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J.C. Smith Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 12708
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 3:06 am Post subject: |
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I actually thought Sasha played a decent game. Surprised by the negative comments. I liked the way he was pushing the tempo. Didn't view him as a negative factor at all. He was a +13 on the night, which was second only to Radmanovic. |
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Vadorojo Star Player
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 1507
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 3:15 am Post subject: |
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limchrc wrote: | Happy we won... even if it's ugly. Thanks for recap. |
Agreed.
Special thanks to LALTACH for the videos. |
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KingKobe20 Franchise Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2006 Posts: 18738 Location: L.A County, 26 miles away from Staples Center
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 3:41 am Post subject: |
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It should of been a blowout. We should of never trailed.
Bynum should of kept his cool. Even if Oberto plays sissy defense like Bowen. Just quoting Ray Allen on the sissy "D" by Bowen . They do hold alot but to really call it sissy defense is sort of sissy
Kobe needs to work on the jumper. He just doesn't seem on point like the Kobe we all know. Maybe the sleve is holding his shots down. :roll:
All in All we got the win. A win is a WIN |
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Jeffs Retired Number
Joined: 17 Aug 2006 Posts: 25274
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 5:38 am Post subject: |
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jbjb wrote: | B_Rabbit1212 wrote: | my buddy, who's not a laker fan, but a veteran basketball player and has considerable knowledge of the game, had this to say about tonight game.
"sasha vujacic must take more shots per minute than anyone else in the nba. dude is ridiculous, there's not even a chance he passes the ball if he catches it. ..."
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Does that buddy of yours have any theories on how Sasha managed hit Vlade for that lay-up with out passing the ball? |
Hey, it IS Sasha. He could have just missed the basket that badly. I mean, the Lakers did end up getting two points that time Lamar threw the ball to the ref...
Okay, okay... I'm kidding.
Very ugly game last night, but I'd much rather them play sloppy against a depleted Spurs team than a full strength Warriors team looking for revenge. Bynum should be fresh for the game tomorrow, and I hope the Lakers don't come out as lethargic as they did tonight. _________________ Jeffs
I feel like I just watched someone TRULY give 100%. Not the BS I'm-gonna-give-a-110%-just-like-everyone-else-says platitudes, but someone that went until he just....broke. - GT |
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prisma8slg Star Player
Joined: 02 Jul 2005 Posts: 4664 Location: Michigan
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 5:56 am Post subject: |
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thanks DB
Quote: | Finally, he just lost his cool (LINK) and let a ref and Spur have it. Several Lakers tried to calm him down, but it was too late. |
and what I appreciate, is that when the second Tech was called the entire team started approaching the ref, not just Bynum. and what I really appreciated is how Kobe chased down the ref. made me feel like the team was connected. I was surprised that Kobe wasn't his with a T as well. _________________ "I define success by championships, by winning..." Kobe Bryant
"I've seen it all. Sasha dunked on somebody," Kobe Bryant said. "I'm ready to retire now." |
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targetman Star Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2004 Posts: 5503
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:03 am Post subject: |
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Sister Golden Hair wrote: | I almost can't stand watching Luke and Lamar these days. These guys rarely play with urgency and focus. Both seem to be sleepwalking at times. When they both play so unfocused, the team can be deadly to watch.
Question: how does one get to be a vet in the NBA and never learn how to shoot?
WHy does the Laker FO seem hell-bent on cornering the market on brick-laying SFs?
I hope and pray Ariza develops a jumper.
That is all.
