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DaMuleRules Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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governator wrote: | vanexelent wrote: | governator wrote: | Looks like Trump AG preparing to kill this Mueller investigation |
https://twitter.com/AmandiOnAir/status/1097504888236527617?s=19
Quote: | Had a long chat with someone who worked closely with Special Counsel Mueller for years.
They believe that Mueller’s final report will not only be devastating to Trump, but that the person who’ll work closest with Mueller to make sure the Congress knows & acts is AG William Bar | r. |
surprising, thought Bill Barr is Trump's guy |
He is. So take that report with a huge boulder of salt. Barr was selected to thwart Mueller, not help him. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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vanexelent Retired Number
Joined: 17 May 2005 Posts: 30081
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | vanexelent wrote: | governator wrote: | Looks like Trump AG preparing to kill this Mueller investigation |
https://twitter.com/AmandiOnAir/status/1097504888236527617?s=19
Quote: | Had a long chat with someone who worked closely with Special Counsel Mueller for years.
They believe that Mueller’s final report will not only be devastating to Trump, but that the person who’ll work closest with Mueller to make sure the Congress knows & acts is AG William Bar | r. |
surprising, thought Bill Barr is Trump's guy |
He is. So take that report with a huge boulder of salt. Barr was selected to thwart Mueller, not help him. |
On one hand he write that unsolicited memo bashing Mueller investigation. On the other hand he's been friends with Mueller for decades and seems to be pretty "by the books" kind of guy. |
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ContagiousInspiration Franchise Player
Joined: 07 May 2014 Posts: 13823 Location: Boulder ;)
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | vanexelent wrote: | governator wrote: | Looks like Trump AG preparing to kill this Mueller investigation |
https://twitter.com/AmandiOnAir/status/1097504888236527617?s=19
Quote: | Had a long chat with someone who worked closely with Special Counsel Mueller for years.
They believe that Mueller’s final report will not only be devastating to Trump, but that the person who’ll work closest with Mueller to make sure the Congress knows & acts is AG William Bar | r. |
surprising, thought Bill Barr is Trump's guy |
He is. So take that report with a huge boulder of salt. Barr was selected to thwart Mueller, not help him. |
Exactly. we might think Trump is stupid but he is not inviting anyone who is not on his side in some way..
Quote: | Mr. Whitaker, who had privately told associates that part of his role at the Justice Department was to “jump on a grenade” for the president, |
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/19/us/politics/trump-investigations.html |
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ContagiousInspiration Franchise Player
Joined: 07 May 2014 Posts: 13823 Location: Boulder ;)
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | A Coast Guard lieutenant arrested last Friday on gun and drug charges allegedly wanted to conduct a mass killing.
Christopher Paul Hasson, 49, of Silver Spring, Maryland, is alleged to be a white supremacist who had a hit list that included prominent Democratic politicians as well as several journalists from CNN and MSNBC. Hasson's case was first circulated by counterterrorism expert Seamus Hughes and the George Washington Program on Extremism. |
https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/20/politics/coast-guard-mass-killing-hit-list/index.html?no-st=1550708174
Just now hearing about this?
Ammo
Maga Approved hit list of Dems and Media Libs.. wtf is going on
So sad this piece of (bleep) has been president for 2 years |
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Wilt LG Contributor
Joined: 29 Dec 2002 Posts: 13731
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/20/politics/special-counsel-conclusion-announcement/index.html
Justice Department preparing for Mueller report as early as next week |
And how many times have we heard that? |
Actually, we've never had reports with such specificity before. Last year, we had a number of vague reports that said that Mueller will be done "in a few months" or similar predictions.
NBC reported a few weeks ago that the report will be done in February, and this latest report by CNN is consistent with that. Let's see what happens. _________________ ¡Hala Madrid! |
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DaMuleRules Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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Wilt wrote: | DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/20/politics/special-counsel-conclusion-announcement/index.html
Justice Department preparing for Mueller report as early as next week |
And how many times have we heard that? |
Actually, we've never had reports with such specificity before. Last year, we had a number of vague reports that said that Mueller will be done "in a few months" or similar predictions.
NBC reported a few weeks ago that the report will be done in February, and this latest report by CNN is consistent with that. Let's see what happens. |
No, we've had several reports over the last several months that the report was going to come in imminently . . . like a week or so. And as was said in this thread earlier today, even this one is very speculative because the Mueller team has been very leak proof. So no one would really know when it's coming out. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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DaMuleRules Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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vanexelent wrote: | DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | vanexelent wrote: | governator wrote: | Looks like Trump AG preparing to kill this Mueller investigation |
https://twitter.com/AmandiOnAir/status/1097504888236527617?s=19
Quote: | Had a long chat with someone who worked closely with Special Counsel Mueller for years.
