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prisma8slg Star Player
Joined: 02 Jul 2005 Posts: 4664 Location: Michigan
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 5:38 am Post subject: |
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thanks DB. again, a very dramatic finish. I'm glad this game started a half-hour early, so I could get to bed before 1 _________________ "I define success by championships, by winning..." Kobe Bryant
"I've seen it all. Sasha dunked on somebody," Kobe Bryant said. "I'm ready to retire now." |
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8750 Star Player
Joined: 18 Jul 2003 Posts: 1591 Location: milan, italy
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:13 am Post subject: |
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the other players not stepping up for kobe didn't share the responsability is one of the greatest nonsense ever... first of all, they always could step up defensively, but you saw how bad our d was... then, it's not that they "barely touched the ball": lamar took fifteen shots, and i'm definitely not one of the lamar bashers here, but last night -when we needed him on an higher level- he was embarassing... the problem is that no one -not lamar, not walton, not kwame, not someone else- has the character and the will power to step up with some consistency...
this season kobe showed plentifully that he can play the team game: if this time he took so many shots, it's because the team definitely needed his dominance... |
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LongtimeLakerLover Starting Rotation
Joined: 08 Jun 2005 Posts: 785 Location: Murrieta, California
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:38 am Post subject: |
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I thought they looked like last years team. It was ridiculous. Hopefully they'll get into some sort of rythym soon. Kwame hasn't been seeing serious minutes, so he's working himself back, but oh my gosh, it was terrible to see him out there. I thought the second unit brought some movement and d for a while, and sure enough our lead expanded. I also thought they should have left Farmar in for the last quarter. Thought Phil yanked him too soon. It was ridiculous that Lamar just can't get it done. I'm not understanding what that's all about. Hopefully Mitch will be able to come up with a Big, a warm body that will help out until Drew and Chris are back. _________________ I love LA........WE LOVE IT! |
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Prometheus8 Star Player
Joined: 15 Oct 2002 Posts: 1851
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:51 am Post subject: |
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8750 wrote: | the other players not stepping up for kobe didn't share the responsability is one of the greatest nonsense ever... first of all, they always could step up defensively, but you saw how bad our d was... then, it's not that they "barely touched the ball": lamar took fifteen shots, and i'm definitely not one of the lamar bashers here, but last night -when we needed him on an higher level- he was embarassing... the problem is that no one -not lamar, not walton, not kwame, not someone else- has the character and the will power to step up with some consistency...
this season kobe showed plentifully that he can play the team game: if this time he took so many shots, it's because the team definitely needed his dominance... |
Word. If Kobe had taken half as many shots we would have lost by 10 points. Almost nobody else (only Farmar) was stepping up offensively. _________________ "Every time he got an offensive rebound, it was deflating," Hornets coach Monty Williams said ... "I thought Bynum decided the series. He was that good."
"...one of the most valuable players in the league…"– Phil Jackson about Ron Artest in 2005 |
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Texas_Pete Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 12825 Location: Somewhere watching a Laker game
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:58 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the write up DB!
Great game by Kobe although I think that 44 shots is too much against a bottom dweller like Seattle. I will give Kobe a pass on this one because it was the 2nd of a back-to-back, not having Kwame practice with the 1st team, and we got the W - so he took it upon himself to will us to a win. Otherwise, we are trying to develop trust in our young players - can't happen if Kobe shoots as much as he did.
I don't want this team to turn into the AI-lead 76ers until Drew returns. |
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targetman Star Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2004 Posts: 5503
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 7:13 am Post subject: |
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Koeb was just recently saying that with Drew in the middle he no longer has to score 35 points a game, so I don't think he's delighted to have to go back to that. I also disagree with the notion that giving Kwame, Luke, Fish, and Lamar more bricklaying practice within a tight game is a good thing for the team. Let them get some practice with this "new" team before they get comfortable with their "new" offensive opportunities.
Yes, Kobe shot too much, but is the clutch or is he clutch? He's been making some superb plays at the end of games lately and all I hear is whining about how he is hurting the fragile egos of the other players. Well, as Bette would say, Fasten your seatbelts boys, it's going to be a bumpy ride. _________________ Hope for the best. Prepare for the worst. |
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20,000 Retired Number
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 29999 Location: Likely nowhere near you
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 7:23 am Post subject: |
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jodeke wrote: | The Sonics are one the weakest teams in the NBA and we had trouble with them. If DFish and LO start to hit we will have somewhat of an eaiser time. Our main problem is defense. Someone has to become a stopper. Kwame has to be more assertive in the hole. It's Deja vu. Same thing same time last season. Are the basketball Gods angry with us? |
I fixed this for you. Your entire post need not be in bold.