SGH |
I could have written the above post. I just want to add that even if he can't shoot I am glad we have Ariza and not Cook. I'd love to get rid of Luke. Certainly there is another SF out there that can pass but not much else. _________________ Hope for the best. Prepare for the worst. |
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Mr. EiGhTy-OnE Star Player
Joined: 03 Nov 2004 Posts: 8272 Location: San Diego, CA
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:18 am Post subject: |
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PATHETIC WIN
(but a win is a win, i guess)
thanks DB and tach _________________ "When (Kobe) gets you on life support, he won't give you mouth to mouth. HE PULLS THE PLUG." -stu |
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mike_dee23 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 11703
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:24 am Post subject: |
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J.C. Smith wrote: | I actually thought Sasha played a decent game. Surprised by the negative comments. I liked the way he was pushing the tempo. Didn't view him as a negative factor at all. He was a +13 on the night, which was second only to Radmanovic. |
Dude will never win on LG. He's playing well. |
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LakerFan1972 Star Player
Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 3257
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:47 am Post subject: |
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great job DB
^ Sasha did a decent job tonight, but you are right ... he will never win on LG.
It was good to see Turiaf in the 4th quarter. He did a good job taking over for AB. That is the Ronny I want to see every game, energy and doing all the dirty work.
Ugly win, but it was a win. |
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20,000 Retired Number
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 30002 Location: Likely nowhere near you
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 7:00 am Post subject: |
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A win is a win, but this game told a lot about this team. Without their top two players, the Lakers barely squeaked by. To be a true contender, the Lakers should have blown them out.
But...on the other hand, that is still a great team. The refs let them get away with tons of calls, but they are still a good enough team to beat most anyone. Without their top two, they just didn't have enough fire power to go the full 48.
Even without Tony Parker, they still had plenty of paint penetration.
I think it boils down to this: proper knowledge of your role in the game. How often did the Spurs find the open man? They would pass the ball to where the next man was supposed to be. On defense, the Lakers were always leaving someone open, usually Bruce Bowen, and he made the Lakers pay. After a few buckets, you'd think the Lakers wouldn't leave him so wide open. Or Horry, or Finley, or whomever.
I agree that this was a horribly reffed game, but if the Lakers had played better it wouldn't have mattered. _________________ Courage doesn't always roar.
Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying...'I will try again tomorrow.' |
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Sage_10 Star Player
Joined: 24 Dec 2005 Posts: 6668
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 7:10 am Post subject: |
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I'm just glad they won. When I found out Duncan and Parker weren't playing I got worried the Lakers would bring their A game... which they didn't. _________________ "You Must Be Willing To Give Up That Which Can Be Lost In Order To Gain That Which Cannot Be Lost." - FORTUNE COOKIE |
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Dr. Laker Franchise Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2002 Posts: 17192
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:03 am Post subject: |
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mike_dee23 wrote: | J.C. Smith wrote: | I actually thought Sasha played a decent game. Surprised by the negative comments. I liked the way he was pushing the tempo. Didn't view him as a negative factor at all. He was a +13 on the night, which was second only to Radmanovic. |
Dude will never win on LG. He's playing well. |
Agreed. Sasha is plucky and - unlike many of his teammates - is not afraid to shoot the ball. _________________ On Lakersground, a concern troll is someone who is a fan of another team, but pretends to be a Lakers fan with "concerns". |
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Dr. Funkbot Star Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2001 Posts: 8188 Location: Eagle Rock
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:24 am Post subject: |
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encina1 wrote: | A win is a win, but this game told a lot about this team. Without their top two players, the Lakers barely squeaked by. To be a true contender, the Lakers should have blown them out.
But...on the other hand, that is still a great team. The refs let them get away with tons of calls, but they are still a good enough team to beat most anyone. Without their top two, they just didn't have enough fire power to go the full 48.
Even without Tony Parker, they still had plenty of paint penetration.
I think it boils down to this: proper knowledge of your role in the game. How often did the Spurs find the open man? They would pass the ball to where the next man was supposed to be. On defense, the Lakers were always leaving someone open, usually Bruce Bowen, and he made the Lakers pay. After a few buckets, you'd think the Lakers wouldn't leave him so wide open. Or Horry, or Finley, or whomever.
I agree that this was a horribly reffed game, but if the Lakers had played better it wouldn't have mattered. |
The ref's decided to make it close, we are lucky to win playing 5 on 8 even if TD and TP were not in there. A win is a win and I love putting another loss in the Spurs' loss column. Injuries!- cry me a river. They deserve every loss they get. _________________ R.I.P. Doc Buss |
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DzLaker Star Player
Joined: 13 Jul 2004 Posts: 1598 Location: Sacramento, CA
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:24 am Post subject: |
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B_Rabbit1212 wrote: | my buddy, who's not a laker fan, but a veteran basketball player and has considerable knowledge of the game, had this to say about tonight game.
