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epak Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005 Posts: 34147
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Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:12 am Post subject: |
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BadGuy wrote: | epak wrote: | BadGuy wrote: | I got LeBron, Harden, Kemba, Giannis, and Siakam (in that order). You can't be the MVP if you can't shoot, and Giannis was exposed in the playoffs last year (and has shown little improvement shooting this year). In a close game, Giannis becomes a liability outside of his defensive impact.
Also, Kemba absolutely deserves to be in the top 5. Look at how Boston is playing this year vs. last year with Kyrie (despite losing Gordon Hayward). Kemba is the leader of that team and makes them go. I don't see Tatum as the best player on their team this year, and he was being called a bust last year with Kyrie on the team. |
I haven't watched much of Kemba. How much better is he from yesterday's game? His shrimpiness was exposed yesterday. The refs were pretty bad. But his size was a detriment. |
Refs blew multiple critical calls late in the game. First, the foul by Lou Williams on Kemba's drive. Then, the charge that was ruled a blocking foul by the refs despite Kemba being way outside the restricted area and in position to take the charge. Kemba had one of his worst games this season last night, and he has taken over other games for the Celtics to win. |
So if the refs allow more contact, would it be fair to say Kemba would be MUCH less effective? I would include Harden and Lou in that statement as well, although Harden would still be effective.
Hopefully the urban legend about refs allowing more physicality in the playoffs is true.
Re: the regular season MVP... this is going to be an interesting year. I don't see the Celts keeping up this win rate. Which leads me to think he would lose votes that he would have gotten if they were the top seed in the east. |
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BadGuy Star Player
Joined: 13 May 2008 Posts: 3629
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Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:02 am Post subject: |
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epak wrote: | BadGuy wrote: | epak wrote: | BadGuy wrote: | I got LeBron, Harden, Kemba, Giannis, and Siakam (in that order). You can't be the MVP if you can't shoot, and Giannis was exposed in the playoffs last year (and has shown little improvement shooting this year). In a close game, Giannis becomes a liability outside of his defensive impact.
Also, Kemba absolutely deserves to be in the top 5. Look at how Boston is playing this year vs. last year with Kyrie (despite losing Gordon Hayward). Kemba is the leader of that team and makes them go. I don't see Tatum as the best player on their team this year, and he was being called a bust last year with Kyrie on the team. |
I haven't watched much of Kemba. How much better is he from yesterday's game? His shrimpiness was exposed yesterday. The refs were pretty bad. But his size was a detriment. |
Refs blew multiple critical calls late in the game. First, the foul by Lou Williams on Kemba's drive. Then, the charge that was ruled a blocking foul by the refs despite Kemba being way outside the restricted area and in position to take the charge. Kemba had one of his worst games this season last night, and he has taken over other games for the Celtics to win. |
So if the refs allow more contact, would it be fair to say Kemba would be MUCH less effective? I would include Harden and Lou in that statement as well, although Harden would still be effective.
Hopefully the urban legend about refs allowing more physicality in the playoffs is true.
Re: the regular season MVP... this is going to be an interesting year. I don't see the Celts keeping up this win rate. Which leads me to think he would lose votes that he would have gotten if they were the top seed in the east. |
I get what you're saying, and he may not be as effective in the playoffs with more contact. In the regular season thus far (from what i've seen), he's been amongst the strongest candidates. I don't think he passes LeBron or Harden, but I'll take him over Giannis and Siakam in the regular season thus far. |
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epak Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005 Posts: 34147
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Posted: Sun Nov 24, 2019 4:27 pm Post subject: |
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governator wrote: |
Ok, maybe, he goin super Saiyan tonight |
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Startrout Star Player
Joined: 06 Aug 2004 Posts: 2153
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Posted: Sun Nov 24, 2019 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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I think Luka and Lebron have to be right up there on the top at this point in the season. What they both are doing is amazing. |
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danzag Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2013 Posts: 22475 Location: Brazil
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Posted: Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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LeBron for MVP
AD for DPOY
Lakers for the championship
Let's get it done |
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20,000 Retired Number
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 30003 Location: Likely nowhere near you
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Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:17 am Post subject: |
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First post updated. Numbers 1 and 2 are the same, but 3 through 5 have changed. Luka in the conversation, as is Kawhi. Harden, who is averaging 38PPG, is fourth.
