makes it logical if they keep Mitchell/Allen/Mobley... Warriors makes the most sense.
If you want to take on Wiggins/CP3/Moody/1st. |
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144500
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 7:34 am Post subject: |
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| zambia wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Hanging from Rafters wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | What package can we realistically get by trading LeBron? I think him and Curry have had discussions about teaming up and that’s why the Warriors FO went after him, who else is an option? |
A spot in the lottery, we can get that package by trading Lebron. |
LeBron’s value is sky high right now, he’s been amazing it’s just that it seems like him and AD just can’t get it done anymore together |
We need better role players around around Bron and AD. |
We will have the same role players around Lebron and AD. Will either one play 70 games in a season again?
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Japago
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Joined: 21 Jun 2018
Posts: 1413
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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The Lakers need specific things defensively, but they also needs those from guys that can hold their own on offense.
But, the Lakers need a 3rd option that can take over whenever LeBron or AD don't have it. The Lakers need a major offensive weapon beyond those 2.
It's probably too much at this point. The Lakers wasted assets over the years have probably made it impossible to get both.
But, the Lakers need to try.
I'm for the Lakers offering up everything beyond LeBron and AD yet again.
It's obvious that DLo, AR, and Rui are just role players whenever the Lakers are in a a big spot against an elite team. They're not even great ones because they can't play defense. They don't offer enough when they aren't scoring, even with DLo's play-making. The 2020 Lakers were getting that from a vet's minimum Rondo.
I say the Lakers get that 3rd option, then hope they have the magic they had in the 2019 off-season when you found a lot of talent for cheap.
Every team needs to eventually have talent at low cost to compete. The Lakers have been so bad over the years at that. They wasted 1st round picks and made awful signings from exceptions and minimums. |
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BandwagonLBJhopper
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Joined: 07 Feb 2020
Posts: 3609
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:19 pm Post subject: |
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You need older Lebron in a poor man Grant Hill role, AD the top dog, and a 3rd creator who can get buckets and setup AD. With the right role players that could get it done.
The question is who can you get - Trae Young? You'd have to really shore up the SG defense or get a real defensive center to complement AD. Who else is realistic - NOP still controls our pick one more year right? They are jamming up our ability to make moves. |
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Hanging from Rafters
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Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4498
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Japago wrote: | The Lakers need specific things defensively, but they also needs those from guys that can hold their own on offense.
But, the Lakers need a 3rd option that can take over whenever LeBron or AD don't have it. The Lakers need a major offensive weapon beyond those 2.
It's probably too much at this point. The Lakers wasted assets over the years have probably made it impossible to get both.
But, the Lakers need to try.
I'm for the Lakers offering up everything beyond LeBron and AD yet again.
It's obvious that DLo, AR, and Rui are just role players whenever the Lakers are in a a big spot against an elite team. They're not even great ones because they can't play defense. They don't offer enough when they aren't scoring, even with DLo's play-making. The 2020 Lakers were getting that from a vet's minimum Rondo.
I say the Lakers get that 3rd option, then hope they have the magic they had in the 2019 off-season when you found a lot of talent for cheap.
Every team needs to eventually have talent at low cost to compete. The Lakers have been so bad over the years at that. They wasted 1st round picks and made awful signings from exceptions and minimums. |
It’s easy to put an eyeball test general opinion type feelings take on what the Lakers need. Maybe that’s what Rob does and that would explain the inadequate roster construction he has struggled with. If logic is used to analyze team struggles and weaknesses tho, it seems clear to me that; rebounding (18th), turnovers (19th), defensively from the perimeter; is the obvious problem imo, not scoring (5th). Offensively the Lakers are also the 2nd best shooting team overall in the NBA while shooting 8th best from 3pt.
Sure, another scorer capable of getting their own shot could help but it doesn’t look like the problem and would appear more like overkill in the wrong direction, (Westbrook?) A big body back up C capable of playing with/without AD along with a true 3&D guard, (Caruso?/Drummomd?), fills the statistical holes not just the emotional ones.
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“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.”
Last edited by Hanging from Rafters on Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:54 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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deal
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Joined: 17 Aug 2008
Posts: 14932
Location: Earth
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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| BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | You need older Lebron in a poor man Grant Hill role, AD the top dog, and a 3rd creator who can get buckets and setup AD. With the right role players that could get it done.