But I kept one sentence in bold for my response: sometimes bad teams play good games. What do you want, for the Sonics to just lay down and give us the game? They are ashamed of playing so poorly. They want to win. They do not like losing. Even great teams lose every once in a while, and when they win, it does not have to be a blowout every time. A 30-point win against NO, great. This was not NO. Is our season over because we played a close game against the Sonics on the second night of a back-to-back having to travel from LA to Seattle without much rest and missing a potential All-Star center?
Yet, even with Seattle at their best, with the tired legs of the Lakers, with the poor offensive execution the Lakers showed, we still got the win. That's what matters. Not all wins are pretty, not all wins are easy. Just accept it, move on, rest up, and prepare for the game on Thursday. _________________ Courage doesn't always roar.
Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying...'I will try again tomorrow.' |
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20,000 Retired Number
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 29999 Location: Likely nowhere near you
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 7:37 am Post subject: |
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Hey, DB, last night on that regulation-tying 3-pointer by Durant, Ridnour obviously flailed his off arm and pushed Fisher away. I have been noticing that a lot this season, without any calls. Is Fish a good actor, or is that a more prevalent move this season among players? _________________ Courage doesn't always roar.
Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying...'I will try again tomorrow.' |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67998 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 7:49 am Post subject: |
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[quote="encina1"] jodeke wrote: | The Sonics are one the weakest teams in the NBA and we had trouble with them. If DFish and LO start to hit we will have somewhat of an eaiser time. Our main problem is defense. Someone has to become a stopper. Kwame has to be more assertive in the hole. It's Deja vu. Same thing same time last season. Are the basketball Gods angry with us? |
I fixed this for you. Your entire post need not be in bold.
But I kept one sentence in bold for my response: sometimes bad teams play good games. What do you want, for the Sonics to just lay down and give us the game? They are ashamed of playing so poorly. They want to win. They do not like losing. Even great teams lose every once in a while, and when they win, it does not have to be a blowout every time. A 30-point win against NO, great. This was not NO. Is our season over because we played a close game against the Sonics on the second night of a back-to-back having to travel from LA to Seattle without much rest and missing a potential All-Star center?
Yet, even with Seattle at their best, with the tired legs of the Lakers, with the poor offensive execution the Lakers showed, we still got the win. That's what matters. Not all wins are pretty, not all wins are easy. Just accept it, move on, rest up, and prepare for the game on Thursday.[/quote
Thank you for fixing it for me. I have a sight problem hence I type in bold for my benefit. I'm sorry if it's annoying to you. I don't expect anyone to lay down. That would be unprofessional. However the loss of Bynum affect was sorely obvious. The team as a whole played a off game. I hope it was because of the back to back though that's something I don't give much credence. Our season is no where near over, we're a good basketball team and will bounce back. We have two days to rest and prepare for Phoenix. I anxiously await the game. It'll go a long ways in showing just what we are without Andrew. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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Mr. EiGhTy-OnE Star Player
Joined: 03 Nov 2004 Posts: 8272 Location: San Diego, CA
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:09 am Post subject: |
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although im happy we won. im very uneasy about it. the way we struggled last night, might be a sign of things to come with AB out. I can't believe we made Collison look like an all-star. where was L.O.? doesnt he realize its time to step up and stop blowing easy layups? (and bricking 3's with the game on the line?
why did Phil keep taking Ariza out for Luke in the 4th and OT???
p.s. we are gonna miss the_shoes _________________ "When (Kobe) gets you on life support, he won't give you mouth to mouth. HE PULLS THE PLUG." -stu |
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LakerLanny Retired Number
Joined: 24 Oct 2001 Posts: 47606
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:12 am Post subject: |
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That's going to be a looooong 5 years waiting for Luke Walton's contract to expire. _________________ Love, Laker Lanny |
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RCS926 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Posts: 16824
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:52 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the great write-up DB. Kobe was Kobe although I was very uncomfortable with him taking so many shots. I realize that he had to in order for the Lakers to pull out a win, but nothing good can come from Kobe gunning like that game-in and game-out. I hope Kobe at least tries to let his teammates help him offensively. If they can’t step up, then he needs to do his thing. However, I’m praying that Kobe’s teammates recognize the need to step up and do so accordingly. There’s no doubt in my mind that Fish, Luke and Farmar are going to step up their games. However, we really need at least 2 bigs amongst LO, Kwame, Ronny and Vlad to significantly increase their production. The problem is that none of those guys come even close matching Drew’s defensive impact, which is where we’re really going to miss Drew. |
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20,000 Retired Number
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 29999 Location: Likely nowhere near you
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:56 am Post subject: |
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jodeke wrote: | encina1 wrote: | jodeke wrote: | The Sonics are one the weakest teams in the NBA and we had trouble with them. If DFish and LO start to hit we will have somewhat of an eaiser time. Our main problem is defense. Someone has to become a stopper. Kwame has to be more assertive in the hole. It's Deja vu. Same thing same time last season. Are the basketball Gods angry with us? |
I fixed this for you. Your entire post need not be in bold.