It is still early in the season, and perhaps many of these statistics are unsustainable, but it will be an interesting race to MVP. _________________ Courage doesn't always roar.
Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying...'I will try again tomorrow.' |
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PRLakeShow Franchise Player
Joined: 07 Oct 2016 Posts: 10460
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Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:36 am Post subject: |
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BadGuy wrote: | I got LeBron, Harden, Kemba, Giannis, and Siakam (in that order). You can't be the MVP if you can't shoot, and Giannis was exposed in the playoffs last year (and has shown little improvement shooting this year). In a close game, Giannis becomes a liability outside of his defensive impact.
Also, Kemba absolutely deserves to be in the top 5. Look at how Boston is playing this year vs. last year with Kyrie (despite losing Gordon Hayward). Kemba is the leader of that team and makes them go. I don't see Tatum as the best player on their team this year, and he was being called a bust last year with Kyrie on the team. |
This board... You know how many people have won the MVP that "can't" shoot? Also, what does his performance in the 2019 playoffs have to do with his chances for MVP in the 2019-2020 season? Come on... at least try to stay objective. |
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governator Retired Number
Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Posts: 25417
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Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:39 am Post subject: |
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LeBron has a chance if Lakers finish with the best record in the league but if Luka keep this up and Mavs get home court... man |
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ringfinger Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Posts: 29418
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Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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It’s Luka for me.
Then Lebron. Then Harden. |
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Bard207 Star Player
Joined: 08 Jan 2013 Posts: 7713
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Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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ringfinger wrote: | It’s Luka for me.
Then Lebron. Then Harden. |
I can't argue with this.
Ranadive made a mistake by not overruling Vlade. |
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20,000 Retired Number
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 30003 Location: Likely nowhere near you
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Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 11:35 am Post subject: |
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Rankings updated. #1 and #2 remain the same. More shuffling for #3-#5. _________________ Courage doesn't always roar.
Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying...'I will try again tomorrow.' |
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20,000 Retired Number
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 30003 Location: Likely nowhere near you
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 8:12 am Post subject: |
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#1 remains the same. All others have shuffled, but it is still the same cast of candidates. _________________ Courage doesn't always roar.
Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying...'I will try again tomorrow.' |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144704 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 8:32 am Post subject: |
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Interesting seeing Siakam move into the discussion _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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moonriver24 Franchise Player
Joined: 21 Oct 2007 Posts: 15266
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:00 am Post subject: |
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Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. _________________ Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples |
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epak Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005 Posts: 34147
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:19 am Post subject: |
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moonriver24 wrote: | Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. |
Nope.
Giannis
LeBron
AD
Luka
Harden |
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silkwilkes Star Player
Joined: 15 Jul 2002 Posts: 6948 Location: searching for the mojo of Dr. Buss
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:21 am Post subject: |
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I think Giannis has to be the MVP right now because he's doing it all alone. Then it's AD/Bron. Then Luka and followed by Harden. _________________ "He may say it's not you, it's him.... but it's really you." |
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moonriver24 Franchise Player
Joined: 21 Oct 2007 Posts: 15266
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:29 am Post subject: |
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epak wrote: | moonriver24 wrote: | Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. |
Nope.
Giannis
LeBron
AD
Luka
Harden |
I do agree. But Davis should be next. Why? Is Lebron better because of Davis or Davis better because of Lebron? It is subjective. You may ask why Lebron suddenly can operate more freely now than ever? _________________ Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples |
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epak Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005 Posts: 34147
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:51 am Post subject: |
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moonriver24 wrote: | epak wrote: | moonriver24 wrote: | Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. |
Nope.
Giannis
LeBron
AD
Luka
Harden |
I do agree. But Davis should be next. Why? Is Lebron better because of Davis or Davis better because of Lebron? It is subjective. You may ask why Lebron suddenly can operate more freely now than ever? |
I'm OK with an AD/Bron flip flop. |
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miggz23 Star Player
Joined: 29 Nov 2018 Posts: 7242
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 10:45 am Post subject: |
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moonriver24 wrote: | epak wrote: | moonriver24 wrote: | Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. |
Nope.