They believe that Mueller’s final report will not only be devastating to Trump, but that the person who’ll work closest with Mueller to make sure the Congress knows & acts is AG William Bar | r. |
surprising, thought Bill Barr is Trump's guy |
He is. So take that report with a huge boulder of salt. Barr was selected to thwart Mueller, not help him. |
On one hand he write that unsolicited memo bashing Mueller investigation. On the other hand he's been friends with Mueller for decades and seems to be pretty "by the books" kind of guy. |
And then we have Trump, who no way in hell is going to appoint someone he isn't positive will run interference for him. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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Wilt LG Contributor
Joined: 29 Dec 2002 Posts: 13731
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 6:29 pm Post subject: |
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DaMuleRules wrote: | Wilt wrote: | DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/20/politics/special-counsel-conclusion-announcement/index.html
Justice Department preparing for Mueller report as early as next week |
And how many times have we heard that? |
Actually, we've never had reports with such specificity before. Last year, we had a number of vague reports that said that Mueller will be done "in a few months" or similar predictions.
NBC reported a few weeks ago that the report will be done in February, and this latest report by CNN is consistent with that. Let's see what happens. |
No, we've had several reports over the last several months that the report was going to come in imminently . . . like a week or so. And as was said in this thread earlier today, even this one is very speculative because the Mueller team has been very leak proof. So no one would really know when it's coming out. |
Can you cite them, if there are several of them? I've never heard a report by a respected news organization that said "imminently" or a "week" until this one by CNN. I'll be glad to say I was wrong. Bloggers or random people on twitter don't count . _________________ ¡Hala Madrid!
Last edited by Wilt on Wed Feb 20, 2019 6:33 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ContagiousInspiration Franchise Player
Joined: 07 May 2014 Posts: 13823 Location: Boulder ;)
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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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My struggle is
What motive must one have to protect Donald Trump
Or are they protecting the people in the report?
If an enemy nation has helped the person in the white house get there.. why would William Barr protect that information? What motive? |
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LarryCoon Site Staff
Joined: 11 Aug 2002 Posts: 11266
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Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:13 am Post subject: |
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Seth Abramson does a more complete job of analyzing it here:
Quote: | 1/ The first important thing is to understand that—as NBC has done with a similar report over the last two days—CNN hedged its bets on its report in every way possible: (a) Barr's actions are merely "preparations." (b) CNN treats the news as merely an "indication" of the future.
2/ (c) If true, it means Mueller's "nearly" done. (d) "The precise timing of the announcement is subject to change." (e) "The scope and contours of what Barr will send to Congress remain unclear." (f) "Also unclear is how long it'll take Justice to prepare what it will submit."
3/ As someone who teaches journalism as well as legal advocacy, I'd say that's a heck of a lot of hedging. We got the same thing—admittedly on a more sparse report—from NBC's Pete Williams yesterday when he said "it's just our [NBC's] speculation" as to when Mueller will finish.
4/ A last hedge from CNN—and previously NBC—is that neither Justice nor Mueller will comment on these reports, and the sources are (of course) anonymous, so we have no idea how strong the sourcing is. The sources are at Justice—but whether they're in-the-know/biased we can't say.
5/ Some of CNN's report is rehashed—reading signs about Mueller possibly finishing up it's noted before (e.g., 4 of Mueller's 17 prosecutors being reassigned). CNN also says it saw "special counsel's office employees carry boxes and push a cart full of files out of their office."
6/ In making that second observation (about files leaving Mueller's office), CNN issued a *warning* about how we should understand what's happening—noting that the movement of files may signal a "hand-off" of certain cases (to other federal prosecutors) rather than their closure.
7/ This is why some inexact language being used by very good reporters at CNN should be checked, including one journalist who said (erroneously) that this report, if true, meant "the completion of the Russia investigation." If we know one thing, we know that that's not accurate.
8/ One reason many attorneys (me, Preet Bharara, and many others) saw Mueller delivering a report to DOJ this summer rather than this spring—keeping in mind that when *we* see it, and how much of it we see, is a different matter—is because certain things can't be wrapped up yet.
