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MJST Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014 Posts: 27015
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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Worse thing Vogel has done for him was constantly pair him with Kieff. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk |
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Mamba Mentality Star Player
Joined: 04 May 2017 Posts: 3078 Location: The Left Coast
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Posted: Fri May 07, 2021 6:38 am Post subject: |
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MJST wrote: | Worse thing Vogel has done for him was constantly pair him with Kieff. |
Yeah I am dumbfounded as to why this keeps happening. Trez is who he is. Wish he can spread the floor. He's a C trapped in a PF body. I really want to see how he does at guarding the opposing PF when a guy like AD or Gasol is there to help.
Vogel could've played with this idea last night. At this point he's just refusing to. _________________ “You can't be held captive by the fear of failure or the fear of what people may say.” - Kobe Bryant |
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RI Laker Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 7315
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Posted: Fri May 07, 2021 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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Whatever value Trez had is ruined. Vogel cut his balls off. There is always room for a hard worker like Trez (if he is put in a position to succeed). Sorry, but Frank ruined him. |
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LakerSD Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016 Posts: 23973
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Posted: Fri May 07, 2021 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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RI Laker wrote: | Whatever value Trez had is ruined. Vogel cut his balls off. There is always room for a hard worker like Trez (if he is put in a position to succeed). Sorry, but Frank ruined him. |
Vogel expects you to perform on the defensive end. Harrell has not improved one bit on that end to justify the playing time tbh. |
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RI Laker Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 7315
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Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 3:43 am Post subject: |
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LakerSD wrote: | RI Laker wrote: | Whatever value Trez had is ruined. Vogel cut his balls off. There is always room for a hard worker like Trez (if he is put in a position to succeed). Sorry, but Frank ruined him. |
Vogel expects you to perform on the defensive end. Harrell has not improved one bit on that end to justify the playing time tbh. |
I hear what you are saying, but its up to Frank to put him in an advantageous situation. We all know what skillset he brings as well as his limitations. I really think Frank has done him a disservice in regards to matchups (opposition) and pairings (who he runs the floor with). |
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LakerSD Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016 Posts: 23973
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Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 7:29 am Post subject: |
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RI Laker wrote: | LakerSD wrote: | RI Laker wrote: | Whatever value Trez had is ruined. Vogel cut his balls off. There is always room for a hard worker like Trez (if he is put in a position to succeed). Sorry, but Frank ruined him. |
Vogel expects you to perform on the defensive end. Harrell has not improved one bit on that end to justify the playing time tbh. |
I hear what you are saying, but its up to Frank to put him in an advantageous situation. We all know what skillset he brings as well as his limitations. I really think Frank has done him a disservice in regards to matchups (opposition) and pairings (who he runs the floor with). |
Yep, Vogel shares some of the blame too.
I just think Harrell is unplayable in the playoffs, particularly because he breaks the Lakers defensive scheme which on most nights is their 3rd star.
They took a shot that Vogel and Hollins could mold him into a good enough defender, but that has failed. Some players are just incapable of improving in a certain part of the game. That’s why they are role or bench players and for Harrell, his lack of defensive IQ makes him like the other 5s around the league who get played off the court and he’s certainly not playing the 4 for any significant minutes with AD and Lebron on this team. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 8:43 am Post subject: |
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I think Trezz has his moments offensively. Works hard there.
But defensively? Holy cow. Hands down. Slow to rotations. Misses rotations. Fakes that facial injury at least 1-2 times a game when he blows a coverage. Guards can go right at him at the rim.