"sasha vujacic must take more shots per minute than anyone else in the nba. dude is ridiculous, there's not even a chance he passes the ball if he catches it. talk about thinking he's got the green light. someones in a contract year, and i think he realizes he needs to put up numbers if he wants to stick around the nba for a few more years..."
on the overall, sloppy, ugly game, but we did what we had to do and thats get that W. also, is it weird that part of me was kinda stoked to see bynum get tossed? show a lil fire, big fella! |
As DB said, that green light in Sasha's head must be really bright. If you think about it, he must have the OK to shoot from Phil. We haven't seen the quick hook from Phil even when he shoots a lot nor have we seen Ariza at the SG. I think Phil likes the way the 2nd unit plays and Sasha helps spread the floor along with Farmar and Vlad. He and Vlad are the designated gunners.
Yesterday he was pretty good on the offensive end but pretty bad on D giving up penetration and 3's.
A quick Sasha note that I discovered looking at Laker stats about a week ago: (So info is a few games old...probably behind Ariza now too)
Vujacic is drawing FT attempts at the 2nd highest rate on the team behind only Kobe. He's attempting a FT every 6 min. on the floor. Kobe was at 4:30 min. and everyone else was at 8 min. +.....
So he's actually playing well and does more than shoot this year. But I don't expect a lot of opinion's to change on LG. In general, it's difficult for people to change their minds once they've classified or categorized something. |
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BigEvil Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 1755 Location: Whittier
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:36 am Post subject: |
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Ugly win, yes. But I must say, the Spurs got away with absolute murder.
I can deal with hard D, maybe getting a little slack for playing aggressively, but damn... where do you draw the line.
There's so much holding and elbowing and pulling and slapping. All you need is Vince McMahon and a steel chair and you got yourself a Wrestlemania.
What really got me the most was the perpetual off-arm clearing by the Spurs guards. I thought that was against the rules?
I'm going to look at this game as a good learning experience for this young Lakers team. Even though they won, they got schooled by the San Antonio vets. They got lulled into boring ball and almost fell to it. Bynum also should have learned a valuable lesson about the cerebral part of the game. He got played and he went off. I think he learns from it and doesn't fall for it again any time soon.
Clearly the bench is for real. I think 1/4 of the way in and still playing well even after trades and fiascos, I think you can declare that they're legit.
Finally, I've been a dogged support of LO for a while now. His one of only two Laker jerseys I own. But man, I'm starting to get disappointed in the guy. He just looks timid. He's not even passing very well. I think he needs a change of scenery. I think Lakers need to move him. I hate to say it, but it might be what's best for him and the Lakers. |
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Tanlentueux Star Player
Joined: 20 Jul 2005 Posts: 7169
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:36 am Post subject: |
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thanks my friend. love u man. |
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hi_ma Star Player
Joined: 28 Jan 2007 Posts: 7952 Location: watching Kobe /Pau duo.
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:41 am Post subject: |
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I was 100% fine with AB's actions. Kobe has been kicked out. shaq, everyone. Even TD. The kid showed aggression and I have to believe KAJ/Kobe/PJ have been in his ear over this brief layoff about power game and to start using his size to push guys around. Thats a new style that he will slowly but surely work around and figure out how he can add it to his finesse game.
We all knew that a shorthanded SAS team was going to give us problems. _________________
The lakers will get prince. |
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D-Dogg Star Player
Joined: 18 Feb 2003 Posts: 3448 Location: Phoenix
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:43 am Post subject: |
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J.C. Smith wrote: | I actually thought Sasha played a decent game. Surprised by the negative comments. I liked the way he was pushing the tempo. Didn't view him as a negative factor at all. He was a +13 on the night, which was second only to Radmanovic. |
Agreed. He's got the green light from phil to gun it, and it's what he does best.