9/ Russian spy Maria Butina's boyfriend Paul Erickson was just charged, and we don't know what he'll reveal; Roger Stone was just charged, and we don't know what he'll reveal; Manafort may face new charges or may balk when he gets his sentence, so we don't know what he'll reveal.
10/ Mueller's office previously told Jerome Corsi it would indict him, and that still hasn't happened; Congress has sent transcripts to Mueller indicating felony perjury or lying to Congress by Erik Prince, Donald Trump Jr. and others, and those charges have not yet been brought.
11/ Mueller is still fighting with one individual and one corporation to compel grand jury testimony, and just extended his grand jury 6 months, so those matters must be litigated, as must outstanding subpoenas for document production—apparently internationally—that Mueller sent.
12/ Even taking all this—and more—into account, Mueller is entitled to issue a "final" report saying who he prosecuted, who he *plans to prosecute* or *is about to prosecute*, and who he chose not to prosecute (which could include the president, non-prosecuted due to DOJ regs).
13/ So a "final" report from Robert Mueller could be issued at the same time as any number of indictments are brought or pursued, with DOJ knowing that Mueller's office will have to supplement any "final" report with anything it learns from current or future indicted individuals.
14/ At the same time, as DOJ doesn't comment on ongoing investigations, any "hand-off" cases that go to other federal prosecutors (say at SDNY, EDVA or DC) will not necessarily be addressed in any "final" report, or, if mentioned, may appear partly or wholly redacted pre-release.
15/ What those who've been reporting that Mueller is close to issuing a final report have been saying is simply that: that he's close to issuing a "final report." That doesn't mean "the Russia investigation is complete" in anything like the way most people will hear that phrase.
16/ We also know that Robert Mueller may or may not close (or be involved with, or even know about) every *counterintelligence* case that may remain open about Trump and his campaign—possibly leading to new criminal cases down the line—as opposed to Mueller's *criminal* inquiry.
17/ Mueller's report, if indeed issued in March, could include information that leads to new counterintelligence investigations, new criminal investigations, new Congressional hearings that lead to new security concerns and new criminal referrals—we just have no idea whatsoever.
18/ We don't know if Mueller was forced to end his work by Barr; if Mueller chose not to indict certain Trump compatriots because they're cooperating witnesses in an impeachable-offense (collusion-related) allegation against Trump; if Mueller handed off explosive cases, or what.
19/ The upshot: lawyers and investigators (or, like me, lawyers and former investigators) have consistently said that *on the facts* Mueller can't be done with his work or even 3 months from done; CNN and MSNBC are reporting that *administratively* Mueller may be closing up shop.
20/ So if the reports are right, as @neal_katyal says we're only at the "end of the beginning," not the end of the end. And depending upon how and why we got here now, and what Mueller says in his report—or else sees redacted—we may well be at the beginning of a year of scandals.
21/ I'm only scratching the surface of this topic here. We still may have up to 20 sealed indictments per the DC docket (or none, or more) and even CNN notes that "even with signs of a wrap-up, the DC US Attorney's office has stepped in to work on cases that may continue longer."
22/ Just one probe *alone*—of Trump's inaugural committee—has many of the same witnesses as the Russia investigation "proper" (e.g., Barrack, Flynn, Gates, and more), so how and whether charges emanate from those cases will determine how much more such cases produce on collusion.
23/ Certainly, we know that people like Flynn and Gates have provided the feds with enormous cooperation with secret intel only they (or they and few people) have—and we've seen *no indictments* from that information, which means other shoes *have* to drop. That's how this works.
24/ So if you're seeing attorneys scrambling a bit here, it's because reporters have the easy job in this instance—simply saying whether they're hearing a report is coming—and attorneys the much harder job: to explain how that could be the case when it *factually* makes no sense.
25/ (And/or to explain how the news the reporters are reporting doesn't actually mean what some of the reporters are implying—as I've tried to do here by emphasizing how many different explosive directions this situation could go in over the next month, many harrowing for Trump.)
PS/ Those of us *also* in the midst of researching books are in a particularly fraught place—as we need to get our research done and *know* a book-length treatise is required to explain what's happened, but *also* know how bad the truth is and that therefore this isn't near over.
PS2/ For instance, I did a thread a week ago summarizing that we have *all ends* of an illegal "quid pro quo" of pre-election collusion involving the Trump campaign and an Israeli business intelligence operation that successfully sold Trump Jr. on a Saudi-funded disinfo campaign.