I just don't get it. I wish he would transfer that energy he has on offense to defense. It must be infuriating as a defensive minded coach to see that if you're Vogel. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Lakerfan 4 Life Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Apr 2001 Posts: 16169
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Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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I want to see Trezz out there with Marc. I'm thinking he's quick enough to guard 4's and you have Marc can stretch the floor so you don't have to bigs clogging up the paint. But i've read that Trez is bad guarding the pick and rolls and that with both of them out there, would be bad rim protection. Would you guys think it's bad to have both out there on the court? |
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leking006 Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2018 Posts: 6460
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Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 6:33 pm Post subject: |
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Lakerfan 4 Life wrote: | I want to see Trezz out there with Marc. I'm thinking he's quick enough to guard 4's and you have Marc can stretch the floor so you don't have to bigs clogging up the paint. But i've read that Trez is bad guarding the pick and rolls and that with both of them out there, would be bad rim protection. Would you guys think it's bad to have both out there on the court? |
We will not know if Vogel won't even try it. |
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ocho Retired Number
Joined: 24 May 2005 Posts: 54295
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CamReddish Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015 Posts: 8265
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Posted: Mon May 24, 2021 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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He kind of sucks. He probably won't opt out. If he doesn't, does he have a no trade clause? _________________ Previously LBJ23 |
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Killer_Z Star Player
Joined: 25 Apr 2011 Posts: 5049
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Posted: Mon May 24, 2021 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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I am not a Trez hater (I actually really like him), but I am fairly surprised he even cracked the top 10 in voting. Wow. |
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leking006 Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2018 Posts: 6460
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Posted: Tue May 25, 2021 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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Bench his weakass ang Lakers will get their 18th ring. |
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matigol Starting Rotation
Joined: 18 Oct 2012 Posts: 664
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 4:05 am Post subject: |
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D-Rose would have deserved more _________________ White guy to white guy alley oop |
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lakersfan8 Star Player
Joined: 27 May 2014 Posts: 3038
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 5:09 am Post subject: |
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If he doesn't play much in this series, his role will only diminish in the next few rounds. Not sure what kind of contract offer he can get this offseason |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 6:27 am Post subject: |
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He may actually opt in?
Which team will be eager to pay him more than what he's due next year from the Lakers if he opts in? _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Laker's Fan Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002 Posts: 12951
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 7:14 am Post subject: |
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Still think one year at the mid level for a team that will probably trade you is below Trez’ market value. Someone will give him a few years in a deal. It would likely be a team with a PnR guard driven bench offense.
Atlanta, Charlotte, maybe Chicago if they don’t resign Markkanen all come to mind. |
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King Randle Star Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2014 Posts: 7324
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 9:30 am Post subject: |
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LakerSD wrote: | RI Laker wrote: | Whatever value Trez had is ruined. Vogel cut his balls off. There is always room for a hard worker like Trez (if he is put in a position to succeed). Sorry, but Frank ruined him. |
Vogel expects you to perform on the defensive end. Harrell has not improved one bit on that end to justify the playing time tbh. |
Absolutely true...a lot of people here said Trez was a replacement for Dwight and was much better...I would say Dwight was a better player and much more valuable to us for what we needed than Trez has been. |
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roger_federer Star Player
Joined: 01 Mar 2020 Posts: 3151
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 9:33 am Post subject: |
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any traditional center that joins Lakers will get his value go down by the end of the season. |
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alleyoop Star Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2018 Posts: 3915
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 9:56 am Post subject: |
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Trezz is opting in
I don't think it's a bad thing, he'll impact for us in the regular season in a very good way. We just need to find a Dwight-type C that can play solid minutes for us when needed. Use him and AD in the playoffs _________________ #18 next... |
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alleyoop Star Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2018 Posts: 3915
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 9:57 am Post subject: |
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MJST wrote: | Worse thing Vogel has done for him was constantly pair him with Kieff. |
+1
This has killed Trezz, he's most effective playing with AD _________________ #18 next... |
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wolfpaclaker Retired Number
Joined: 29 May 2002 Posts: 58526
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 9:58 am Post subject: |
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Thing with Trez, we want to play big, and want to look intimidating. Hard to achieve that with a 6 foot 7 small ball 5. If we advance, we will need Trez in some of these match ups. Not every team has an Ayton, or a CP3 to feed Ayton type big inside.
The Suns are a different team, they also do not have a 3 point shooting big, and play a traditional athletic big man, with a traditional PG that runs the show. We have to match up with them using size and to be able to disrupt what they do, and Trez is unlikely to achieve that.
Plus there is spacing issues. The thing I wanted from Trez and Dennis all season was to develop some 1-2 punch chemistry as leaders of the bench mob. Unfortunately it never happened. So now the best thing to do is simply play with defense first mindset, and allow Bron to run the 2nd unit.
Ideally though, we would have have developed a 3-5 minutes a half lineup that featured Trez and Dennis as a 1-2 punch, while AD and Bron rested. The lineup could have been very useful in the playoffs, especially when teams would be loading up to stop AD-Bron and our shooters were not making their looks. We literally have gotten NOTHING from our 2nd unit the last 2 games.