But I kept one sentence in bold for my response: sometimes bad teams play good games. What do you want, for the Sonics to just lay down and give us the game? They are ashamed of playing so poorly. They want to win. They do not like losing. Even great teams lose every once in a while, and when they win, it does not have to be a blowout every time. A 30-point win against NO, great. This was not NO. Is our season over because we played a close game against the Sonics on the second night of a back-to-back having to travel from LA to Seattle without much rest and missing a potential All-Star center?
Yet, even with Seattle at their best, with the tired legs of the Lakers, with the poor offensive execution the Lakers showed, we still got the win. That's what matters. Not all wins are pretty, not all wins are easy. Just accept it, move on, rest up, and prepare for the game on Thursday. |
Thank you for fixing it for me. I have a sight problem hence I type in bold for my benefit. I'm sorry if it's annoying to you. I don't expect anyone to lay down. That would be unprofessional. However the loss of Bynum affect was sorely obvious. The team as a whole played a off game. I hope it was because of the back to back though that's something I don't give much credence. Our season is no where near over, we're a good basketball team and will bounce back. We have two days to rest and prepare for Phoenix. I anxiously await the game. It'll go a long ways in showing just what we are without Andrew. |
Sorry, now don't I feel like an ass (if this is true). The bold doesn't bother me, I thought it was because you were REALLY trying to get your point across. If it is because of your eyesight, then please accept my apologies. And my apologies to other LG members for just assuming anything.
Anyways, my point was that it doesn't matter who they play, the other team is expected to bring it on any given night. Who would you pick in a 7-game series this year: Detroit or New York? Obviously Detroit, yet NY smacked them by 24 points the other night, keeping Detroit at a pitiful 65 points for the entire game.
So what I am trying to say is this: we had off night, they had an on night, yet we still came away with the win. _________________ Courage doesn't always roar.
Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying...'I will try again tomorrow.' |
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lakerican Star Player
Joined: 09 May 2005 Posts: 3793
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:58 am Post subject: |
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Thanks DB. One thing I will say which I think was not mentioned: We all really look very tired the last 3 minutes of regulation & overtime. We looked like MJ and the living dead, in the Thriller Video |
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Laker's Fan Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002 Posts: 12907
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:00 am Post subject: |
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DancingBarry wrote: | He gave him some space on a couple jumpers...and didn't he split that double team against Ariza? He was looking better than he actually is. He had one where Ariza was on top of him that he made, but the others were so-so D, I thought. |
D - I respectfully disagree. Wally was on F.I.R.E. for a stint there. Not even Bowen slows him down at that point in time (maybe Artest with an elbow to the ribs).
Lamar was obviously too tired to go down to the post (where he should have operated) late in the game. Collison always KILLS Lamar, a lot like Ely used to. LO needs a shot blocker behind him. He will not impress while Bynum is out.
The Lakers who will support Kobe in this time will be Fish, Farmar, Ariza and Ronny. We will need to find one more from Kwame, Radman, Luke or Critt (maybe Webber or PJ). _________________ Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67998 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:14 am Post subject: |
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[quote="encina1"][quote="jodeke"][quote="encina1"] jodeke wrote: |
Sorry, now don't I feel like an ass (if this is true). The bold doesn't bother me, I thought it was because you were REALLY trying to get your point across. If it is because of your eyesight, then please accept my apologies. And my apologies to other LG members for just assuming anything.
Anyways, my point was that it doesn't matter who they play, the other team is expected to bring it on any given night. Who would you pick in a 7-game series this year: Detroit or New York? Obviously Detroit, yet NY smacked them by 24 points the other night, keeping Detroit at a pitiful 65 points for the entire game.
So what I am trying to say is this: we had off night, they had an on night, yet we still came away with the win. |
[b]need to apologize, I wasn't offended. I understand your point. Of course I'd pick Detroit. I think we had a off night and Seattle performed at a higher level than the norm. My concern is how will the team, a young team, adjust to the loss of Andrew? _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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CorkyTomjanovich Star Player
Joined: 13 Dec 2004 Posts: 3486
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:19 am Post subject: |
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Wally was an all star at one time. He can get it going. I don't think Ariza or anyone would have made a difference on most of those shots.
Any idea why Fisher on back-to-back nights has overplayed a quick pg 40+ feet away from the basket? Both at crucial times. He was burned big time, giving each guard a clear path into the paint. Did I mention at a crucial time in the game? |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67998 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:30 am Post subject: |
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Basketball is more mental than most think. Ever played golf and shot in the eighties? I'll bet you were tired. Played the same game and shot in the hundreds and not so tired. Concentration.