PS3/ So (taking that as just one example of many), I could take today's news as meaning that Trump Jr. will be charged with Lying to Congress by March and then leaned on for more info on Wikistrat/Psy-Group; that this is all part of the ongoing counterintel op; or something else.
PS4/ I can't give you an answer on where these clear lines of federal inquiry are going, and neither can anyone else—but I know they exist and I know they cannot and will not be blithely closed with a simple report in March. *Many* of these threads are *far* too explosive to end.
PS5/ For all we know, Robert Mueller will dump tons of raw intel into the laps of Congress and the CIA and tell them to investigate it all because he doesn't want to exceed his mandate. We just can't know now and *won't* know for many, many more months—and maybe not even in 2019.
NOTE/ Having said that, should Mueller give DOJ a report that Barr then publishes—redacted—suggesting no illegal pre-election conspiracy with foreign powers, I'll be happy to publish PROOF OF CONSPIRACY to show America what Barr would have had to redact to reach his "conclusion."
NOTE2/ I should've added that IF Barr prematurely shut down Mueller (as the spouse of Trump's Director of Strategic Communications somehow "knew" on Twitter)—but which I DON'T think is what this is—it goes without saying that protestors shutting down D.C. is the only option left. |
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DaMuleRules Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:25 am Post subject: |
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Wilt wrote: | DaMuleRules wrote: | Wilt wrote: | DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/20/politics/special-counsel-conclusion-announcement/index.html
Justice Department preparing for Mueller report as early as next week |
And how many times have we heard that? |
Actually, we've never had reports with such specificity before. Last year, we had a number of vague reports that said that Mueller will be done "in a few months" or similar predictions.
NBC reported a few weeks ago that the report will be done in February, and this latest report by CNN is consistent with that. Let's see what happens. |
No, we've had several reports over the last several months that the report was going to come in imminently . . . like a week or so. And as was said in this thread earlier today, even this one is very speculative because the Mueller team has been very leak proof. So no one would really know when it's coming out. |
Can you cite them, if there are several of them? I've never heard a report by a respected news organization that said "imminently" or a "week" until this one by CNN. I'll be glad to say I was wrong. Bloggers or random people on twitter don't count . |
Glance through the last 6 months of this thread. There have been plenty of discussions about how various sources were reporting that the release of the Mueller report was imminent or that he was close to wrapping it up. Not even sure how that could be in dispute. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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ContagiousInspiration Franchise Player
Joined: 07 May 2014 Posts: 13823 Location: Boulder ;)
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Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:33 am Post subject: |
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What sort of mindset .. what is their dedication
Why would he hide this information
Wouldn't he truly be a traitor to the people of the USA if he hid this information?
The most powerful seat in the world is filled with a Russian Asset
A man who does not care what he does that we think is disgusting or wrong.. he doesn't care
He sent his wife out to help the public turn their eye away from the babies in cages .. I think it was so gross I cannot even remember the exact words.. so shocking and blatantly inhumane
"I really don't care, do you?" .. written in big letters on the back of her $40 rain jacket
What kind of people are they?
She wore that while touring baby prisons in Texas.. ah well |
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ContagiousInspiration Franchise Player
Joined: 07 May 2014 Posts: 13823 Location: Boulder ;)
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Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:47 am Post subject: |
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LarryCoon wrote: | Seth Abramson does a more complete job of analyzing it here:
Quote: |
PS2/ For instance, I did a thread a week ago summarizing that we have *all ends* of an illegal "quid pro quo" of pre-election collusion involving the Trump campaign and an Israeli business intelligence operation that successfully sold Trump Jr. on a Saudi-funded disinfo campaign. |
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Just read about this yesterday.. Key owners of the company were previously in high levels of Israeli Govt
https://www.presstv.com/DetailFr/2019/02/12/588398/US-Mossad-Spying-Election-PsyGroup-Zamel-Cambridge-Analytica
Quote: | The New Yorker named Ram Ben-Barak, who was previously a deputy director of Mossad, and Yaakov Amidror, the former national security adviser to Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, as the agents behind its operations. |
Deep detail here
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-who-is-joel-zamel-australian-israeli-linked-to-mueller-s-trump-probe-1.6104963
Quote: | By contrast, Wikistrat is a large, established company with a much higher and extremely public profile. It was founded in Israel in 2010 and is now based in Washington, D. C. It bills itself as “the world’s first crowdsourced consultancy. We leverage a worldwide community of several hundred strategic thinkers to run simulations of likely international events and unfolding global trends, wargame future conflict or crisis scenarios, and conduct strategic planning exercises.” |
Thank you for posting that.