He's shooting well and getting to the FT line, while being pesky. I don't get all the Sasha hate. _________________ 17 on the horizon. |
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RCS926 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Posts: 16824
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:50 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the write-up DB. Great stuff as usual. I must say though that this was the most disappointing win of the season, but I'll take it nonetheless. If anything, I was very disappointed in the frequent defensive lapses, which showed just how unfocused the team was as a whole. |
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brouk9 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Dec 2007 Posts: 316
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:01 am Post subject: |
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I didn't think it was a "bad" win at all. Yeah, the Spurs were missing Duncan and Parker, but these are still the Spurs. Popovich wasn't missing. They play with so much discipline on both ends that they are not going to be blown out, even without their stars. They are not going to forget to play the right way just because the stars are out. They pack the middle and make you take contested jump shots on offense, and they spread the floor on offense. I knew they were going to play us tough regardless of who was playing. I'll gladly take a W against the Spurs any day. |
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Freakout Franchise Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2001 Posts: 11796 Location: WV
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:15 am Post subject: |
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You know how it is being reffed when Vaughn is able to lower his shoulder into Fisher's chest a mid-court, almost knocking Derek down, and still not get whistled for it.
The white headed ref needs to be flogged. |
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Rick12322 Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 19164
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:34 am Post subject: |
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Socks wrote: | Anyone a lip reader? What was Bynum saying when he was tossed? I know there were some words that would be bleeped on this site. |
He said you dirty MF hypocrite, you let them get away with murder, he intiated that whole foul and you call it on me!? You sob I'm gonna kick your ass!
jk |
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Muad'Dib Star Player
Joined: 19 Sep 2004 Posts: 3903
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:42 am Post subject: |
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Anyone else see Drew push Manu (to the ground, it looked like) a couple of possessions before the one where he got the boot?
It was off of an LA miss, SA was pushing the ball up and as the camera panned R-to-L, I thought I saw Manu tangle himself up with Drew, and Bynum just pushed him to the floor.
That's what Manu complained to the ref about during the deadball at LA's end immediately preceeding Drew getting tangled up with Oberto--you can see him approach the ref in TACH's clip and say something to him.
5 seconds didn't pass after Manu's complaint before Drew was ejected. Funny stuff.
Also, how about Bowen dropping the knee into Odom's back at the end of the game after Ronny swatted him at the hoop and Lamar was on the floor calling a TO after securing the loose ball?
Those classy Spurs... |
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Alpha Moderator
Joined: 07 Jul 2002 Posts: 25155 Location: hawaii
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:23 am Post subject: |
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lol, i did see that (AB shoving Manu)... it looked like the kid was just fed up with all the "non-foul" contact that was being administered to him. When AB noticed Manu in his way (and iirc Manu was already falling) AB just shoved him like "get off me!" I thought it was funny as Manu was flabbergasted and the refs either didn't see it (which i think) or decided to let it go. I was thinking that if that happened to a Laker I would be pissed
Good to see AB getting upset and like BRabbit said, it was good to see Kobe fighting for him. |
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Klone_dd Star Player
Joined: 11 Mar 2002 Posts: 7330
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:40 am Post subject: |
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An ugly win still ends up in the plus column. The starters slept through the first 3 quarters. Luckily, the bench mob forced the tempo and pulled out the win.
Sasha, IMO, played well. 4-8, including some drives to the hoop. I was hoping to see more of Sasha vs Manu battle of annoying pests, but that didn't develop.
I liked how JoFar was vocal on the court. Is that a normal thing or just because he was miked?
Ronny really anchored the D well after Bynum was tossed.
Vlad was the NKPOG. More Vlad, less Luke/LO would have worked for me.
Prior to being tossed, Bynum seemed to be rushing things. They were trying to establish him early, but he sped through his moves like Kwame usually does.
LO still looks lost. He probably didn't make a shot beyond 6 feet. Plus he doinked a dunk, blew 2 layups and bricked FTs. Sheesh! |
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