I'm always amazed at how much drain concentration causes. Great ones can call it up on a nightly basis. MJ, Magic, Kobe and Larry just to name a few. I hope we can get it on in the next contest. How much we really have is going to be showcased. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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maddprophet Star Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2001 Posts: 1952 Location: Hotlanta
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:59 am Post subject: |
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man, the difference without a legit post presence was glaring.
i took for granted what drew was doin. just the ability to throw it in the post, and always have something positive and high % come of it.
now it's a roll of the dice each time we feed the post.
someone else must give us a post presence, even if only in spurts.
luke and lamar have the ability to have the offense run through them in the post for stretches. these 2 must step it up. _________________ Spark the ism, my expertism, is lyracism, my flow will take you over like I was hypnotism...so where's the lighter, to start the cypher.... |
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Tanlentueux Star Player
Joined: 20 Jul 2005 Posts: 7169
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:06 am Post subject: |
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thanks for the recap. i was shocked that the game was a close one. i couldn't believe it!!!!!! |
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Klone_dd Star Player
Joined: 11 Mar 2002 Posts: 7330
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:07 am Post subject: |
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Aside from Kobe and the young uns (JoFar & Critt), the rest of the team played like they were in mourning over Bynum's fate. The starters (sans Kobe) basically sucked, but the young uns put together some nice minutes to hold us together so that Kobe could close the deal.
44 shots is way, way too many, but if Luke and LO are having a clankfest, I'd rather have Kobe firing away, especially when he's shooting a high %-age. I've said that if Kobe is efficient, the Lakers will be tough to beat.
Kwame had a better-than-normal Kwame game with a modest double/double. Can't really expect more out of him, but how long will it be before other teams adjust to the Lakers without Bynum and say 'ok, Kwame, we'll let you try to beat us.'
JoFar showed a lot of poise out there. He's providing some real impact. Props to him. Critt, too. Against fast paced teams, he's going to be a key. Not sure how he'll fare against deliberate, veteran teams. |
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Scherm Star Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2001 Posts: 4158
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:12 am Post subject: |
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The game wasn't about who was taking shots -- it was about who had the mental toughness to refuse to allow the team to lose. That person was Kobe, who incidentally if people would watch him is working his ass off every single possession defensively too.
He wouldn't let them lose--it's going to help the whole team be stronger mentally than the team last year. |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67998 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:27 am Post subject: |
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Scherm wrote: | The game wasn't about who was taking shots -- it was about who had the mental toughness to refuse to allow the team to lose. That person was Kobe, who incidentally if people would watch him is working his ass off every single possession defensively too.
He wouldn't let them lose--it's going to help the whole team be stronger mentally than the team last year. |
Pleased to see someone giving kudos to Kobe instead of bashing. He had to take those shots. If he hadn't we would've posted a L. His work ethic should be contagious. I started the season disliking Kobe for his off season rants. I'm gaining a new respect for his professionalism. If Dfish, Walton and Odom don't pick it up I don't envy his position. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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J.C. Smith Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 12698
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:34 am Post subject: |
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Prometheus8 wrote: | Word. If Kobe had taken half as many shots we would have lost by 10 points. Almost nobody else (only Farmar) was stepping up offensively. |
Except for the a minute stretch when Kobe didn't shoot after coming back in in the fourth, he took over 54% of our shot attempts. Well over half. We were outscored by 10 points during those stretches.... In the rest of the game we outscored our opponents by 12, and Kobe didn't take a single shot (and wasn't on the court for all but two minutes and some change of it).
Noone doubts Kobe's willpower in a game like this, he was bringing it on both ends of the court. But he didn't play smart basketball, and he certainly didn't play team basketball. He needs his teammates, and to get the most of out them, he needs to let them have a slice of the pie. |
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Wolverine Star Player
Joined: 21 Mar 2004 Posts: 7846 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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J.C. Smith wrote: | Prometheus8 wrote: | Word. If Kobe had taken half as many shots we would have lost by 10 points. Almost nobody else (only Farmar) was stepping up offensively. |
Except for the a minute stretch when Kobe didn't shoot after coming back in in the fourth, he took over 54% of our shot attempts. Well over half. We were outscored by 10 points during those stretches.... In the rest of the game we outscored our opponents by 12, and Kobe didn't take a single shot (and wasn't on the court for all but two minutes and some change of it).
Noone doubts Kobe's willpower in a game like this, he was bringing it on both ends of the court. But he didn't play smart basketball, and he certainly didn't play team basketball. He needs his teammates, and to get the most of out them, he needs to let them have a slice of the pie. |
Kobe said after the game that he tried to read his team's state of mind and they seemed deflated after hearing the news about Bynum, not to mention they were playing a back-to-back game on the road after traveling the width of the country (LAX to SEA). He felt he HAD to take over the game for us to have any chance at winning. He gave up the ball twice to start OT and Luke missed both (open) shots. Kobe had to go against his inclination to play team ball last night, and I for one, am glad he did. |
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