Maybe William Barr feels it is a Patriotic Responsibility to protect the office of the president of the USA from shame and disgrace even further?
I have no doubt that Russian Ops INSIDE the USA have gone up since Trump took office.. |
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Baron Von Humongous Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015 Posts: 32979
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Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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Here's a nice primer on next week's Trump-Kim Summit II - the Dumbening: WaPo (sub required)
Basically, it sounds like Trump will ask for a commitment to denuclearization, NK won't provide that guarantee, then Trump will spin it as a win over additional U.S. soldier remains being sent back to the U.S.
The main thing to look for under this president is that there's no promise of formal withdrawal of U.S. troops from South Korea or acknowledgement of the end of the Korean War without more significant concessions than KJU is likely willing to provide. But economic cooperation (triangulated with South Korea) and continued sanctions relief should merit on-site inspections and a commitment to halt nuclear missile technology development efforts at their current levels from the DPRK. _________________ Under New Management
Last edited by Baron Von Humongous on Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:00 am; edited 2 times in total |
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tox Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2015 Posts: 17880
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Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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vanexelent wrote: | DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | vanexelent wrote: | governator wrote: | Looks like Trump AG preparing to kill this Mueller investigation |
https://twitter.com/AmandiOnAir/status/1097504888236527617?s=19
Quote: | Had a long chat with someone who worked closely with Special Counsel Mueller for years.
They believe that Mueller’s final report will not only be devastating to Trump, but that the person who’ll work closest with Mueller to make sure the Congress knows & acts is AG William Bar | r. |
surprising, thought Bill Barr is Trump's guy |
He is. So take that report with a huge boulder of salt. Barr was selected to thwart Mueller, not help him. |
On one hand he write that unsolicited memo bashing Mueller investigation. On the other hand he's been friends with Mueller for decades and seems to be pretty "by the books" kind of guy. |
That memo was 5-D chess by Barr to get into the AG spot and then protect Mueller. #pipedreams |
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DaMuleRules Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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tox wrote: | vanexelent wrote: | DaMuleRules wrote: | governator wrote: | vanexelent wrote: | governator wrote: | Looks like Trump AG preparing to kill this Mueller investigation |
https://twitter.com/AmandiOnAir/status/1097504888236527617?s=19
Quote: | Had a long chat with someone who worked closely with Special Counsel Mueller for years.
They believe that Mueller’s final report will not only be devastating to Trump, but that the person who’ll work closest with Mueller to make sure the Congress knows & acts is AG William Bar | r. |
surprising, thought Bill Barr is Trump's guy |
He is. So take that report with a huge boulder of salt. Barr was selected to thwart Mueller, not help him. |
On one hand he write that unsolicited memo bashing Mueller investigation. On the other hand he's been friends with Mueller for decades and seems to be pretty "by the books" kind of guy. |
That memo was 5-D chess by Barr to get into the AG spot and then protect Mueller. #pipedreams |
I’m not against smoking that pipe though. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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ribeye Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2001 Posts: 12638
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 9:08 am Post subject: |
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New York Prosecutors Expected to Charge Manafort, Guarding Against Trump Pardon
Quote: | The Manhattan district attorney’s office is preparing state criminal charges against Paul J. Manafort, President Trump’s former campaign chairman, in an effort to ensure he will still face prison time even if the president pardons him for his federal crimes, according to several people with knowledge of the matter. |
Quote: | Any charges brought by Mr. Vance’s office would likely be challenged on double jeopardy grounds. New York state law includes stronger protections than those provided by the United States Constitution, and Mr. Manafort’s defense team is likely to challenge state charges. But prosecutors in Mr. Vance’s office have expressed confidence that they would prevail, people with knowledge of the matter said. |
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/22/nyregion/manafort-pardon-trump.html _________________ "A metronome keeps time by using a Ringo" |
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ContagiousInspiration Franchise Player
Joined: 07 May 2014 Posts: 13823 Location: Boulder ;)
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 9:14 am Post subject: |
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Why can't this just be a spy mystery comedy movie and not RL
Like Hogans Heroes or something.. just not real life
The thread reads like a weekly tv show script
We will come to find out Cohen is still working for the pres undercover like Manny tried to. Why else would Trump want to have a judge installed to look over Cohen? |
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Dladi Vidac Star Player
Joined: 09 Dec 2009 Posts: 4330 Location: Meeting the man who met Andy Griffith.