The question is who can you get - Trae Young? You'd have to really shore up the SG defense or get a real defensive center to complement AD. Who else is realistic - NOP still controls our pick one more year right? They are jamming up our ability to make moves. |
So Lakers need 3 super stars to win? This complemented with G-leagers?
Gramps is not winning another chip here. The FO needs to prepare
a post-LeBron team.
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Lakers need to build a freaking team ! |
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lakersfever714
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Joined: 05 Jan 2016
Posts: 11989
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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| deal wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | You need older Lebron in a poor man Grant Hill role, AD the top dog, and a 3rd creator who can get buckets and setup AD. With the right role players that could get it done.
The question is who can you get - Trae Young? You'd have to really shore up the SG defense or get a real defensive center to complement AD. Who else is realistic - NOP still controls our pick one more year right? They are jamming up our ability to make moves. |
So Lakers need 3 super stars to win? This complemented with G-leagers?
Gramps is not winning another chip here. The FO needs to prepare
a post-LeBron team. |
No thanks. We already know what that team would look like. Just look at 2013-2017. Lebron was the magnet that attracted AD here. Take away that magnet and all you're gonna get is Moz/Deng.
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Playoffs is good enough. - Jeanie Buss 2024 |
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144500
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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| lakersfever714 wrote: | | deal wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | You need older Lebron in a poor man Grant Hill role, AD the top dog, and a 3rd creator who can get buckets and setup AD. With the right role players that could get it done.
The question is who can you get - Trae Young? You'd have to really shore up the SG defense or get a real defensive center to complement AD. Who else is realistic - NOP still controls our pick one more year right? They are jamming up our ability to make moves. |
So Lakers need 3 super stars to win? This complemented with G-leagers?
Gramps is not winning another chip here. The FO needs to prepare
a post-LeBron team. |
No thanks. We already know what that team would look like. Just look at 2013-2017. |
It’s going to happen, a smart FO would be planning for it already. That doesn’t mean dumping Lebron and/or AD, setting up future picks and cap space. Unfortunately this FO lacks that vision.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4498
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | lakersfever714 wrote: | | deal wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | You need older Lebron in a poor man Grant Hill role, AD the top dog, and a 3rd creator who can get buckets and setup AD. With the right role players that could get it done.
The question is who can you get - Trae Young? You'd have to really shore up the SG defense or get a real defensive center to complement AD. Who else is realistic - NOP still controls our pick one more year right? They are jamming up our ability to make moves. |
So Lakers need 3 super stars to win? This complemented with G-leagers?
Gramps is not winning another chip here. The FO needs to prepare
a post-LeBron team. |
No thanks. We already know what that team would look like. Just look at 2013-2017. |
It’s going to happen, a smart FO would be planning for it already. That doesn’t mean dumping Lebron and/or AD, setting up future picks and cap space. Unfortunately this FO lacks that vision. |
The FO lacks vision, that’s the best overall, single biggest problem the Lakers have. Coaching selections, role players let go, trades for players that don’t fit, improper structure of contracts, you name it they failed at it. Frustratingly, however, if the struggles are identified statistically and logically, the Lakers aren’t as far away from being a title favorite as it seems.
The team gives up too many 2nd chance points, commits too many unforced turnovers, and lose focus too often on both; running the offense and defensive assignments, all without calling time outs to address it. Get a rebounder, get a legitimate 3&D guard, coach ball security, and use time outs efficiently to get the team effectively back on track when they get off and the Lakers would be in it for a ship run.
Unfortunately, the Lakers may need both another coach and another GM with possibly another owner to accomplish those things.
_________________
“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
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anth2000
Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Apr 2001
Posts: 12282
Location: Pasadena, CA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Can we get Bob Myers, a new coach and see where we can improve the roster? |
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Bron2AD
Star Player
Joined: 01 Jun 2021
Posts: 9356
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| anth2000 wrote: | | Can we get Bob Myers, a new coach and see where we can improve the roster? |
Oh who going to pay 20mil to get a decent coach and Gm? |
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Outspoken
Star Player
Joined: 11 Feb 2015
Posts: 8467
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Hypothetically, if Bron walks, how much cap space do we have? |
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CamReddish
Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015
Posts: 8026
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Outspoken wrote: | | Hypothetically, if Bron walks, how much cap space do we have? |
Like 15 to 20 million. If DLO walks too we would have like 35 million I think
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Outspoken
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Joined: 11 Feb 2015
Posts: 8467
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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| CamReddish wrote: | | Outspoken wrote: | | Hypothetically, if Bron walks, how much cap space do we have? |
Like 15 to 20 million. If DLO walks too we would have like 35 million I think |
Dang. We have no cap space. Lol |
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CamReddish
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Joined: 23 Jun 2015
Posts: 8026
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| Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Outspoken wrote: | | CamReddish wrote: | | Outspoken wrote: | | Hypothetically, if Bron walks, how much cap space do we have? |
Like 15 to 20 million. If DLO walks too we would have like 35 million I think |
Dang. We have no cap space. Lol |
Lol. AD, Rui, Gabe, Vando, and AR make about 95 million combined next season.