Giannis
LeBron
AD
Luka
Harden |
I do agree. But Davis should be next. Why? Is Lebron better because of Davis or Davis better because of Lebron? It is subjective. You may ask why Lebron suddenly can operate more freely now than ever? |
Lebron QB the offense also averaging 25ppg/10apg in 50% shooting might help his case. |
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PRLakeShow Franchise Player
Joined: 07 Oct 2016 Posts: 10460
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 11:33 am Post subject: |
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miggz23 wrote: | moonriver24 wrote: | epak wrote: | moonriver24 wrote: | Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. |
Nope.
Giannis
LeBron
AD
Luka
Harden |
I do agree. But Davis should be next. Why? Is Lebron better because of Davis or Davis better because of Lebron? It is subjective. You may ask why Lebron suddenly can operate more freely now than ever? |
Lebron QB the offense also averaging 25ppg/10apg in 50% shooting might help his case. |
And AD leads our defense while putting up amazing offensive numbers. Do people discredit defense in MVP talks because there's a DPOY award? I'm always lost on these subjective awards that seem to change relevant criterias every couple of years or so. |
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danzag Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2013 Posts: 22475 Location: Brazil
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 11:44 am Post subject: |
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Giannis
LeBron
Doncic
Davis
Harden |
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55 Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Posts: 12092
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 11:49 am Post subject: |
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Lebron/AD - co mvp's. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144704 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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moonriver24 wrote: | epak wrote: | moonriver24 wrote: | Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. |
Nope.
Giannis
LeBron
AD
Luka
Harden |
I do agree. But Davis should be next. Why? Is Lebron better because of Davis or Davis better because of Lebron? It is subjective. You may ask why Lebron suddenly can operate more freely now than ever? |
Davis is better because of Lebron. Lebron can play that alpha role that Davis has struggled with. Though I am not sure how that will impact MVP votes, likely both players split those wanting to vote for a Laker. I am guessing that both get votes along with Giannis, Luka and Harden. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Runway8 Franchise Player
Joined: 19 Apr 2003 Posts: 22949 Location: La Jolla, San Diego
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:19 pm Post subject: |
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moonriver24 wrote: | Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. |
Not quite the same. Nash was a NOBODY. I mean he wasn't in the super-star discussion. He was borderline all-star with the Mavs. AD is a mega star and he's playing with the MJ of his time. So what I'm saying is that Nash got some of that underdog type votes.
Not only is AD expected to be a mega star, he plays with Lebron, so they are going to get points subtracted. It's unfair, but I don't see AD or Lebron winning MVP. Shaq and Kobe had the same issue when it comes to MVP. They ain't getting it cause they got each other. |
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ringfinger Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Posts: 29418
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Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | moonriver24 wrote: | epak wrote: | moonriver24 wrote: | Remember Nash? Lol. People gave him credit because he turned around the suns spectacularly? Well, if thats the criteria, then Davis is on the way to first MVP and second DPOY. Why? Because his presence makes it 21-3 possible.
So,
1. DAVIS
2. Giannis
3. Bron
4. Luka
5. Harden
But for some reasons I think people will think Giannis deserves most. Which to me a bit hard to debate. You see, both Davis and Giannis led their teams to playoffs and both eliminated in the conf finals. So, for Davis to get Lakers better with Bron and the gang is no brainer. It does not count as a "real" turnaround. Davis had done it before he joined LA. Meanwhile, Giannis does make the bucks better in real sense. |
Nope.
Giannis
LeBron
AD
Luka
Harden |
I do agree. But Davis should be next. Why? Is Lebron better because of Davis or Davis better because of Lebron? It is subjective. You may ask why Lebron suddenly can operate more freely now than ever? |
Davis is better because of Lebron. Lebron can play that alpha role that Davis has struggled with. Though I am not sure how that will impact MVP votes, likely both players split those wanting to vote for a Laker. I am guessing that both get votes along with Giannis, Luka and Harden. |
Yup. AD played with a pretty damn good PG in Jrue Holiday and had shooters around as well in Mirotic and Etwaun Moore. But he wasn’t this good.
That’s not to say Lebron doesn’t benefit from AD, he does, but AD has upped his game to a whole new level playing with Lebron. |
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