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 9:23 am Post subject: |
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ribeye wrote: | New York Prosecutors Expected to Charge Manafort, Guarding Against Trump Pardon
Quote: | Any charges brought by Mr. Vance’s office would likely be challenged on double jeopardy grounds. New York state law includes stronger protections than those provided by the United States Constitution, and Mr. Manafort’s defense team is likely to challenge state charges. But prosecutors in Mr. Vance’s office have expressed confidence that they would prevail, people with knowledge of the matter said. |
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/22/nyregion/manafort-pardon-trump.html |
Cy Vance, Vance Investigation _________________ "The best there is. The best there was. The best there ever will be.", said Bret Hart regarding the Los Angeles Lakers. |
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DaMuleRules Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 9:27 am Post subject: |
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ribeye wrote: | New York Prosecutors Expected to Charge Manafort, Guarding Against Trump Pardon
Quote: | The Manhattan district attorney’s office is preparing state criminal charges against Paul J. Manafort, President Trump’s former campaign chairman, in an effort to ensure he will still face prison time even if the president pardons him for his federal crimes, according to several people with knowledge of the matter. |
Quote: | Any charges brought by Mr. Vance’s office would likely be challenged on double jeopardy grounds. New York state law includes stronger protections than those provided by the United States Constitution, and Mr. Manafort’s defense team is likely to challenge state charges. But prosecutors in Mr. Vance’s office have expressed confidence that they would prevail, people with knowledge of the matter said. |
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/22/nyregion/manafort-pardon-trump.html |
It's been my understanding (and not saying I'm correct) that Double Jeopardy doesn't apply when a crime violates both Federal and State laws. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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Heartburn Star Player
Joined: 04 Oct 2001 Posts: 6350 Location: The Titanic that is the USA
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 9:36 am Post subject: |
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DaMuleRules wrote: | ribeye wrote: | New York Prosecutors Expected to Charge Manafort, Guarding Against Trump Pardon
Quote: | The Manhattan district attorney’s office is preparing state criminal charges against Paul J. Manafort, President Trump’s former campaign chairman, in an effort to ensure he will still face prison time even if the president pardons him for his federal crimes, according to several people with knowledge of the matter. |
Quote: | Any charges brought by Mr. Vance’s office would likely be challenged on double jeopardy grounds. New York state law includes stronger protections than those provided by the United States Constitution, and Mr. Manafort’s defense team is likely to challenge state charges. But prosecutors in Mr. Vance’s office have expressed confidence that they would prevail, people with knowledge of the matter said. |
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/22/nyregion/manafort-pardon-trump.html |
It's been my understanding (and not saying I'm correct) that Double Jeopardy doesn't apply when a crime violates both Federal and State laws. |
NY law has a more stringent standard to prevent people from being charged on a state level when they've been charged at the federal level.
The NY legislature has been thinking about reversing these laws, but have not yet done anything about it. |
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Omar Little Moderator
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90307 Location: Formerly Known As 24
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 9:59 am Post subject: |
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NY's law prohibits charging crimes that are significantly the same as those they have been charged federally with, but my guess is the NY AG and Mueller are smart enough to work out a division of prosecution. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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Omar Little Moderator
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90307 Location: Formerly Known As 24
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 10:01 am Post subject: |
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FWIW, I expect it's not the pardon possibility that keeps Manafort from full cooperation. I'd bet a fair amount of money he and his loved ones have been threatened. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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Hector the Pup Retired Number
Joined: 25 Jul 2002 Posts: 35946 Location: L.A.
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 10:39 am Post subject: |
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Omar Little wrote: | NY's law prohibits charging crimes that are significantly the same as those they have been charged federally with, but my guess is the NY AG and Mueller are smart enough to work out a division of prosecution. |
I'm fairly confident that that is the case.
I really don't think that the former head of the FBI and the state AG read about double jeopardy laws in the newspaper and suddenly realized that they can't do what they're doing. |
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vanexelent Retired Number
Joined: 17 May 2005 Posts: 30081
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Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 10:40 am Post subject: |
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MAGA farmers ripping off American tax payers to subsidize their failed business. No more MAGA welfare!
Quote: | U.S. Department of Agriculture has paid out $7.7 billion so far to farmers, William Northey, Undersecretary for Farm Production and Conservation, said on Friday, in aid designed to offset the negative impact of tariff imposition.
The administration of President Donald Trump has pledged up to $12 billion in aid to help offset losses for crops hit by retaliatory Chinese tariffs imposed in response to Washington’s tariffs on Chinese goods. |
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