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Previously LBJ23 |
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dcarter4kobe
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Joined: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 17698
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 10:39 am Post subject: |
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Kris Dunn and Goga Bitadze are my 2 VM targets this summer assuming we don't have MLE.
Dunn graded out as one of the best POA defenders in the NBA while shooting 37% from 3 (1.7 attempts)
Goga graded out as on of the top anchor bigs on D and also showed signs of playmaking talent.
Still attempting to replace Zubac and Caruso all these years later.
Rui/Gabe/2 1st for Murray
AD/Goga
LeBron/Wood
Vando/Prince
Murray/Reaves/Christie
DLO/Dunn
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"He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4498
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 11:38 am Post subject: |
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| dcarter4kobe wrote: | Kris Dunn and Goga Bitadze are my 2 VM targets this summer assuming we don't have MLE.
Dunn graded out as one of the best POA defenders in the NBA while shooting 37% from 3 (1.7 attempts)
Goga graded out as on of the top anchor bigs on D and also showed signs of playmaking talent.
Still attempting to replace Zubac and Caruso all these years later.
Rui/Gabe/2 1st for Murray
AD/Goga
LeBron/Wood
Vando/Prince
Murray/Reaves/Christie
DLO/Dunn |
I’m not for giving up Rui in such a deal. It would look better off keeping the team we have and just adding Dunn/Goga. The starters from Feb/Mar/Apr won too many games against too many top seeded opponents to move away from AD/Rui/LBJ/AR/Dlo as contributors unless a clear and decisive upgrade is acquired at their specific position. I’m not necessarily saying all have to continue to start but I’d wanna at least keep what has worked to sustain demonstrated proven success then build on that. No one step back strategy hoping for progress with a possible unproven two steps forward. That failed mentality is why the roster currently has Gabe instead of Schroeder. It’s just too big of a risk of a downgrade otherwise.
Rui was playable in last year’s WCF whereas Vando was not and we haven’t seen if the roster with Vando as a starter would be able to win at a similar rate as what we’ve seen already with Rui. Also, will Prince return for vet min? I don’t see him worth more than that. Murray for AR/Gabe works schematically better than jettisoning Rui in terms of roster construction and I consider Murray a clear and concisive upgrade for AR.
AD/Drummomd
Rui
LBJ/Vando
Murray
Dlo/Caruso
If I’m after a legitimate ship run then I need to acquire players that, if they played like they did the prev year, their contributions would mean we’d be one of the favorites. I don’t like going after a ship hoping somebody does something they have never done. I’d prefer to go after Murray then Caruso/Drummond over Goga/Dunn and would be willing to trade any and all of the rest to do it plus picks.
_________________
“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
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jonnybravo
Retired Number
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
Posts: 30770
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Hanging from Rafters wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | lakersfever714 wrote: | | deal wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | You need older Lebron in a poor man Grant Hill role, AD the top dog, and a 3rd creator who can get buckets and setup AD. With the right role players that could get it done.
The question is who can you get - Trae Young? You'd have to really shore up the SG defense or get a real defensive center to complement AD. Who else is realistic - NOP still controls our pick one more year right? They are jamming up our ability to make moves. |
So Lakers need 3 super stars to win? This complemented with G-leagers?
Gramps is not winning another chip here. The FO needs to prepare
a post-LeBron team. |
No thanks. We already know what that team would look like. Just look at 2013-2017. |
It’s going to happen, a smart FO would be planning for it already. That doesn’t mean dumping Lebron and/or AD, setting up future picks and cap space. Unfortunately this FO lacks that vision. |
The FO lacks vision, that’s the best overall, single biggest problem the Lakers have. Coaching selections, role players let go, trades for players that don’t fit, improper structure of contracts, you name it they failed at it. Frustratingly, however, if the struggles are identified statistically and logically, the Lakers aren’t as far away from being a title favorite as it seems.