I am not saying Trez deserves big minutes but had we built a 2nd unit that could actually play well for short bursts, we would have been a better playoff team as a whole. As well, I think we will still try to develop some of that using THT and Trez, if we are able to advance. |
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alleyoop Star Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2018 Posts: 3915
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 10:24 am Post subject: |
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wolfpaclaker wrote: | Thing with Trez, we want to play big, and want to look intimidating. Hard to achieve that with a 6 foot 7 small ball 5. If we advance, we will need Trez in some of these match ups. Not every team has an Ayton, or a CP3 to feed Ayton type big inside.
The Suns are a different team, they also do not have a 3 point shooting big, and play a traditional athletic big man, with a traditional PG that runs the show. We have to match up with them using size and to be able to disrupt what they do, and Trez is unlikely to achieve that.
Plus there is spacing issues. The thing I wanted from Trez and Dennis all season was to develop some 1-2 punch chemistry as leaders of the bench mob. Unfortunately it never happened. So now the best thing to do is simply play with defense first mindset, and allow Bron to run the 2nd unit.
Ideally though, we would have have developed a 3-5 minutes a half lineup that featured Trez and Dennis as a 1-2 punch, while AD and Bron rested. The lineup could have been very useful in the playoffs, especially when teams would be loading up to stop AD-Bron and our shooters were not making their looks. We literally have gotten NOTHING from our 2nd unit the last 2 games.
I am not saying Trez deserves big minutes but had we built a 2nd unit that could actually play well for short bursts, we would have been a better playoff team as a whole. As well, I think we will still try to develop some of that using THT and Trez, if we are able to advance. |
Funnily enough, if the Clips end up overcoming their 0-2 deficit and advance to meet us in the WCF, that could be the matchup where we use Trezz to great effect, particularly if they keep giving Ibaka minimal minutes. Matching him up against Zubac I reckon would be food for Trezz. Unfortunately every other team in the West has a tall C that would likely make Trezz ineffective (Jokic, Gobert, Nurkic, to an extent Porzingis etc) _________________ #18 next... |
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leking006 Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2018 Posts: 6460
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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alleyoop wrote: | wolfpaclaker wrote: | Thing with Trez, we want to play big, and want to look intimidating. Hard to achieve that with a 6 foot 7 small ball 5. If we advance, we will need Trez in some of these match ups. Not every team has an Ayton, or a CP3 to feed Ayton type big inside.
The Suns are a different team, they also do not have a 3 point shooting big, and play a traditional athletic big man, with a traditional PG that runs the show. We have to match up with them using size and to be able to disrupt what they do, and Trez is unlikely to achieve that.
Plus there is spacing issues. The thing I wanted from Trez and Dennis all season was to develop some 1-2 punch chemistry as leaders of the bench mob. Unfortunately it never happened. So now the best thing to do is simply play with defense first mindset, and allow Bron to run the 2nd unit.
Ideally though, we would have have developed a 3-5 minutes a half lineup that featured Trez and Dennis as a 1-2 punch, while AD and Bron rested. The lineup could have been very useful in the playoffs, especially when teams would be loading up to stop AD-Bron and our shooters were not making their looks. We literally have gotten NOTHING from our 2nd unit the last 2 games.
I am not saying Trez deserves big minutes but had we built a 2nd unit that could actually play well for short bursts, we would have been a better playoff team as a whole. As well, I think we will still try to develop some of that using THT and Trez, if we are able to advance. |
Funnily enough, if the Clips end up overcoming their 0-2 deficit and advance to meet us in the WCF, that could be the matchup where we use Trezz to great effect, particularly if they keep giving Ibaka minimal minutes. Matching him up against Zubac I reckon would be food for Trezz. Unfortunately every other team in the West has a tall C that would likely make Trezz ineffective (Jokic, Gobert, Nurkic, to an extent Porzingis etc) |
Nope, even Net's claxton is scoring on trezz. Trezz can't guard nobody at center spot. |
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leking006 Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2018 Posts: 6460
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Posted: Wed May 26, 2021 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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alleyoop wrote: | Trezz is opting in
I don't think it's a bad thing, he'll impact for us in the regular season in a very good way. We just need to find a Dwight-type C that can play solid minutes for us when needed. Use him and AD in the playoffs |
Trezz is a liabilty at defensive end either as smallball C or not, that's a fact. |
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