The team gives up too many 2nd chance points, commits too many unforced turnovers, and lose focus too often on both; running the offense and defensive assignments, all without calling time outs to address it. Get a rebounder, get a legitimate 3&D guard, coach ball security, and use time outs efficiently to get the team effectively back on track when they get off and the Lakers would be in it for a ship run.
Unfortunately, the Lakers may need both another coach and another GM with possibly another owner to accomplish those things. |
It starts right there. When asked about the hires in the organization, the first thing Jeanie says is she needs to be "comfortable" with said people. That's a euphemism for hiring my friends. Pro tip to Jeanie...in most companies, there will be extremely competent people that rub you the wrong way. You work with it.
West may be getting up there but we don't need him to field calls like it was 1996 . He's the ultimate basketball visionary. But you know, Jeanie wasn't comfortable around the big meanie. That's the guy you needed. Relegate Pelinka to the Mitch role under Buss...deal with the day to day, the #'s etc...but the vision? Jerry West. It's a crime that he's not involved with the team in some capacity.
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Japago
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Joined: 21 Jun 2018
Posts: 1413
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 1:43 pm Post subject: |
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I ponder whether or not guys like DeJounte Murray or Mikal Bridges are good enough offensive options to be the "3rd guy" behind LeBron and AD. It would be REALLY helpful, because they also help with the Lakers' defensive needs.
My guess is that they aren't.
They would improve the Lakers the most as a regular season team, but you risk not having enough offense in the postseason yet again when LeBron and AD eventually need more help. |
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Japago
Star Player
Joined: 21 Jun 2018
Posts: 1413
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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It's mind-numbing how much loyalty fans have for guys like DLo/AR/Rui. They have definitive ceilings. They're ultimately role players when they're against elite teams in the playoffs.
You're going to get the same results EVERY time they face a top-tier contender: they'll get outplayed by the other team's superior stars.
They're not scrubs by any stretch. But, the Lakers ultimately have bigger needs.
When you have bigger needs, you solve those needs and try to fix what you gave up by cheaper methods.
Without being able to replace LeBron/AD with superior top tier stars, the next best thing is to get a 3rd guy who can stand by them. |
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levon
Franchise Player
Joined: 11 Oct 2016
Posts: 10789
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Japago wrote: | I ponder whether or not guys like DeJounte Murray or Mikal Bridges are good enough offensive options to be the "3rd guy" behind LeBron and AD. It would be REALLY helpful, because they also help with the Lakers' defensive needs.
My guess is that they aren't.
They would improve the Lakers the most as a regular season team, but you risk not having enough offense in the postseason yet again when LeBron and AD eventually need more help. |
You need luck in acquisitions like this. Bridges is not a worldbeater player today, and consequently he could potentially be had for less than such a player would command, but you hope he becomes that kind of 1C offensive option while providing perimeter defense.
We need the Aaron Gordon + KCP moves to become a real contender. I believe ironically those also cost 3 picks total. I don't mind going all-in now because if you acquire players of value and build something, you can attract stars after LBJ. If you sputter out and sit on your assets, you risk drafting nobodies with your FRPs and repelling future stars.
Teams don't bottom out anymore. They build cost-controlled, good teams that they can sell to stars. Makes me really skeptical that the Spurs are on the right track. |
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2019
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Joined: 03 Dec 2014
Posts: 10868
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| anth2000 wrote: | | Can we get Bob Myers, a new coach and see where we can improve the roster? |
Is Bob Myers even that guy?
Probably better than Rob but his tenure is easy to pick apart also. |
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mad55557777
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 23595
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| 2019 wrote: | | anth2000 wrote: | | Can we get Bob Myers, a new coach and see where we can improve the roster? |
Is Bob Myers even that guy?
Probably better than Rob but his tenure is easy to pick apart also. |
Hell no |
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LakersARETheGOAT
Star Player
Joined: 13 Jan 2012
Posts: 3830
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Who can the lakers get to build a bigger roster because they need to get bigger to beat, nuggets, wolves , bucks, and Celtics |
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Lakersfan1211
Star Player
Joined: 28 Mar 2021
Posts: 6029
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| Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2024 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| LakersARETheGOAT wrote: | | Who can the lakers get to build a bigger roster because they need to get bigger to beat, nuggets, wolves , bucks, and Celtics |
I wonder if Blazers are looking to trade Robert Williams III. He would be a good piece w/ AD at the 4. |
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